Buying new A4,330i, G35, CTS, C320

in the early 1990s, it's not new to them, and they obviously found the performance

AWD Audi's have bested Corvettes (C4s and C5s), BMWs, Vipers, and several other RWD

it's far from garbage look at old issues of C & D and you'll see that the

300ZX TT was the FASTEST Nissan produced, goggle is before the R34 it's just that you don't know where to look.

you do realize Sp Tour. is rallying on pavement, so it's in the same bag, come with a better circuit.

what have you brought up all you say is rallying this...Porc/Audi this...if you post your questions in a clean message I'll give you all the proof you need and shut you up for a while.

Reply to
Tha Ghee
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no not at all dummy they don't race in the rain. your the one that said weight doesn't matter only grip I was just pointing out your errors.

Reply to
Tha Ghee

so much money in treaded tires for wet weather?? Touring races and rallye races never occur in the rain either? Or IRL or Cart? YOU'RE A LIAR AND AN IDIOT.

dumbass I was talking about Nascar, not the other circuit, so your now the dumbest on the board.

Reply to
Tha Ghee

what's sad that I'm smarter then you, and have been showing you up at every turn??

you use the term "troll" but you don't use it in the correct context so try better.

Reply to
Tha Ghee

I'm glad you bought a new car. topic of the board, some here don't like me but I still like to give them a good fight. I guess I've come across the wrong way, but ow well.

as for this topic, if you look Stevie and his lady friend Michelle spout the same info all the time, rallying blah, Audi blah, & outside the US blah. I've proven my points over and over again but they seem to gloss over that and focus and GRAMMAR, but call it English. I'm working with them and it's a very slow process, I think it's the readers not the writer.

I'll have the results but I know for a fact, in 0-60 and emer. lane change the 330i not ix and G35 are rated higher. I think the braking is better in the AWD versions.

Reply to
Tha Ghee

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Secondly, in the C&D comparo, they said:> "Out on the twisty roads, the S4 quickly became the favorite. The firmRecaro

feel the tires scratching and straining for grip as the front and rear electronic

scoring the full 10 points in our handling rating, two above the M3 and three above the

compared to the RS6!!! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

the only way to have a intelligent conversation is to have it with myself you're not holding up your end of the argument. how do I lie goggle it dullard it's on the net for all to see. no you haven't they all have rallying roots or come from the same company, but I guess you can't figure this out.

what did I lie about, look how old that test is the C32 isn't even made anymore, are you this sad that you can't compare 04 models. This is sad Stevie it's 04 not 99-00 so come better, no you piss off.

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no Audi in this or last years top10 so come better, oh you can't.

if you look at the sentence it states that the E55 is the best performer of sedans, and the M3 is the best in the compact class. I know which ones compete against which one, I've pointed this out to you many times, but you don't read this. I've posted all the major car mags. website so you can try and do some reading. Goggle it pissant, so I don't have to keep doing it. the only article you have is from 4 YEARS ago, is that when you got to read the mag. when you spent time in the big house?? give me your email and I'll be happy to.

Reply to
Tha Ghee

I don't need anyone to back me up, it's in Black & White, if you and Mike didn't spend so much time on here and picked up a car mag. you would know this too, and the discussion would be over.

not all the time colleges offer 4 yr degrees also, they just don't have the variety that Univ. have, but you know that don't you. no you don't.

Not here in America dummy, there PSI pounds SQ inch, but I can tell you've never went to higher ed.

Reply to
Tha Ghee

Actually, no it isn't. I posted a URL to C&D's article comparing the M3 and S4 where they gave the S4 higher points for handling, and I even quoted the article.

Obviously you havn't taken your own advice. If you'd read these comparisons as you so avidly claimed to, you would've known the truth, which I had been procliaming and which several others have backed me up on.

This discussion could have and should have been over weeks ago. Sadly, I keep feeding you troll fodder and you're a complete imbecile who's obviously never had the practical experience to know any better.

Reply to
Steve Grauman

I never factored viewership into the equation except for to say that F1 isn't exactly pulling major viewership. You're far to attached to viewership; according to your logic, Nascar is the only series that should matter. Besides, you ignored all the wins in other race series I listed. They are all prestigious and all important to a real racing fan. But you're not really a racing fan, are you?

Ha! I'm sorry Ferrari is so narrow minded and scared of real competition that they've negelected the oppurtunity to compete in other arenas. Their racing record is a sad one compared to Audi/Porsche. You know they weren't at LeMans for years because of Porsche, right?

You're saying that F1 wins garner profits for Ferrari? Are you serious? You're talking about a manufacturer who's cheapest product pushes $100,000 and exports fewer than 1,500 cars a year. F1 does little or nothing to help their sales.

