air bag injuries due to propellant chemicals

Yes, of course. Sodium Azide and its combustion products are injurious to human beings. Why do you ask?

i have recently found out that air bags cause respiratory problems with their chemicals. the safety and auto industry knows this, but have determined the benefits outweigh the risks. i am wanting to find out how i can help, what i can do as an individual. i have read awful stories of people who have been injured physically due to impact with the airbags (brain damage, death, impairments of limbs and burns on faces, and eyes that have actually had the air bag wrap around them and cause tremendous injuries). the auto safety and auto industry admit these types of injuries (risk vs benefit)... But being a "little person" with limited resources, limited knowledge, i want to make these large companies admit the respiratory injuries that these chemicals cause and compensate those who have these types of injuries. i do not like the statements made that the benefits of the air bags outweigh the risks... ask a person who has been injured if they think it is worth it... i read on the internet that the warning labels for chemical exposure is on the underside of the already deployed air bag. i guess you can get away with anything these days, if you put a warning label on anything, even if you can't find it...

i am sorry, i have to get down off my soap box now and send this message, so that i can await your reply...

thanks, l> >

Hell, yes! And seat belts crack ribs. And that damned roof cracks your skull when you roll over three times and the roof caves in. Lets just have a seat with no doors, shall we. And another thing -- those baby seats give my kids a sore neck when the ride in them and fall asleep. I've never been in an accident with my kids in the car! Why should my kids have to ride in those uncomfortable seats??

Cars are dangerous. Crashing hurts. Crashing at high speed really, really hurts!!!

Sometimes the cure hurts a few a little bit. But it saves most people that have to use it.

In the "eyes wrapped in airbag" example, trade "airbag" for "steering wheel" or "dashboard" and we don't have to worry about your eyes because it will be closed-casket anyway.

Dan

please do not belittle my concern. i understand the problems associated with getting in to a car.. the guy next to me could have had a bit too much to drink and crash in to me and my casket will have to be closed...i am informed about these things you mention, but i am mad as hell about not being properly informed about the chemical hazards associated with the deployment of the "life saving" apparatus'.

thanks you for your cute email.. i hope you have a great day...

l> l>

In case you are referrng to leaks while just driving along, there aren't any.

As regards gas poisoning on air bag deployment, I am not aware of any reports, nor of any long-term effects. Could be that the survivors are so grateful to be alive that they don't care about a brief respiratory annoyance, which they might not notice anyway if they are otherwise injured.

I don't think people may necessarily "belittle" your concern, but it has to be seen in context.

Do you have contrary information?

Certainly air bags have given rise to new types of injury, or at least changed the injury profile in car accidents. Two 'common' ones are whiplash and skin burn (from the bag fabric rubbing against skin).. and so? Give me these any day...

I think the impression is that you wish to make a mountain out of an anthill (well, so long as it isn't higher than a couple of mm.

So, once again, do you have any info to support your worry?

DAS

This has been known for decades.

...except that they don't. Even using NHTSA's most grossly overstated "saved" numbers and most grossly understated "cost" and "injured" numbers, airbags as implemented in North America flunk any cost/benefit or benefit/drawback analysis.

Not a damned thing. NHTSA does what it wants; most North American auto safety and equipment regulations are based more on politics than on science, and what science is used is highly selective. Doesn't matter whether we're talking about airbags or headlamps or tires or brakes or fuel tanks or whatever, the pattern is the same clear across the board. Virtually the entire rest of the world subscribes to an alternate auto safety regulation set (ECE). The US is NOT first/best/lowest in the world for deaths per vehicle mile travelled; we are 16th. The US is NOT first/best/lowest in the world for deaths per vehicle registered; we are

10th. ( ). Nevertheless, US regulators continue to publicly claim that US cars are the safest in the world, and privately deride the stupid rest of the world for not acceding to US regulations.

