Re: What I want vs. what the reality could support

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On Wed, 19 Jan 2011 09:44:44 -0800, "Jeff Strickland"

Ferrari made one.
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wrote:

That's 250cc per cylinder. I've had lawn mowers with bigger cylinders than that. Seems to me that a 2L V8 would need to turn lots of RPMs.
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Jeff Strickland wrote:

2L I6s & V6s are generally regarded as being too small for the number of cylinders; smooth but thirsty is the usual comment. A 2L V8 would be woeful and probably worse in every way than a 2L 4-pot.
--
Scott

Where are we going and why am I in this handbasket?
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That's what I was thinking when I asked if there was such a thing. I can't imagine why anybody would want such a thing. It would need to turn several thousand RPMs, which would make it very thirsty. I suppose it could go very fast, but as a common motor vehicle it would have to be very impractical.
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On Thu, 20 Jan 2011 11:56:20 -0800, "Jeff Strickland"

I think you're getting the point. Ferrari never did build everyday cars for people who are concerned about mpg or maintenance costs.
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"Ferrari: The Car That Sometimes Explodes" sounds like a great advertising slogan to me.
Or..... "Ferrari: It's Like a Fiat, Only Much Faster." --scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

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On Thu, 20 Jan 2011, Scott Dorsey wrote:

Flames Inside Again, Tony
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wrote:

That would be nearly be funny if it hadn't happened to a mates 5 series (fuse box area) the other day..
--
Z

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On Sat, 22 Jan 2011, Zathras wrote:

It happened to a lady acquaintance of mine at college, when smoke started coming from underneath the dash of her Sunbeam Alpine, while driving on an empty side road. She jumped out; still doing 20mph. Amazingly she was not injured, which was more than could be said for the car.
-s
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Ok, I guess i'd have to wait for 3 chamber wenkel to enter production then to reach or overtake the smoothness of a v8 :-)
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to make a lot of power -> something I do not crave. I'm thinking an I6 or an I7 turbodiesel from a truck line would have suited me ok, but i don't think those things are smooth and i don't like volvo at all; hence 740 is out of the picture
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wrote:

to make a lot of power -> something I do not crave. I'm thinking an I6 or an I7 turbodiesel from a truck line would have suited me ok, but i don't think those things are smooth and i don't like volvo at all; hence 740 is out of the picture
<JS> I don't get it. You are all over the ballpark. There is no such thing (for any practical reason) of a 2L V8. You can get a very nice 2.5L I6 and some very smooth 3L V6s. You can also get good 2L 4-cylinders. So, you can get smooth, and you can get 2L and you can get V8, but you can't get a smooth 2L V8.
Now, you have abandoned your dream list and switched gears to some monstrosity of a diesel that is not smooth and smells bad, and if you are in the USA, buying fuel is a challenge.
</JS>
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I am. I have narrowed it down to 325xi, A4 torsen and A6 torsen. Looks like bmw is out due to service consideration (see another posts). With audi the choice of engines is bewildering and 1.6 might not be easy to find. Hence am trying to get as many points of view on the engine part of the equation as possible. I guess I should stop crossposting to a.a.b but I somehow suspect you are on a.a.b side of things.

america better! leave!" :-) Diesel is plentiful and cheap around here but the quality is probably worse that in the states (and it used to be even worse before now from what i hear)
In silicon valley i saw no shortage of diesel pumps at the gas stations but i assume you are talking about rural areas. Still, I saw plenty of turbodiesel pickups while down there, they've got to get their juice somewhere.
Aside from the refineries not tuned for equal gas/diesel output the all american aversion to diesels stems from smell and rough idle or there is more to it than that?
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AD wrote:

Yes, there's also the poor performance. They were slow. Of course, in recent years that has changed some, and you can get them with decent levels of HP.
Even now, the low-spinning, "loads of torque down low and less up top" performance is undesirable, at least from my perspective.
Personally, I don't even care for the new gas turbo motors, where the fad (enabled by modern engine controls) is to give it a table-flat torque curve. I like to feel the torque rise with RPM (to a point).
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Much of the American aversion to diesels stems from public perception based on the horrible junk diesel engines that the American car manufacturers came up with in the seventies.
Some of these were really dreadful. There were reworked tractor engine designs with enormous amounts of inertia. And then there was the Oldsmobile engine that was a reworked gasoline engine block that was totally unable to handle the high compression it was asked to handle.
These cars were all just so awful that, decades later, Americans still won't even think about diesels.

Try one of the BMW diesels. They're not like you'd expect at all. However, BMW can't sell the damn things in the US because Americans won't buy diesels. --scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

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On 26 янв, 15:18, snipped-for-privacy@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) wrote:

because the big three tried to sell them tractors in disguise 30something years ago... it kind of makes sense
that and the pricing of the bmw 335d, unavailability of 330d, and the gearing of the refineries in the states which in turn could stem from the freeway- legal tractor sale fiasco of the 70s, let me know if the picture still misses any pieces
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stations do not sell diesel and only have gasoline pumps. For example, in my area, arguably the cheapest gas is usually found at Costco. Costco only sells regular and premium gasoline. No diesel. This lack of infrastructure, combined with the previously mentioned negative points - smelly, dirty, loud, slow - all combine to bias diesel gas.
However, that might be changing and the Euro car mfrs are leading the way. The latest diesel offerings from BMW, MB, Audi and VW are all coming out with fast, quiet and efficient diesel cars. That 335d is a sweet car. Too bad it doesn't have a manual tranny. Similarly, BMW offers a nice 1 Series 4 door hatchback in Europe with either a 2.0 liter(120d) or 2.3liter (123d) diesel that suppose to be the bomb. Alas, its not available in the US - how short sighted....
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That 335d is a

Actually, the 123d is a 2.0 litre
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Thanks, I didn't realize that a 2.0 liter twin turbo diesel could put out 295 ft-lb of torque! Good Luck!
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(Scott Dorsey) wrote:

coming out with fast, quiet and efficient diesel cars. That 335d is a sweet car. Too bad it doesn't have a manual tranny.
Well a manual transmission might have been desirable on a diesel when automatics were three speed, wasted lots of energy in the torque converter and you could get substantially better performance [and economy] out of a four or preferably five speed manual*.
Nowadays BMW autos are 6 or even 8 speed and for a diesel it will be a rare driver, if any, who could do better in a manual.
My first two 7 series were 5 speed manual, however they became rarer (735il only on E32) and then non existent (E38), so my last three have all been auto (4 speed, 5 speed switchable and now steptronic).
* my last two cars before BMW's were Rover SD1's. These both had excellent 5sp manuals. The auto was a rubbish 3sp unit, which thrashed the nuts out of the engine at speed [literally if you unwary] and in which top was the same ratio as 4th in the manual
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