Isolating the Computer, ESC, and Distrib Module (continued)

I know that one and enjoy it as well! Gotta love JL Subs.................more SPL per watt than any other sub I've heard, and damn good, silky smooth bass. She's into the more modern country now, Shania, Faith, Martina Mc Bride, etc., and it sounds damn good on her system. Nothing like drowning out the ghetto thumpa' ricer beside you at a stop light with good ol' counrty music!

Doc

you need to remember economy of scale... if your do it all PROM costs GM just $1 more each... you've just cost them in excess of 10 million dollars. (GM sells about 400,000 new cars a MONTH in north america ALONE).

-Bret

Doc, I have to agree with you on the JLs. I use a dual voice coil 10" and the thing is great. The JL in combination with the Precision Power amps and active crossover, and the MB Quarts do a great job together. And, no, I have never grace my system with that ghetto tribal mating music you speak of.

Rita

Yeah, you're not kidding. There were times when I cursed the bastards for not giving me an extra inch of wire in the harness. Come to think of it, that 1" of wire probably cost GM 1/1000th of cent.

Rita

Possibly, but maybe not. Remember, most, if not all engines shared common sensors and components and the ECMs that had the MEMCALs are less than a

10-year span since the adoption of OBDII in the mid 90s. The largest piece of data held in the MEMCAL that would have the most variance is the Fuel Map, which relies on data from all the other common sensors. So, it would be possible for GM to write the code to service all models during that time period and load it on a 1M EPROM. The reason it's not done this way is that there are slight variations in vehicle specs or EPA mandates that might cause needed revisions to the program during a model year. It's easier and smarter to compartmentalize so that if any revisions are needed they will only affect a smaller sample. Plus, there were only a handful of different ECMs that were shared between all of GM's models. The biggest problem was hardware revisions and hardware additions that were added to the mix because of pollution control. But, I do agree with you that it doesn't make good sense to put all your eggs in one basket. Always keep it simple.

Yes, it's fascinating stuff. I still have my EPROM reader/writer and UV eraser buried in the basement when I used to play with these things in the early 90s. Thank goodness for modern nonvolatile flash memory. Now all you need is a cable, laptop, and the proper software.

I remember those days and how we used to brag about the awesome power that our computers had. Plus, you were the envy of everyone with your 3.5" 720K floppy since everyone else had 5.25" or cassette audiotape. Thanks for the offer of the picture, but I probably have it archived already.

Rita

How do you like the MB Quarts? What size are you running? Coax or Triax? I was looking into them on E-Bay a few months back but noone here carries them so I couldn't listen to them before I bought. E-Bay sellers usually don't offer a return policy if you don't like the way they sound!

Doc

They are awesome. I wouldn't use anything else. They are coaxial and the size is 5.25, I believe. I wouldn't recommend triax by any manufacturer, as they tend to be tinny, less accurate, and limit your control to get better imaging. Separate tweeters in the dash/pillar area compliment the coaxial and provide much better imaging. Keep in mind that I'm using an active crossover that provides a variable crossover point. I wouldn't use a passive crossover since you're limited to just a few selectable frequencies. The active crossover was expensive, but more than worth it. It's all personal taste and I have a good feeling that you would be highly satisfied with the MB Quarts.

Also, be careful buying speakers from eBay as most are factory refurbs or used. I would search the web to find your best deal. If you must buy them on eBay just set a price that you would be comfortable with if you got undesirable merchandise and stick to it. Don't get caught up in a bidding war.

Rita

Inline.....................

frequencies.

I've used Blaupunkt speakers exclusively for the past 4 years; best sound for the price IMHO. Used Alpine, Clarion and Infinity in the past and I think the Blau's sound better for way less $$$. I'm gunna look intothe MB Quarts as you're not the first person who's told me they really like them.

I've been an avid E-Bayer since E-Bay began and am familiar with the tricks of the trade. I buy all of my audio equipment from E-Bay and haven't had a sour experience yet. I have a few sellers who I deal with regularly so I know what I'm getting!

Doc

The Blaupunkts aren't too bad. It's all personal taste. I'm using a Blaupunkt head unit and it sounds great and I'm happy with it. I owned Alpine years back and I must say that it is nothing but overrated garbage. If you were looking for a more accurate sound I would say the MBs are the way to go. I'm really not into jazz or classical music, but I'll tell you that when I played a few sampler CDs I was really hooked with the awesome sound. It sounds like you're center stage, loud, crisp, clear, and no ear pain from distortion. You even have depth perception of the distance the instruments are away from you.

Yes, I did eBay for years myself, but it seems to be changing with a newer breed of scammers. I have no problem weeding them out. I just wasn't sure if you were a seasoned member. Let me know when you get them.

