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2002 TL-S VSC/ABS lights come on sometimes when car is started

Once in awhile, when my 2002 TL-S is restarted a couple of times (e.g., while shopping, stoping in a couple of stores) both the VSC and ABS dash lights stay on when the car is started. Turning the car off and then on again causes the lights to go out. This is very intermittent, and impossible to reproduce... The lights have never come on at any time other than when the car is started. When the lights aren't on, both systems seem to function fine.

An Acura dealer checked this when the lights were off, and didn't pick up any codes. Last week the lights came on and I was able to have the dealer's tech hook up the Acura analyzer while they were on - still no codes. The tech said the battery was a little weak and that if the cranking voltage was a little low it could confuse the computer. This seemed plausible enough - low voltage can cause digital logic to do strange things. So I went ahead and had the battery replaced. (BTW, it wasn't until I checked afterwards that I realized they should have prorated the price. They gave me a refund and a free oil change...)

The lights came on again, so the battery didn't help. I'm going to take the car in again to be checked out (they plan to get help from Acura in diagnosing the problem). However, does anyone have any ideas about what could be causing this? I don't want to spend more money trying things, like the battery I probably didn't need.

Also, the dealer wouldn't commint to whether ABS and VSC are covered by the drivetrain warranty (100K, the car was certified preowned). Any advice about that?

Thanks in advance, Martin

Reply to
Martin
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On my 2001, the TCS light would come on intermittently. It was a lot like you discribe. I had the brake oil changed, and the problem never came back. Coincidence?

Acura suggests changing the brake oil every 36 months.

Reply to
Humma Kavula

Thanks for the suggestion. I did have the brake fluid changed awhile back, per the36 months in the maintenance schedule. I didn't notice any change in this intermittent problem after that... Also, this is both the ABS and the VSC lights.

Did your light come on when the car was stared, or while driving?

Reply to
Martin

On Sun, 25 Sep 2005 20:34:08 -0400, Martin let slip this dark secret:

It would mostly just turn on while driving. I'd "reboot" the car and it would go away for a while. Another possibility with the TCS is tires. The TCS works by sampling the speed of each individual wheel. If one tire's circumference is different, due to a difference in wear or pressure for example, it could confuse the system. Well, anyway, it's a good theory!

Reply to
Humma Kavula

I don't think it's wheel speeds, etc. The VSA and ABS lights just don't go off when the car is started, before driving an inch...

Reply to
Martin

According to the manual for the 2000 TL, when both lights come on (on the

2000, its TCS & ABS) you should first diagnose the ABS problem. If the lights are on, there is a code stored. If you don't have a scanner, try your local AutoZone. In most places they will scan it for you free and get the code.
Reply to
E Meyer

The problem is that there are no codes stored...

On two occasions the lights have stayed on and I immediately took the car to the Acura dealer and they hooked up the fancy Acura analyzer that not only reads codes, but scans the car's barcode. Both times, even though the lights were on while the analyzer was hooked up, there were no codes in the computer.

So the question is, what can make the VSA and ABS lights stay on when the car is started (they only come on then, not while the car is being driven) without any codes being stored?

Restart>According to the manual for the 2000 TL, when both lights come on (on the

Reply to
Martin

I don't know what to tell you -- if the lights stay on, there should be a code.

Since the ABS is used to operate the other system, certain ABS faults can cause both lights to come on.

When the lights are on, their purpose is to alert you that those functions are not working.

Reply to
E Meyer

The age old story of should vs. is!

A sharp diagnostician with schematics of the VSA/ABS system should be able to figure it out.

I guess the answer is going to be to take it back to the dealer and then they can call Acura and a subject matter expert can walk them through the debug process...

The reason I'm trying to find an answer on my own is to avoid having to pay for bogus non-warranty items that aren't really related to the problem.

Reply to
Martin

If you want to try a cheap and easy long shot, a check for AC voltage across the battery (with a DVM) will rule out the possibility that noise from a bad alternator is driving those controllers wacky. With the engine running, a good alternator (and good battery) will read under 0.1 volt AC - usually a lot less. A bad alternator can read over a volt of AC... the last one I saw read something like 2 VAC. Needless to say, if the AC voltage is elevated it makes sense to try swapping the battery first, even though it is less likely :-)

In a similar vein, a quick wiggle of the ends of the engine ground strap to make sure it is making good connection is a good investment of your time.

Mike

Reply to
Michael Pardee

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