BMW3 or MC C class

If this isn't a troll, I say drive the two cars you're interested in. IF you can't tell a difference - get the Mercedes!

No flame wars, no trolling! I have to get a diesel car and BMW 320 is 163HP and C220 is 136HP.

You've just answered your own question (and therefore saved us form pointing out how absolutely, excruciatingly s*1t all current MBs are). =)

That's rather a broad statement. I don't mind your stating that opinion, but there's not much factual about it...

Above all a Merc saloon has that sight at the end of the bonnet..

DAS

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Drive them both and get the one you prefer - that's what I did last year. epbrown

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The Mercedes C class pretty much has to be bought with an auto box for resale and to be drivable due to the awkward foot brake in place of hand brake. The Mercedes 220D engine is less powerfull and slower as you point out, but also rather noisey and agricultural. In my opinion this engine has no place in a compact exec. car. The Merc. has a silkier ride than the BMW but is not as sharp and fun to drive or as quiet and refined. Perhaps the Merc. is the nicer car to look at. Internal space is much the same between the two. The Merc. is a more expensive and lacks the build quality of older Mercs. and the current BMW. I spent my money on an E91 BMW 3 for the entertaining drive, the refinement and the more powerful and surprisingly (for a diesel) quite engine. Until the day that an auto box which does not degrade performance and fuel economy arrives, I will steer clear of them.

They have a new V-6 diesel out recently which is said to be a match for the BMW one.

"Awkward" my eye. I much prefer the foot-operated parking brake over the common 'hand brake'.

I agree about buying with auto, though. That's because the vast majority of Merc owners prefer auto. On top of that the Merc automatic gearboxes are pretty good.

DAS

For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling

That's very telling.

But doing a hill start on a manual? Unless you can heel and toe it?

Can't remember... it's a long time since my manual-shift W123... But I don't remember anything specially negative. Since then all the Mercs cars have been automatic.

:-) DAS

For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling

Oh, no. Here comes the dreaded "I use the parking brake to start out on hills" debate...

Out of (minor) curiosity, who makes the transmissions for Mercedes? They are not actually manufactured in-house are they?

PS- I already know who makes them for Lincoln Mercury ;-)

yeap... see, I knew this was coming.

What's your problem? We haven't done *that* one for *several* months.

Yes - they always have made their own. Manuals too IIRC. Their latest auto is a 7 speed - but one test I've read of it suggested it wasn't as good as the ZF 6 speed.

But Doki's from the UK so will know how to do hill starts correctly in a manual. ;-)

Indeed. Can hold it on the clutch till it burns out...

DAS

For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling