Stock Car Racing.

On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 06:56:29 GMT, "DFC2" pee'd inna snow, the following:

X:Have you always wanted to be part of Stock Car Racing? X: X:Here is your chance. X: X:

X: X:For as little as $1.00 you can be a part of Stock Car Racing. X: SPAM factor aside (for the moment), the choice of newsgroups (and the participants therein) is not likely to be a target even remotely interested in having the "priveldge" of their name on a "stock car". Most in this crowd are of the opinion Real race cars don't have DOORS...

and:

N on A thletic S port C entered A round R ednecks

covers the pro guys.

HTH

Dr E-- mhm 17x1

Linux: Load it, Learn it, Love it.

And, since at least 1970, no NASCAR stock car has had them.

OTOH, IMHO, Randy Pobst's Audi *door-slammer* really *is* a race *car* while the things that the Schumacher Bros., et al. drive are little more than highly-developed and very expensive *karts*.

-- C.R. Krieger (Been there; done that)

Or should that be spelt "CART"? ;o)

At least /that's/ all proper British engineering :oP

NASCAR stock cars racing today is a misnomer. None of the cars raced are FWD like those sold by GM, Ford and Dodge. They are racing with RWD drive purpose built chassis. FWD cars were tried at Indy back in the late twenties. They killed a couple of drivers before outlawing FWD race cars. In the old days of NASCAR you took a car to a race and raced what ya brought. I remember driving to Florida with a friend in his

1953 Hudson Hornet and racing up the beach and down the main street of Daytona. Even then most were not stock in the true sense. Most were hopped up by the good old boys, cars that were used to haul moonshine. At least with factory parts on a stock chassis. ;)

mike hunt

Hairy >

On Tue, 20 Jan 2004 18:46:04 +0000, Hairy One Kenobi blathered thus:

Thereby rendering the "stock" car part a bit silly.

Bit different: Engineering refinement, and there's a lot more right turns involved...

WOO-HOO! My '67 Elan S3 is STILL quicker than 98% of cars on the road, and my '69 +2 has a drag coeficient lower than same 98%... Gotta love that Chapman fellow.

"Loads Of Trouble, Usually Serious" ;o)

If, like me, you're near Chapman's 5' 7" [170cm since decimalisation] then they can be an awful lot of fun. Plus you get to meet all sorts of people (often in RAC/AA uniforms) ;o)

A Seven (Lotus/Caterham/Westfield/whatever) can still put the wind up an awful lot of modern cars, particularly on the twist stuff. It can also do the same thing to the driver at (ahem) perfectly legal speeds if the oil line blows. The less said about that..

(Aside: anyone know if the kit bunch [can't remember the name] from the UK are still building monocoque Elan-shaped things? Or if that venture to build a non-Westfield 11 ever came to anything? Eleven. Mmm. Particularly with a non-A-series..)

H1K

I think you've misunderstood. I am one of the *last* people you'll find defending NASCAR (even though I own blocks of stock in two of the track-owning corporations - hey, somebody might as well be making money from this redneck fascination!). I merely pointed out that, for at least a generation, NASCAR's 'stock cars' have *not* had doors; therefore, while they certainly don't fit *any* rational definition of "stock", they actually

*do* fit almost anyone's definition of "race car".

You've just lost me. Or maybe I lost you before you wrote that. Are you under the impression that Pobst's Audi races on ovals? That karts only race on ovals? That I actually meant CART? [None of which is the case; I'm not that subtle. Mikey & Ralph just graduated to bigger, faster, more expensive

*karts*. Not that CART or IRL cars are a lot different to me. I'm a 'fendered car' *road* racing fan.]

Which, applied to UK production sedans up to about 10 years ago, is a contradiction in terms, isn't it?

-- C.R. Krieger (Got a Jag now ...)

You just answered the wrong person (and snipped the CART comment that made it make sense!).

The comment did, of course, refer to the British bits in a US racing series (the chassis and the engine, in most cases); Cosworth (ex-Lotus), Ilmor (ex-Cosworth, even pinched the naming convention), Lola, Reynard (now defunct, I believe?) and so on. You'll probably want to add a significant proportion of Rally and F1 scene to that as well..

Oh, and let's not forget the EBC pads & discs [rotors] that I'm about to fit to my Hungarian-built Audi.. ;o)

H1K

On Wed, 21 Jan 2004 00:54:55 -0000, "Hairy One Kenobi" pee'd inna snow, the following:

X:> >> > Most in this crowd are of the opinion Real race cars don't have X:DOORS... X:> >>

X:> >> And, since at least 1970, no NASCAR stock car has had them. X:> >>

X:> Thereby rendering the "stock" car part a bit silly. X:>

X:> >> OTOH, IMHO, Randy Pobst's Audi *door-slammer* really *is* a race *car* X:> > while X:> >> the things that the Schumacher Bros., et al. drive are little more than X:> >> highly-developed and very expensive *karts*. X:>

X:> Bit different: Engineering refinement, and there's a lot more right turns X:> involved... X:>

X:> >

X:> > Or should that be spelt "CART"? ;o) X:> >

X:> > At least /that's/ all proper British engineering :oP X:>

X:> WOO-HOO! My '67 Elan S3 is STILL quicker than 98% of cars on the road, and X:> my '69 +2 has a drag coeficient lower than same 98%... Gotta love that X:> Chapman fellow. X: X:"Loads Of Trouble, Usually Serious" ;o)

heh... as a Founding Father of "The Western Pennsylvania Lotus Mafia" (7 Elans in a ~small~ community!) we came up with: "Leaks Oil Terribly Under Stress."

