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97 Concorde no start

I've got an interesting problem with my '97 Chrysler Concorde (3.5L), in case you've been following the news it's COLD up here in the northeast, and ever since I've gotten this car it's been very hard to start in the cold, and the colder it gets the more trouble I have starting it (like it doesn't want to fire) until a day like this morning when it was near zero, it just won't start at all. As it cranks it feels like it fires a few times, but not enought to start it. I'm not sure if it's too flooded to fire or it's not firing. Later (once it warms up outside) it will eventually start, missing, stinking like an old lawnmower, and running awful for 5-10 secs. until it levels out. Then it will be fine and never repeat itself until the weather is cold enough. It starts and runs great all summer. Two dealers and an independent garage can't find the cause. They think it's a sensor, but which one they don't know, maybe crank, maybe coolant temperature. The problem leaves no trace in the computer's diagnostic logs. Something's certainly out of whack because when I filled up this week I managed to pull a remarkable 12 miles per gallon in the last tank.

Has anyone had this kind of problem? If someone can lead me in the right direction I'd be appreciative. It's not like this car is in bad condition, I take good care of it and can practically eat off the engine, and I intend to keep it for a while yet, but it's done this since the day I bought it used a few years ago and every mechanic is stumped. I'm tired of bumming rides with co-workers and friends to get around.

Thanx... Matt

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Matt
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Pull the codes and see if that gives a clue. Also, if I remember my owners manual correctly, isn't starting with the accelerator pedal held partway down recommended below a certain temperature? (whatever it is, I've never had my wife's 93 in temperatures cold enough to bother). Even if its not, give that a try and see if it fires up. Might save you some misery while you track down the problem.

Matt wrote:

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Steve

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mic canic

In the owners manual it stated that you want to press the throttle fully for a cold start condition when the temp is below 0f. You might try that when it does it next. Also, the 12mpg thing sucks. My 3.5 LHS never got below 21 even in frigid temps. Something is running rich. Sorry, can't help more with that unless you can get some more info.

Steve m..

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Steve m...

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Lurker

Thanks for the fast replies... here some more info for your posts.

I tried for codes, there are none in the computer. When the problem goes away it leaves no sign it was ever there. Every sensor on the car I can read is within spec, and the dealer and the independent shop concur.

Pressing the gas part way or completely makes no difference when it decides not to start. When it's warmer outside and it's giving hard starts it does help to hit the gas a little and gets it going. However when it's just at the boundary between when it's hard to start and when it won't start, it'll race when it starts even without my foot on the gas at all, not badly but it will run up to 1500-1800 RPM for a few seconds and slowly come back down.

The fuel system and pump appears to be working, because it's certainly getting gas when it's not starting, too many tries to start it and it floods out. Last time I had it in for a check for this problem they claimed the fuel system was good. I know it runs horribly rich when its cold outside and the engine's cold, the exhaust smells like it's too heavy on fuel and it's a dog until it warms up (granted I go real easy on it but there's a noticable loss in low end torque when it's cold).

Outside of that she's fine, the idle's a little rough (every couple of seconds the engine kind of 'twitches') and there's a faint flutter (slight dip in power for a second) under moderate acceleration below 3k rpm, but always starts and never gives me any sign of trouble. I figured I needed a tuneup to smooth that out. If my coolant temperature sensor was really out of whack wouldn't I see it on the temp gauge or does that gauge read from a different sensor? I've tried scanning it when it's running right and the temp after a 20 minute highway drive in cold weather then a few minutes of idling was in the mid 100 degree range which sounds about right.

Thanks for the help, you've been much more useful then the local dealer.

-Matt

Matt wrote:

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Matt

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