I looked at the other thread... try to solder the connections if possible.
Butt-connectors can introduce too much resistance and cause problems. Keep
working on it eventually you will figure out what the problem is and you can
say to yourself that you saved a lot of money.
That is right! I forgot about that. Maybe this is why sometimes the
ECM is picking this
up and other times its not. What do you insulate connections with
after soldering? And
which kind of solder should I use?
I usually just use the generic solder from Radio Shack (64-004 which is
standard 60/40 solder for electronics) and a 100 watt gun from wal mart
(will be cheaper at wm). Slip over one of the wires a piece of shrink
tubing (also from Radio Shack) then twist the wires together. Carefully
heat the bare ends with the tip of the soldering gun while touching the wire
with the solder. When the wires get hot enough they will melt the solder
and the solder will wick into the wire. When both wires are coated with
lead just let cool and the straighten out; then cover with the shrink
tubing. Use a lighter to carefully heat the shrink tubing and you are done.
If you don't want to use the shrink tubing then just carefully wrap them
with electrical tape, which will work fine and will not be dangerous with
having an open flame near gasoline.....
Thanks for the info. I managed to solder a couple of connections this
afternoon. Didn't look at the wattage of the soldering iron, its one
those straight ones but it sure took a long time to get the wire
enough to solder, but I got it done.
I'd be interested to know where I could get some quick understanding,
[a laymans understanding], of the role electricity plays as far as
and these low voltages go, and why a butt connector creates too much
how that may affect the voltage capacity and why.
Honestly, it doesn't make much of a difference at all. Why would the factory
use crimp-on connectors(all the molex/weatherpak plugs)? People will
probably respond with answers 180degrees of my opinion. Well, that's the way
Butt connectors and other solderless connectors has received a bad rap
because more than half of the population out there that uses tham can't find
their asses with both hands. As a consequence, they're unsealed(no shrink
tube), poorly crimped on(improper tools), have a tendency to ruin wires(too
much crimp!), fall off, rot away...Etc. Etc.
If the right person is doing the job, a solderless connector serves the same
purpose and does almost as good of a job as soldering without the PITA that
soldering in an engine compartment can be. There's nothing worse, IMO, than
trying to position things just right in an engine compartment with the wind
blowing and cooling off your wires, Etc. BTDT, didn't even get the shirt.
I have a Weller made in the 70's. It's like a direct feed very high amperage
iron. Ridiculous amounts of heat(I have a nasty scar compliments of a
careless stepfather and a few beers in us).
Anywho, after you set everything up, and get prepared and positioned, and
solder it, you could be done already using a solderless connector and some
shrink-tubing. Don't get me wrong-soldering is the best way to do it, but
you can do the same quality job with crimp connectors-we're only talking
about 12V systems here, and if you're careful and know what you're doing you
won't run into trouble.
P.S.- Just looked at that link and I gotta say I hate solder guns. My last
weller was such a POS, never could heat worth a shit.
My weller solder station(cheapie, $30 from MCM) with variable heat is the
best Iron I've ever owned. I also like my Weller portasol butane unit,
though it can be a touch finnicky.
This is key. Problem is, butt connectors are cheap, proper crimping tools
are not. How many shade tree mechanics do you know that own a $120.00
True, at first anyway, until oxidation begins to work on the wires and
connector. Then resistance will rise and connection will become poor. This
doesn't happen with a soldered joint. This is why the supplier who makes our
harnesses not only crimps, but also solders butt connectors.
I'm not familiar with an airliner's wiring system, but I seriously doubt
that there are any unsoldered butt connectors in any critical systems. If
there were, that would explain a few things. :(
I guess it depends on your definition of *good*. We use PACKARD brand which
are available from about $40 on up to as much as you can afford. $120.00 is
the low end of the *good* crimpers that make four indentations with one
stroke. (like a factory crimp). Even these are not good enough for our
engineers who insist that we solder ALL butt joints and terminals that we
The wire will corrode IN the joint. Dissimilar metals.
So have I, but a well soldered joint is still better than one that is not.
Nope. But thanks for the information.
