OT looking for radio

Hi...

With apologies for the off-topic post, I wonder if any of you in Canada might have or know where I could get one of the earlier (squarish) Infinity AM/FM/CD units?

The one I need is the one that says Infinity or Infinity Gold on the face, and has 5 (not 3) equalizer sliders.

Goes without saying that I want one with an operating display, and that will play burned cd's.

Would like to buy one for a reasonable price if one can be found in Canada (there is one in the US, but customs hassles).

Please let me know, thanks in advance, and take care.

Ken

Reply to
Ken Weitzel
Loading thread data ...

Have you tried Ebay?

Reply to
Rick Yerke

Hi Rick...

Yeppers, sure did... that's where I found the one in the US... Searched all the for sale newsgroups, too :)

Still hoping that there must be one sitting somewhere in Canada doing nothing... young folks seem to be "upgrading" them all the time, so the OEM ones must be going somewhere :)

Thanks for your reply, and take care.

Ken

Reply to
Ken Weitzel

Yes, they are. The Infinity sytems use powered speakers, and you cannot substitute a standard radio and use the Infinity speakers, you have to replace the speakers when you replace the Infinity system

As a result of this there's a market for used, working Infinity radios because quite a lot of people who have their Infinity radio stolen by thieves, do not want to replace the entire system, they just want to replace the radio.

Also, the Infinity speakers themselves are expensive to replace, so quite a lot of people who have ONE speaker fail, want to buy just a replacement, so there is also a market for used, working, Infinity speakers.

I have been in every wrecking yard in my city that has Chryslers, scavenging parts for my projects, and without fail every single vehicle that comes into a wrecking yard with an Infinity system has that system pulled within days. The speakers are usually pulled within a week. Radios that have the 5 band equalizer like you want, the yards themselves take those radios out, they don't even make it to the yard for customers to get.

The car audio shops know all this so when a young fool pup comes in to R&R his Infinity radio with a stereo, if he does not want his Infinity system parts, the audio shops take them and sell them.

The VAST majority of GOOD cdplayer Infinity systems with the

5 band eq go straight to the insurance companies for radio replacement.

Every once in a while you see one of these on Ebay that is probably a good one, for example Ebay auction #5834287779. But most of them are suspect, and even these can be easily bid up to $150 or more. For example of the silliness, check out Ebay auction #8017168057, the seller flat out admits the radio is busted but there's STILL one bid on it for $40, 4 days before the end of the auction!

In my Ebay opinion, (I've bought over 400 items on Ebay, my feedback is all positive, and I've been doing it since 1999, userID tmittelstaedt) based on looking at the auctions descriptions and sellers info for these Infinity systems for quite a while (I wanted a cd player too, like you do) the vast majority of cdplayer Infinity systems with the 5 band eq that go on Ebay have a failed cd drive. The sellers don't tell you this, they just ship the radio with shippers insurance, and when you go to install it and find the cd drive broken, they tell you to file a claim with the shipper because it must have been damaged in transit. You then go to file a claim and the shipper tells you that you have to show an invoice for the purchase of the radio so they can get a dollar value. You show them the $150 that you paid the Ebay seller and they issue you a check for $150 then take your Infinity radio (which they have a right to do so) and you end up right back where you started from.

There are companies that sell (they claim) refurbished Infinity radios on the Internet - prices are comparable to what you would pay an audio store for a decent car radio - but they are warrentied and you can find them on the Internet by searching Google. That is your best hope to get a working cdplayer Infinity radio.

Here is my advice, if you are willing to take it.

STRONGLY consider gutting your existing Infinity system and selling the components on Ebay - you will fetch a good price for them - and put all new speakers and a new aftermarket radio in. Put in good 2 way speakers in the dash holes, run thick cable from them to your radio, and put a highpass filter on them, then run a thick cable to a subwoofer and put that in a box under the drivers seat and a lowpass filter on it. Don't use the existing wiring and don't waste time trying to put speakers in the door or in the rear deck or rear tailgate. The cost is a bit more than what you think your going to pay on Ebay, but it will sound better and you can probably play mp3s directly off the CD.

If you absolutely must have an Infinity, then do what I did - find an Infinity CASSETTE player with the 5 band eq. For example Ebay acution# 8017699153. Install that, then buy a personal CD player with a car kit (cigarette lighter plug and cassette adapter) you can probably get one for $30. The sound quality will be the same as if you get an Infinity system with the cd player, and when the thieves break into your car to steal the cdplayer, they will not destroy your dash getting the Infinity radio out. The Infinity cassette players are on ebay, cost a quarter of the cdplayers, and most of them are in great shape because a cassette drive is a lot less fragile than a cdplayer mechanism. You do have to beware of busted mounting tabs though, for example the 8017699153 auction is missing the bottom mounting tab.

In my case the reason I went with an Infinity in my used 94 T&C (which when I bought it, had had the original infinity system gutted, replaced with an aftermarket, and that also was missing) was so that it would be identical to my 95 T&C which when I bought it came complete with a working Infinity

5 band eq and cassette head. The idea was to have them both the same so if in the future a failure happened, I could swap components to quickly find the problem. And I bought my 5 band eq cassette system off Ebay as well. But if I hadn't had that situation, I would have gone aftermarket.

And one last thing I will say - the Infinity system isn't worth listening to unless you have the 5 band eq. That is one thing you are right about. There is a very strong bass spike in the 200 Hz range that makes the system sound like your sitting in a 55 gallon drum if you have the volume up any appreciable amount, and only the 5 band eq can adjust that out. The fundamental problem with the system is the speakers are

2 way, not 3 way. If they had power-driven only a bass subwoofer, and put a standard midrange and tweeter in, instead of the power driven woofer that goes up to 1Khz and a combo midrange-tweeter, the sound would have been phenominal. Instead it's just like everyone elses 2-way systems, and the power-driving of the woofer compounds the 200Hz spike.

Ted

Reply to
Ted Mittelstaedt

I only know the 2nd gen LH systems, so I may be trying to relate apples to oranges. On the 2nd gen (rounded corner) Infinity systems, The head units are all interchangealbe with Infinity and non-Infinity OEM systems. The only difference in the Infinity and non-Infinity systems is that in the non-Infinity systems, the head unit drives the speakers directly. In the Infinity system, the same head unit will drive an amplifier box that in turn is wired to the speakers (not sure if the speakers are interchangeable - probably not, if only for power reasons).

I know the above because I bought an AM/FM/cassette/CD from a 300M owner who had upgraded his Infinity system (with amplifier), and substituted it into my Concorde's non-Infinity system (no amplifier), so that same head unit drives the speakers directly, and does a fine job.

Again, if the vintage systems you guys are talking about are different from what I described, then just ignore this.

Bill Putney (To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my address with the letter 'x')

Reply to
Bill Putney

That'll be this one?

formatting link
(There's also a version without a cassette player)

Couple years ago, a shop in Toronto decided it would be a good idea to leave my truck on their forecourt with the doors wide open and the dash all apart while they went to lunch. I found out about it when they called me to ask whether or not the truck had a stereo when I dropped it off. They obtained a replacement from a local wrecking yard. You can do likewise by means of

formatting link
(searchable used auto parts clear across North America; you can confine your search area to Canada if you wish). A bunch of them come up with a search on 1997 Chrysler LHS radio/CD. Results are from all interchangeable years/models and are listed in descending-price order.

I've also seen 'em on Ebay.

DS

Reply to
Daniel J. Stern

You are correct Bill

Reply to
maxpower

Reply to
Rick Yerke

Hi Ted...

Thanks so much for so much valuable information... I appreciate it!

Here's where I am, and why. Bought my first ever non-GM car, a '94 LHS a couple of months ago. Impeccable in almost every respect, if you couldn't recognize the year you might well believe it to be brand new. No exaggeration.

One of the few probs (also no drl's) was that the radio worked perfectly in every respect but for no display. Given that was very close to my trade until old age and several strokes caught up with me, I tried to fix it to no avail.

Found on a Winnipeg newsgroup a working pull (non-infinity) from a 2000 minivan. Bought it for next to nothing, plugged it in, and the display worked. But didn't sound anything like the infinity, and won't play burned cd's.

So, several choices. Could stay as I am. Or could learn to live without the display. Or could butcher the cheap one for its display parts. Or go with your idea - to that end I have a bid in now (winning) on an infinity cassette version. Closes in 3 days, though.

Or, given the fact that virtually all the display components are on the top board, it's possible that the cassette and cd versions might be swappable :)

Thanks again for you help, and take care.

Ken

Reply to
Ken Weitzel

Hi Bill...

This one is the "square" one; original 94 stuff. And I unknowingly plugged a non-infinity radio into infinity speakers to have it work fine. Didn't sound like the infinity, of course. But if I hadn't first heard the infinity I'd have thought it was just fine :)

Take care.

Ken

Reply to
Ken Weitzel

Hi Daniel...

Nope, that's the non-infinity version. Easily spotted differences are the infinity has 5 equalizer sliders (rather than three), and the infinity says infinity or infinity gold on or near the display.

I checked out your site; seems there's a couple available in the Toronto-ish area, but the cheapest is 275 bucks... a lot of money :)

Thanks, and take care.

Ken

Reply to
Ken Weitzel

The same is true with the first gen Infinity and non-Infinity systems, the speaker pinout is the same on the connectors on the back.