X:If, like me, you're near Chapman's 5' 7" [170cm since decimalisation] then X:they can be an awful lot of fun. Plus you get to meet all sorts of people X:(often in RAC/AA uniforms) ;o)

5' 10" here, but no prob... but I'd be stunned to find RAC/AA uniforms inna "colonies." (But I've met plenty of State Troopers)

X:A Seven (Lotus/Caterham/Westfield/whatever) can still put the wind up an X:awful lot of modern cars, particularly on the twist stuff. It can also do X:the same thing to the driver at (ahem) perfectly legal speeds if the oil X:line blows. The less said about that..

A few years ago I cobbed together a TC 1600 for friends to stuff into a Seven for racing SCCA events. It was typically (for Lotus) quicker than it appeared. Great fun to watch the 'uninformed' gape as it worked its' way through a field of US domestics.

X:(Aside: anyone know if the kit bunch [can't remember the name] from the UK X:are still building monocoque Elan-shaped things? Or if that venture to build X:a non-Westfield 11 ever came to anything? Eleven. Mmm. Particularly with a X:non-A-series..)

No clue. Though I'd made a journey "back when" to look at a Westfield 11... bit disappointed, as it had a BMC 1100cc power-plant.

X: X:H1K X:

Dr E-- mhm 17x1

Linux: Load it, Learn it, Love it.

On Wed, 21 Jan 2004 09:35:33 -0600, "C.R. Krieger" pee'd inna snow, the following:

X:> >> > Most in this crowd are of the opinion Real race cars don't have X:DOORS... X:> >>

X:> >> And, since at least 1970, no NASCAR stock car has had them. X:> >>

X:> Thereby rendering the "stock" car part a bit silly. X: X:I think you've misunderstood. I am one of the *last* people you'll find X:defending NASCAR (even though I own blocks of stock in two of the X:track-owning corporations - hey, somebody might as well be making money from X:this redneck fascination!). I merely pointed out that, for at least a X:generation, NASCAR's 'stock cars' have *not* had doors; therefore, while X:they certainly don't fit *any* rational definition of "stock", they actually X:*do* fit almost anyone's definition of "race car".

Just takin' th' piss, mate ;-} I'm a diehard open wheel kinda guy. But I'm glad you've got yer finger inna tracks! It's an astoundingly lucrative venue (NASCAR). I would have never guessed.

X: X:> >> OTOH, IMHO, Randy Pobst's Audi *door-slammer* really *is* a race *car* X:> > while X:> >> the things that the Schumacher Bros., et al. drive are little more than X:> >> highly-developed and very expensive *karts*. X:>

X:> Bit different: Engineering refinement, and there's a lot more right turns X:> involved... X: X:You've just lost me. Or maybe I lost you before you wrote that. Are you X:under the impression that Pobst's Audi races on ovals? That karts only race X:on ovals? That I actually meant CART? [None of which is the case; I'm not X:that subtle. Mikey & Ralph just graduated to bigger, faster, more expensive X:*karts*. Not that CART or IRL cars are a lot different to me. I'm a X:'fendered car' *road* racing fan.]

I meant as compared to "stock cars"... Audi engineers fine equipment (I hold a training cert from Porsche-Audi ;-} and meant further that "real" racers have to negotiate left AND right turns.

X: X:> > At least /that's/ all proper British engineering :oP X: X:Which, applied to UK production sedans up to about 10 years ago, is a X:contradiction in terms, isn't it?

K. Duckworth did a production sedan?!?!

I WANT one!

(Don't bring up the 'VauxHaul' Viva, please.)

Dr E-- mhm 17x1

Linux: Load it, Learn it, Love it.

On Wed, 21 Jan 2004 16:44:51 -0000, "Hairy One Kenobi" pee'd inna snow, the following:

X:> > > At least /that's/ all proper British engineering :oP X:>

X:> Which, applied to UK production sedans up to about 10 years ago, is a X:> contradiction in terms, isn't it? X: X:You just answered the wrong person (and snipped the CART comment that made X:it make sense!). X: X:The comment did, of course, refer to the British bits in a US racing series X:(the chassis and the engine, in most cases); Cosworth (ex-Lotus), Ilmor X:(ex-Cosworth, even pinched the naming convention), Lola, Reynard (now X:defunct, I believe?) and so on. You'll probably want to add a significant X:proportion of Rally and F1 scene to that as well.. X: X:Oh, and let's not forget the EBC pads & discs [rotors] that I'm about to fit X:to my Hungarian-built Audi.. ;o) X: X:H1K X:

I'm caught out again.... MUST learn to read ahead.

Dr E-- mhm 17x1

Linux: Load it, Learn it, Love it.