So you're saying that they build todays airliners' wiring systems using
1940s technology? During the war, I doubt that they expected those fighters
and bombers to have a very long life span. Most of us hope our vehicles( and
airliners ) will last longer than that.
Gary, I'm not trying to start a fight here, but I do firmly believe that
soldered is better than solder-less (even though solder-less is quicker and
I agree, there are times when soldering isn't practical. In those cases I
had to replace the entire harness. I'll bet your customers would love that.
BTW, I have a Weller butane fired soldering iron that is the cat's meow for
12ga and smaller, where igniting gasoline wouldn't be an issue. Handy as
Dave, it's interesting that you mention dissimilar metals as a source of
corrosion. I'll grant you that, but if you're soldering on a terminal to a
piece of wire...you're still using dissimilar metals-you have the solder,
the copper or steel wire, and then you have the terminal which are mostly
aluminum or steel.
Like Gary and I both said, if they were such a bad thing, automakers, jet
makers and makers in EVERY inductry wouldn't use them, and they all do.
If the right person is doing it, with the right tools, then there will never
be a problem with going solderless, and solder in lots of automotive cases
is serious overkill.
Who still solders when need be
Since there is very little current flowing in the TPS circuit, resistance
could actually be up to several tens of ohms without being a problem
OK, that sounds reasonable, I've always used 0.50 as a standard, but
whatever the booksays............
as I said above, the amount of current flowing in that circuit is very, very
small.....the ECM is supplying 5V to the 'top' of the TPS, 'bottom' is
ground potential, and the 'wiper' or variable terminal feeds a voltage back
to the ECM
since most sensor inputs show a very high (25,000 ohms or greater) 'input
impedance', any resistance up to 100 or so ohms anywhere in the TPS feed or
return circuit would make very little difference
resistance in the GROUND side could conceivably raise the minimum past
acceptable levels, however.
without trying to sound 'preachy', I'd suggest you find a good text on basic
DC circuits and go thru it...........you need to bone up on the basics of
voltage, current, and resistance, which will make understanding all your
above questions pretty simple.
try the public library, 'The Radio Amateur's Handbook', the late 50's to
early 70's editions had a really good chapter on 'Basic Electrical Circuits'
(the armed forces used this part of the Handbook as basic training material
for all radio operators and repairmen during WW-2)
DJ, I agree with Gary. I think you need to do a quick read on "Ohm's law".
It is the basis for the relationship between Voltage, Resistance and
Amperage(and much more, really).
P.S.- Just crimp the sucker :-]
I agree myself. Once a guy finds the graciousness to get started, as
guys have provided, and with the sure circumstance of time and money
me, I realize I should have studied this when I had the chance, in
Our teacher then was only 21 years old, and he couldn't very well
all boy class only 3-4 years younger than he, so he just went with the
of flunking us all.
I have already started to re-do all connections again. Soldering.
Its a pain in the ass
and I hardly have time to sleep, much less eat, before I have to be
back at work for
the man in the morning, but I've already spent almost 3K with numerous
on a truck I paid 28 hundred for and it still ain't right. When I
replaced the injectors
myself, it cured a lot of problem, and especially the black smoke that
so much. I'm beginning to figure out that what is wrong with my truck
is a combination
of maybe dozens of problems. Possibley compounded one little thing
I can't stand a poorly running machine. I'm not going to buy a
crimper just yet, I used
the end of a higher end stripper, it looked like it was made for it,
but I had to stand on
the SOB to crimp that connector. While I realized perfectionism can
sometimes be a
curse, and have had to take an engineer or two, down, on my floor, to
show them what
would not work in actual practice, I'm seeing the significance of both
sides of the arguement.
I'll surely let you know what soldering these has done for me and my
truck. Just one more
thing. I can tell you if I open the tape around the splices where
those pigtails for those injector
leads that go to the injectors is, and find them loose, or improperly
crimped, or not closed
from corrosion or moisture, there is going to be one more sore
"mechanic," in these parts,
cause I'll kick his hillbilly ass all the way back to Missouri.
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