The only difference in the Infinity and non-Infinity systems

I believe in some Infinity systems they moved the amplifier box from the speakers in the tailgate and doors to a single box located under the passenger seat, or in the trunk, or some such. But I might be wrong.

You can drive the non-infinity speakers from an infinity system but your going to get reduced volume because the radio is expecting the woofers to be powered by an amp. It will also kill bass response. But for old-fart type of programming (big band, talk radio, am radio, all run at very reduced volume) you undoubtedly won't notice it. For young pup type programming (hip hop and rap at full volume) you will definitely notice it. ;-)

Going the other way, driving infinity speakers from a non infinity system, should in theory work OK, although if you overdrive the amp input you will get distortion. Once again, this won't affect old fart programming but will definitely affect young pup programming.

Symphonic programming will be ruined either way - the soft passages will sound fine, the loud passages will be weak or distorted.

I think the electrical is the same until sometime after 2000 when they went to some other system.

Ted

Reply to
Ted Mittelstaedt

Hmmm - maybe you can swap with Bill Putney's infinity? ;-)

Before you write that off make sure your playing CD's mastered Disk At Once, and NOT multisession. But most likely it's because the laser diode isn't the right color.

I would be very surprised if not stunned if the cd player in the infinity used a different setup than the non-infinity cd player.

I think not because I think there's some additional info displayed on the CD display.

You could probably find an infinity that's the exact same model as the one you have with the shot display, and use it for parts, and get a single working unit out of it. Or not. Me, I've got really tired with taking apart car radios anymore, they seem made to be assembled once then never taken apart again.

Circuit City is selling a personal CD player that also plays data CDs that have mp3s burned to them, with anti-skip, complete with a car kit (the cassette and cigarette adapter) from Circuit City for $26.00

They are selling the car kit adapter alone for $29.99. Go figure.

Walmart is selling the same thing except that it doesen't play mp3s but it does have a remote control, for about $24

Ted

Reply to
Ted Mittelstaedt

That is definitely true of all 2nd gen. LH cars. All amplifiers are stand-alone boxes located in either the front passenger side kick panel or in the trunk depending on which Infinity system (I or II) it has.

The head unit is expecting a certain impedance - which it sees whether it is driving the speakers directly or driving an intermediate amplifier. The inputs to the amplifier are designed to look like a speaker to the head unit - that's circuit design 101. The head unit is expecting a certain impedance, and it doesn't know a speaker from an amplifier if the amplifier is designed properly.

I do not think the output drivers are different on the different head units. The head unit drives my speakers directly with Fleetwood Mac cranked up just fine. Certainly not with the same combination of volume and clarity that amplifier-driven speakers could do, but that is inherent in the presence (and wattage/design) or absence of the intermediate amplifier - not dependent on the head unit - that is the purpose of the amplifier.

Did you just call me an old fart?

Again - a function of the presence and specs. of the amplifier. Head unit output is the same. Plug a given head unit directly into speakers with the volume control at a given setting, you will get a certain volume out of the speakers. Unplug the speakers and insert an amplifier between the head unit and speakers with the volume control at the same setting, and it will be louder (or less distorted if the volume control is adjusted for the same volume as withou the amplifier). Of course, a system with an amplifier should have higher wattage speakers in it so they don't blow out the first time the young pup cranks it up - they should wait for the 6th or 7th such occurrence to blow (or conversely, the non-amplified system will have cheaper speakers in it because the owner deserves to be punished for not spending the money on a better system). :)

At a given volume, the base head unit will simply not have the CD player and/or the 5-band equalizer. Getting the higher-end OEM head unit in the infinity system will simply add those features (which is what I did (except the 2nd gen. is only a 3-band equalizer - I just wanted AM/FM/Cassette/CD). The volume level and distortion (or lack of it) is no different with the head unit with 2-band equalizer without CD player that came in my car than with the head unit with CD player and 3-band equalizer that came out of a 300M with Infinity system that I stuck in its place.

Still no difference in head unit output drivers. Infinity system simply tends to come with head untis with more features (same output drivers), amplifier, and higher wattage speakers (due to amplifier - not due to head unit output capability).

Bill Putney (To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my address with the letter 'x')

Reply to
Bill Putney

Reply to
philthy

In that kind of system then that's different than the pre-1996? Infinity systems (rectangular, not rounded corners) because you would have amp outputs that go on a single pair to the speakers, and the speakers would be standard, no difference between Infinity style and non-Infinity style save the nameplate.

With the Infinity systems that are the earlier ones, at least up through

1995 and possibly later, you get 2 pairs that go to the speakers, a + and -, and a "speaker" pair. The speaker pair drives a standard midrange/high speaker which is presumably at 4,8 or 16 ohms, plus an amplifier wired in parallel that is mounted on the speaker and that drives the woofer. (and is powered by the -, + pair) and like any transistorized amp, has high impedance inputs.

