Stupid design decisions

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@davenoise.co.uk:

Ya. I see a two door sedan with a usable rear seat and trunk that is driver oriented. All functions should be dedicated to making the car better to drive. You could offer things like AC, but only as an option.

Bring the weight down to around 2200-2500lbs using modern composits or whatever and make the interior of very high quality. Maybe a bit of wood trim, leather -- make it reflect craftsmanship and quality, but without all the usual electronic crap. Let the radio have knobs, let the heater control be sliders. No LCD monitors or remote controls or any of that jaz.

Then put a high winding 4 banger in it pushing about 160-180 hp -- possibly put a turbo on it

Then market the car as a 'true drivers car' and charge 50k for it -- maybe call it an m2.

A lot of guys I know drop s14 engines into the 2002 .. thats exactly the kind of weight to power and cornering BMW should shoot for.

Reply to
z
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"John Carrier" wrote

I just have 3 other small keys on the same chain. They're not super-annoying, but I'd still prefer if they weren't dangling above my knee.

In my experience, an extractor removes just as much oil as traditional drainplug removal. Actually, I would have to keep the drainplug out for hours to get as much oil out as the extractor can pull out in 15 minutes or less.

I don't have any nasty stuff at the bottom - if I did, it would have clogged up my oil extractor tubing. The key is to get the oil warm (but not superhot) before extraction. If you have nasty stuff that's so stubborn that the extractor won't pick it up, then it will most likely not flow out on its own through the drainplug either, me thinks.

Pete

Reply to
Pete

...and this is clearly where BMW is hitting the sweet spot, since they seem to be selling all they can make. Having said that, my E46 might be my last bimmer based on price and BMW's continual march toward stuff I don't care about (or for) as standard features. With any luck it will last me a long time.

Run-flats with no spare I can understand, but with no spare tire *well* is a bit much. Electronics that fail too often with niggling consequences (things just stop working and the dealer has to update or reload the software). I won't even go into i-drive, which I am thankful I don't have, but I'd guess it will be standard on the next-generation 3er.

And BMW won't care as long as they are *still* selling all they can make. They probably shouldn't. A changing but growing customer demographic is not a bad thing if you own a business, after all. The real question is who if anyone will fill the void.

"It's not your father's BMW."

JRE

Reply to
JRE

Doesn't make sense. At some point the extractor starts sucking air as the sump level has reached the point where the extractors tube is no longer completely immersed in oil ... no more extraction. If that's a level a few mm above the bottom of the sump and you're happy with it good for you. Meanwhile the oil will continue to flow to the drain plug. Gravity is generally more reliable than suction.

I generally wait until the oil flow goes from a thin stream to a drip. I suspect that's long after any extractor is going to be pulling oil from the sump. And yes, I drive the car and drain oil that's quite hot from sump. (Oh, I can here the exclamations from somewhere that I'll induce thermal shock when I pour room temperature oil into the relatively warm/hot engine.)

My guess (admittedly, I haven't seen an extractor tube inserted into a sump with a window in it to see how deep it goes) is that the oil extractor doesn't begin to reach the scum that accumulates in the bottom couple mm of the engine. That's particularly true if you adhere to the oil service indicator.

OTOH, its far better than trusting the clowns at some speedy oil service drive-through.

R / John

Reply to
John Carrier

"John Carrier" wrote

Isn't it possible there are some crevaces in the oil pan that are below the drain plug level and therefore can't completely drain? I don't know. I'm just asking.

All I can say is that after I use the extractor, I can put in full 7 quarts of oil into my 530i to reach the full mark on the dipstick. The same if I let the drainplug out for a few hours. Not very scientific, but I'm happy with it. You will never take 100% of the oil out unless you take the engine apart and wipe all components dry anyway.

Yeah, even my specialized BMW mechanic couldn't do it right. I watched him do my oil change, and I will never let him do it again. He took the drainplug out. Let it drain for 5 minutes, then put the plug back in. Then he proceeded to open the oil filter compartment to replace the filter. At that point of course all the oil that was still trapped up there drained down to the oil pan... and of course staid there. As a result, he was only able to put it 6 and 1/4 quarts of new oil in before he reached the full mark. No thanks.

Pete

Reply to
Pete

There are two sets of oil sensors, Genius. And if they both fail, you get a message. OK? Would you like a dipstick for your gas tank?

And listen, door strips don't stop door dings anyway.

Why push-button start? Because it is next to impossible to hot wire the car.