God damn, isn;t that the pot calling the kettle black! I've hit every "major" point of yours, while post after post you blatantly ignore my major points and then LIE to cover your ass. You're a serious loser.

Reply to
Steve Grauman

You're so full of shit. I nailed you to the cross on that posting, now DIE.

Please see the above statement.

You're the last person who should be calling anyone a dullard. I don't need to google the posts because I KNOW what was said. You're not only the liar, you're the minority, and the one arguing a minority point of view (however false it might be). The burden of proof is on YOU my little liar.

I listed products from Mitsubishi, Nissan, Subaru, Porsche, Audi and others. Please go back to the list and find how all of them are either the product of a single company or derived from rally cars.

This is the road test that you'd been lying about through dozens of posts. Now that I've shown the board your lies, your backpeddling in order to try and find a defense. This is the most recent comparison avaliable that includes the MB, BMW and Audi, and the newer model MB wasn't avaliable at the test. However, it's of little relevance because the S4 still scored 2 points higher than the M3 for handling and road holding, and it was ranked as the BEST of the group, not the easiest to drive as you originally spewed.

That test was from LATE 2003, and is the most recent where both the M3 and the S4 were togethor. Moron, did you read the article?

What?? Januray 2004:

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2004, 2 months ago!

No it doesn't! First off, the M3 and S4 were in the "middleweights" category, not "compacts" which was a lower rung comparison. Secondly, the Audi scored higher everywhere it mattered and won, it was the best! Here's the URL to the comparo, AGAIN:

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No you don't, you can't read.

You didn't link to jack shit you little loser.

It's from 2003 YOU DOLT. Read it! It's less than a year old you silly bastard.

It's in my postings, try READING.

Reply to
Steve Grauman

Liar, liar pants of fire. =P Asshole.

Reply to
Steve Grauman

Then post a URL. C&D's website doesn't have articles that old. You need to BRING PROOF.

This is the stupidest thing anyone has ever said to me. Congratulations on having no understanding whatsoever of anything at all.

My posts have been organized and clear. Yours are jumbled and difficult to read beyond being filled with lies and bullshit. You're DONE.

Reply to
Steve Grauman

If you could even read the posts before you write an answer, that would help. But it's clear that you can't.

- Yak

Reply to
Michael Burman

Why on earth would I pick up some BMW-advertising magazine, when instead I can go and drive one? I don't need magazines to form my own opinion, you know, with a driving license, you can also drive a car.

A college degree isn't compareable to University degree, you're forgetting that years don't mean you're equally educated. No, we don't have same kind of education system than you do, but even so I know a bit about your education system.

You'll get a lower degree from college than from university. It's meant for people who can't get to the university.

In other words, on your other post you're saying everyone else are stupid and you're smarter than us, but you couldn't get to the university? What kind of joke are you?

Check from headers where I'm posting this. And if you don't know how, here's a tip:

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Your posts really do backfire on you Tha Ghee.

- Yak

Reply to
Michael Burman

I'm looking at my copy of the January 2004 Car & Driver right now. The new Audi S4 is on the 2004 list. Look here.

The A4 made it in 2002. The A6 and TT made it in 2001 The A6 and TT made it in 2000 The A4 made it in 1998

Tha Ghee wrote on 3/20/04:

I'm a mechanical engineer (BSME, most of a MSME). It *is* possible to have agile handling and AWD at the same time. My car, an all wheel drive Subaru WRX wagon, made the C&D 10 best list in 2002 and 2003. I know it is very agile. The all wheel drive WRX STi is Road & Track's reader's choice car for 2004 (MSRP under US$100,000.) That car beat out the rear wheel drive Porsche GT3, BMW 5-series, Mazda RX-8, and Nissan

350Z, among others. While you may not like them, those cars aren't exactly known as floaty boats in the handling department.

All wheel drive vehicles can have very agile handling if that is what they are designed for. A 6000lb Ford Excursion SUV is not. A Subaru Outback is not. My WRX and some quattro Audi's are. An A6 2.8q is tuned more for comfort, while the 2.7T and 4.2 version are more agile. Same thing with the A4 line - cars without a sport package are made more for comfort than agility. That does not make it impossible to create an all wheel drive version that is tuned for agility. Look at the S4 or A4 S-line.

Car & Driver says the all wheel drive VW Golf R32 is a ready-made autocrosser right from the factory. It's not as fast in a straight line as, say, a STi is, but its handling is superb. It has the same drivetrain as the 3.2 TT quattro (but a different transmission in the US). A quote from the May 2004 issue: "recovery in quick transitions is instantaneous, the car changes direction like a mongoose sorting through a box of cobras" That sounds pretty agile to me. All wheel drive, when tuned for that purpose, can allow the driver get back on the power earlier in a curve than either front or wheel wheel drive can. All wheel drive cars are a bit heavier than equivalent two wheel drive versions - so they are incrementally slower in a straight line. And there can be a bit more friction in the powertrain. But neither of those things necessarily prevents a car from having agile handling. Extra weight is a detriment, but we're not talking about a thousand pound difference (the R32 is ~300lb heavier than a GTI VR6).