Yes, that is true of the Infinity systems that use a -single- trunk or side-kick panel amplifier. It is not true of the Infinity systems that use Infinity speakers which have amplifiers mounted on -each- speaker.

Keep in mind also that transistorized amps run fine without seeing a load, unlike tube amplifiers. You can take the speaker outputs of a transistorized amp and plug them into the high impediance inputs of a second amplifier and everything works.

Because your Infinity speakers are not the kind of Infinity speakers that the OP has in his -94, those Infinity speakers are the older type with individual amps mounted on the speakers

Of course, Fleetwood Mac isn't known for using a lot of bass in their music, it isn't a good music test source.

The best music test sources are hip-hop/rap, and symphonic. These have large amounts of bass and treble at the extreme ends of the range of audibility. However they require a more trained ear. The public generally cannot tell the difference between clean or distorted sound from an orchestral piece with a guy whaling away at a set of kettle drums, nor can it tell the difference between clean or distorted sound from a hip-hop piece with a strong bass synthesizer in it.

:-)

I think the trend in car audio speakers designed for the young pups is to design the speakers so the cones are very stiff, and the speakers require a lot of power to drive. Also, they go with round speakers and adapters in the 6x9 opening.

Sound is great, if you have the wattage for it, because the round speaker cones are stronger than oval, and less likely to distort at extreme excursions, also the stiffer cones resist this better than the usual paper ovals.

You know, of course, that the bass is what uses the highest wattage available from the amp.

I think that Infinity actually meant something with the older systems, in the newer systems it appears to be nothing other than a marketing label with little electrical differences.

When you remove the amps mounted on each speaker and put them into a single unit driven from a head unit, the setup is exactly the same as if you just had a big amp inside the head unit itself.

I think the promise of the original Infinity systems is that the idea was with high volume bass you have very large currents for cone excursion, and if the amp is mounted on the speaker, you do not have line losses in the speaker wires. Once you move the amp away from the speaker, like in the systems you've seen, then there's no point in having the amp separate from the head unit.

The frustrating part of all this is the Infinity system is NOT well documented in the factory service manual so it's difficult to understand what they are doing unless you take apart things.

Ted

Reply to
Ted Mittelstaedt

Shut your fat ugly face, dickwad.

Oh sure, the $7 harness from Walmart is going to preserve the steering wheel and rear seat audio controls on the newer Mopars, right, sure!

Go away and smoke some more pipeweed.

The original poster said "earlier (squarish) Infinity AM/FM/CD units" then followed this up with a date - 1994. That vintage uses different speakers than the later systems. I never said it won't work at all, dipshit, I said it won't work well. Of course, people who buy wiring harnesses at Walmart typically don't give a shittaux if their radio sounds good or like crap.

My post responded to the OP's specific Infinity setup, not to every Infinity system ever made. Since there's been quite vast differences, a $7 wiring harness can't cross from " '89-up" like the Wallmart one claims. It can do a subset of these, but not all. And it can't do the OP's unless he is happy with reduced quality sound output.

More shittaux, because REAL wiring harness adapters exist that CAN handle this, see the SW1 from these guys:

formatting link
"The SWI-CAN is an add-on module for use with the SWI-X, SWI-ALP or SWI-PS. It is used for steering wheels that use a dual wire CAN bus to control the factory radio Vehicles currently supported: 2004-2006 Chrysler, Dodge, and Jeep"

Ted

Reply to
Ted Mittelstaedt

"Ted Mittelstaedt" wrote in news:newscache$bj1mqi$ihg1$ snipped-for-privacy@news.ipinc.net:

Ted, you are absolutely correct. The newer Infinity system (I have an '03 Dakota) is garbage. My RAZ head unit (which is not 'Infinity') runs speaker leads into the Infinity amp, which then runs to each speaker.

The Infinity amp in my kick panel is very heavily eq'd to compensate for the lousy sound of the Infinity speakers. It only puts out about

12 watts RMS, and the distortion figure is something ridiculous like 2% THD. Sounds ok if you're listening at conversation level with the truck turned off, but forget it if you're driving with the windows open.

Why anyone would want to keep the stock system is beyond me, as it's nowhere near what you could get with aftermarket components. It only took me a month to blow out 2 of the 4 speakers after replacing the Infinity kick panel amp with a 45-watt RMS x 4 Sony amp. Now I'm saving up to get some Polk components for the fronts, and I'm going to run the Sony bridged so that I can run around 100 watts RMS to each front speaker. Should be nice and clean regardless of the volume.

The only reasons I'm keeping the OEM head unit are: (a) The steering wheel controls are great, and (b) I want to retain the stock appearance. When it goes (I'm on my 2nd one under warranty btw), I plan to get an HD receiver.

Regards, Joe

Reply to
Joe

MotorsForum website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.