I-Drive could be better, but it's really not very hard at all. Unless you can't run a computer.

Here's a solution for you: Don't buy a new BMW. And since all the other makes are copying BMW, you might want to just forego any new cars.

I know someone who has an '81 LeCar you might fancy. None of the weird BMW technology you hate, and an added plus to boot: A manual choke!

Now that's livin', right Sport?

Reply to
billbickel

I'm kind of thinking the same thing. I'm even thinking about a Caddy (!) for my next car. The upcoming CTS looks pretty good, on paper.

Reply to
dizzy

If you run out of gas, the car lives to drive another day. Oil? There are folks who like to run oil near max capacity and monitor its level and consumption regularly. You can't do that if all you have is a sensor and learn it's a quart down or more after the fact. OBTW, BMW sensors aren't the cars strong suit.

They stop a few. There's no defense against an SUV driver who throws a door open until something stops it. But given Toyota's and other manufacturer's styling direction, it would appear Bangle was right and most of the BMWCCA membership was wrong.

With the outgoing (E-39, E-46) coded key design it's next to impossible also. So you've got this lump that fits into dash OR you've got this lump in your pocket. And then you push a button.

A lot better. Audi seems capable of achieving "better."

Copying how? Bangle butts perhaps.

The trend in automobile design is toward more and more content. Sometimes that "more" winds up being less (active steering?). Sometimes the marque's interpretation of "more" is lame (BMW's trailing edge of technology Nav systems).

R / John

Reply to
John Carrier

None of the three BMWs I've owned have consumed appreciable quantities of oil. My present one never needs topping up between scheduled oil changes - it barely gets down halfway between marks on the dipstick. So you get to know how much a car uses. I'd rather still have a dipstick but I'm willing to bet the majority of owners never check their oil these days so a warning system is necessary. I'd guess in future it will also assess the quality of the oil to determine when it needs changing and this will provide a self test at each engine start up.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

Your point is a good one, particularly with regard to average owners and their inclinations toward raising the hood ("You mean there's an engine in there?"). While many bimmers are remarkably oil tight, the M cars can consume quite a bit of lubricant and consumption can vary depending on service (track, long downhill runs, etc). If the car is high mileage (pushing over 200K for BMW), oil consumption may increase (although in the US, many owners have turned in the lease car long before the car is even broken in). Some of us actually monitor such things in our automobiles, others just wait for the illumination of a light.

R / John

Reply to
John Carrier

Indeed. But do the latest generation of 'M' engines still consume a deal of oil but have no dipstick?

I'm old enough to remember dipsticks for gearbox and rear axle - and having to top up the battery every week. Things change - and to me the removal of the engine dipstick is simply to be expected. My main dealer claims not to use one when changing the oil - their machine simply dispenses the correct quantity for each engine.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

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Not to Dave specifically: So is blind trust given or earned? I don't believe in blind anything, nor unconditional love. Those are things people use to take advantage of others.

Bill in Omaha '86 535i

Reply to
Bill

Lots of cars look good on paper. It's only when you drive one can you tell if it's the one for you. Before buying my E46 in 2003, I test drove all the usual suspects and none of them even came close in terms of handling and interior ergonomics. It looks like ergonomics are out with the E90...that leaves the handling which is still supposedly the best in class.

Anoop

Reply to
anoop

Yeah, lots of us Bimmer owners can relate to that... 8)

When I test drove my 323, I thought "this car is absolutely F$*#ing perfect" in the way it drove. So lively, so compliant, so accurate, so fun!

Reply to
dizzy

I bet this "billbrickel" cretin is one of them right-wingers who has a "America: Love it or Leave it" bumper sticker. Too stupid to understand that there's a middle ground.

Reply to
dizzy

My motorcycle loves me unconditionally.

Reply to
Fred W

Love it or leave it middle ground? I guess that's hate it and stay?

Reply to
Fred W

Many years ago I read that if Merc engineers got their way -- knowing how most of their clients are (not) interested in what is under the bonnet -- the only gauges would be fuel and mph...

Nothing else is necessary

DAS

For direct replies replace nospam with schmetterling

Reply to
Dori A Schmetterling

Like the original Mini?

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

I can remember back in '74 the only dials in a merc were the speedo, temp, oil and fuel + idiot lights for Ign/batt charging and handbrake.

They had to liven things up to sell the cars against BMW, FORD OPEL/VAUXHALL etc.

Steve

Reply to
steve-caner

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