You can make a rear wheel drive car handle very well. You can make an all wheel drive car handle very well. Audi, Porsche, Subaru, Mitsubishi, and others have proven it's possible. I firmly believe if a car (of any drivetrain layout) doesn't handle well, or isn't agile, it's a matter of the engineers and accountants saying "no" rather than "can't".

Reply to
Byron

I already posted the URL for him twice. But he'll ignore it and claim it doesn't exist.

Not to degrade your degree, but you don't need to be an engineer to know this. You just need the capacity for logic, a mild understanding of weight distribution and suspension tuning, and some real world experience behind the wheel of various makes and models. Ghee has none of these things, so it's hard for him to understand. He's quite good at lying and fabricating stories though.

IMHO, it got elected for it's price point and because it's been driven by a much larger percentage of the population than the GT3. You might be interested in reading Sports Car magazines (April 04' issue I think) comparo between the Lancer Evolution RS (the lightweight version) Corvette Z06 and Carrera GT3. The GT3 won outright in terms of track dynamics and overall ability but it obviously losses to the Lancer when it comes to bang for the buck. I'm a little sad that Porsche won't be offering the Carrera GT3 RS here in North America though.

Ghee wouldn't. Assuming he's even actually old enough to drive (which is something I can't be sure of), his experience behind the wheel is lacking severly and it shows.

He won't understand this. Ghee thinks that AWD cars are all derived from Rally cars and that Touring and Rally are the same thing. He also cites F1 as his primary example for proof of RWD superiority and refuses to acknowledge the fact that BMW, Chevrolet, Dodge and various other RWD racers are losing to Quattro Audis in Speed's Touring series. He also claims that Ferrari history of racing is superior to Porsche's and Audi's histories, which is a blatant falsehood.

VW Vortex

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and "Sub Driven"
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did a comparison test in conjunction with one another of the R32, Lancer EVO and WRX STi. The R32 lagged in 0-60 tests but it was compareable on the track with better control and dynamics. They agreed that VW's tire choice for the R32 was poor, and that a tire upgrade would put it easily ahead of the Japanese cars thanks to it's more "track oriented" suspension. VF Engineering put togethor a supercharged version of the R32 (it was featured in European Car, I believe it was the November or December 2003 issue) that could pull off 0-60 in 3.2 seconds, and included suspension and drivetrain upgrades for a total cost of under $50k.

Reply to
Steve Grauman

oh big words, don't be mad cause you can't get over. I'm sorry you not smart enough to battle with me.

Reply to
Tha Ghee

just that you don't know where to look.

read beyond being filled with lies and bullshit. You're DONE.

I'll scan in some old issues of C & D so you know. no it's not dumb it's about the same circuit. no they haven't, well I guess it's not hard to make a concise statement when you make the same agreement over and over.

Reply to
Tha Ghee

are you serious as many dumb ass statements you've made, you have the nerve to post this??

Reply to
Tha Ghee

you're the minority, and the one arguing a minority point of view (however false it

However, it's of little relevance because the S4 still scored 2 points higher than the M3 for handling and road holding, and it was ranked as the BEST of the group, not the easiest to drive as you originally spewed.

the S4 were togethor. Moron, did you read the article?

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Januray, 2004, 2 months ago!>

of sedans, and the M3 is the best in the compact class.

scored higher everywhere it mattered and won, it was the best! Here's the URL to the comparo, AGAIN:

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you have yet to do anything, I'm killing you, step your argument up so I can have something to do. so since you have yet to prove a point I'm now in the minority, oh well go head and put up the white flag, I've proven you wrong over and over aging, just look at all the old post, like PT said I'm the champion. all the companies you listed have cars that are derived from lessons learned from rallying, and two are the same company. Like I said that's an old campro, how am I backpedaling, I've proved that the S4 was not compared to the best small sports sedans, so it can't be garnered best, just better than what's on the market now, and it barley bet the M3, if you look through all the stats it's a smidge ahead. OK, but it doesn't have the NEW MB yet so it's old. dumb dumb, you do realize that the M3 and S4 are compact by EPA standard, but I can tell you've never look at that guide. I can read better than you, I've pointed out the numerous times you've mis read. I didn't know if it was yours or your moms I wouldn't want to upset her knowing her sons a loser, and dumbass.

Reply to
Tha Ghee

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