Rita

You don't have a 1988. I can't attest to the new body style. The real test is when your S10 is as old as your siera is now, will it still be rolling? :-) The engine in my S10 is godly, never fails. Anything electric attached to the truck is designed to break.

~KJ~

80's hair bands for me!

~KJ~

And Elliot, just go to the local flee market for your burner. I picked up a working one for 50c.

~KJ~

So they charge me $2 extra? Now they have made $10,000,000....

~KJ~

Well I'm back from the 650 miles of the Binghamton trip. Gave my daughter an Easter basket too.

I HAVE A NEW COMPUTER and IT WORKS!!!!!!!!!!!! It's a 1228062 from a 91 S-10 Blazer that had a 2.8L with Automatic,

4x4, A/C, and everything looked the same except the MAP sensor was mounted to the TBI rather than to the Air-Cleaner-Assembly. John, I would have gone for the 1227429 if I could have found one - I didn't. I believe the 1228062 is compatible only because I got it chips and all (the link you provided shows they use different base addresses for the PROMs - that's internal to the computers).

So finally it's running w/o the CES light on. Stopping it and reading for codes I only get the acceptable 12!!!. Running with the jumper it does go into the debug mode (flasshing according to rich/lean 02). Remaining bugs are that the idle is inconsistant RPM and the check gages light is on. The idle is probably from leaky vac lines (easy to fix - but hasn't yet been prioritized - will be soon). I believe the check gages light is either for the oil pressure or water temp gages (both of these could use new sending units).

I stopped at Harry's U Pull it in Hazelton on the way up, and found the 91 Blazer with the computer, a fan shroud, and some Vac hoses (all for the price of $2 admission + $22 for the parts). I thought of Doc cause I saw a guy there pulling a wagon (convenient). I asked on my way out if they had a yard-man and they said no (that was the only drawback - they did have a nice collection of vehicles). And I was reminded of the lacking value of my Truck on the way out where they had several vehicles for sale including a late 80's Blazer 4x4 for $1200.

Later, at Gary's I got a dust-cover for the torque converter (though the S-10 had a 4.3 - so I may need to modify to it if it doesn't fit perfectly). That cost a whole $7 + $10 for the yard man to cut the front Y pipe out of the way. They had other blazers and S-10s so had I had more time I may have found it all there too. The big advantage of Gary's was the yard-man. They had 2 of them there Saturday - driving modified Ice Cream trucks for their yard-vehicles. Plug: see

Elliott

John Alt wrote:

Rita, Thanks for answering the PROM questions better than I did. NG, 'Good' engineering involves a "design to cost" theoretical approach using typically a 10% rule of thumb for 'extras'. For autos (high volume), the 10% rule of thumb could be reduced to 1%, but less is just bad engineering practice. The 'extras' are typically features that make production and maintinance easier - and thus reduce the Life Cycle Costs. Buit In Test feature are the most common. The PROM size and vehcles covered (prior discussions) are another type that fit the 'extras' category. Most engineers have seen shortcuts that cost and cost and cost. For example, I worked on an prototyped Radar system that was built without any self test features (a managment decision). Every demonstration that was given involved hours of engineering time on the customer's site to debug the basic wiring. Had the 'extra' built in test features been included with the

1st design, those costs would not have occurred aga>

Most OBDII compliant vehicles are set up with EEPROMS already, They are flashed with the correct code to match the vehicles options as one of the last steps before they are shipped out the door of the factory. 99 percent of the devices sold to "Improve" vehicles today (power programmer, Add on boxes) only control the engine/trans at close to WOT. That way they can still say it will not screw up your emissions control equipment. Say you buy a 2000 Dodge Caravan and don't like the way the trans shifts. You can go to a dealer (or a trans shop with the correct tools) and reprogram the controller to give you higher line pressure or different shift RPM levels. Same with a LOT of 1998/9 and up vehicles made in the U.S. The engine code can be altered for more performance (within limits, due to mechanical parts differences) simply by plugging in a computer to the OBD2 port. BUT if YOU alter the code and it causes problems the manufacturer is going to tell you it's your problem. Making things difficult to service depends on what your talking about. I can think of nothing on my wifes 94 S Series that is really difficult to service IF YOU BUY THE PROPER TOOLS. No crescent wrenches and hammers. The only thing I can really say was a bad idea from a service point is one spark plug because it is behind the steering shaft. I bought a compound swivel spark plug socket and solved that problem, and gained a tool that made the rest easier to change as well. As for the computer controls IF you know how to read the codes and troubleshoot intelligently it is a LOT easier than the old days. If you plug in a scanner and don't have a clue you end up spending a lot of time chasing the wrong things.