And I want to make these large companies admit US lighting standards are 3 decades behind the rest of the world. I also want a great big house in the middle of the forest in BC. And a zillion dollars.

I don't like being lied to either, especially when the lie is so baldfaced and easily disproven.

DS

Christ, here we go again with another true-believer airbag freak who hasn't looked at the actual numbers, hasn't seen that statistically one is safer with a 3-point belt and NO airbag than one is with a 3-point belt AND an airbag, but nevertheless he's absolutely sure that airbatgs are the "cure".

_I_ sure as hell noticed it. It was pretty bad, even given the open area of my Miata. And the airbag did me no good, contacting only my right arm (scraping it) while my seat belt kept the rest of my body from contacting it.

Against nothing at all? Why?

i really have heard of people with major difficulites from the chemical hazards (Sodium Azide, Nitrogen, phosgene) associated with air bags. and if those "airbags are the cure" folks would kindly look at the link i provided above (Federal Register / Vol. 60,November 9, 1995 / Proposed Rules) you will see that they do not talk about any respiratory illnessess associated with the dangerous chemicals. Please also check

and do a simple search on air bags, and no where will you find any mention of respiratory illnesses associated with the chemical hazards. Please check your MSDS (Material Safety Data Sheet) for each of these chemicals and see if you think that "the cure hurts a few a little bit".. Just pray to whatever entity you pray to that you are never inflicted with this type of injury. I am assuming that some would prefer a closed casket rather than a respiratory illness to live with a long time... please forgive my harshness, but i am new at this and i am in the process of researching this and would appreciate information that is useful and not blatantly disregarding my honest approaches at trying to help ALL.

l> >

As usual, Dori, you are commenting without knowing what the hell you're talking about. You live in a country that has ECE-spec airbags, which have a much higher vehicle speed deployment threshold and are much smaller and slower, therefore far less capable of inflicting injury, because they are designed around the assumption of a BELTED occupant. In North America, airbags are legally required by Motor Vehicle Safety Standard 208 to be calibrated so as to "save" an UNBELTED 50th-percentile "male" dummy.

DS

decades ago all i cared about was what i looked like, and what party i was going to ... :-)

i have talked to people who say that even people who work in the industries won't make comments because they are in fear. they have signed waivers, etc. i also have heard that auto companies have made settlements to keep these out of the public eye.

then what can be done? talking to senators, representatives? find lawyers who would litigate these matters? find people who are injured and have them go to a congressional hearing? i am thinking large now.. these other folks have me all worked up over their inability to research properly before they type.

if you find that, make sure you have a separate littler house down the road for me and my disabled son... zillions dollars would be great....

what else can i do? where else can i turn? i am not good at making a web page, but i will learn and give it a try.. do you think that would help any?

Daniel, thank you for being the voice of reason today.. .i appreciate your knowledge, and your understanding....

you can email me on my regular email. i think i found your website, can i email you my email addy? and lets talk some more without having to be bothered by people who are not wanting to research these items.. i can help research for you on your headlight issue...

linda

daniel, i am new at trying to figure out the newsgroup reply system... i inadverently, apparently, sent the reply to you.. it was meant for those other folks who i felt belittled this serious issue.. MANY MANY APOLOGIES....

please forgive...

l> Linda, you don't help your cause any when you bitch at me. I'm on your

Arif, i think i replied only to you.. let me know if i did this right this time....

l> l>

Just right click on the message you want to reply to. By convention, it's best to type your response below what you're responding to and to delete any quoted material that you're not responding to.

You replied to Arif's post in both rec.autos.driving and rec.autos.makers.chrysler.

Pretty close, except for the "type your response below what you're responding to" part.

So you'd rather have their faces smashed against the steering wheel, dash or windshield? You ambulance chasers are all alike.

Matt

And safer still with a five-point harness, a full-face helmet and Nomex suit. The reality is that many people don't use their seat belts and thus the air bag is what we get.

Matt