Stripped oil pan plug

I'm looking for a reality check here. Someone please help me out.

The other day I took my 2000 Voyager 2.4 in for an oil change at the dealer (Dealer A) who has done most of the oil changes on this vehicle. After waiting about 30 minutes, I checked on the progress of the oil change and was told that the threads in the oil pan were stripped, and they'd be happy to change the oil pan for ~250, or they could put in a rubber plug for about $10 extra. On the counter was the plug they'd removed from my car, which I visited and did indeed verify that the oil pan was stripped in a major way. I don't like seeing so much shiny aluminum where threads are supposed to be. This car has 80K on it so the oil has been changed 20-25 times in the past

4 years.

Flash back about three months prior to the previous oil change at another dealer (Dealer B): I was told AFTER the oil change was complete that they'd had problems with stripped threads on the oil pan and had installed an oversize oil plug. The oil change prior to this had been done several months prior by Dealer A, so it's likely that they're the ones that damaged the oil pan.

Here's my issue. I can understand steel plugs in an aluminum pan and the possibility of damaged/stripped threads. I did a little research and find that the oil pan is tapped 1/2 x 20. The oil plug removed from my car was clearly stamped metric, and further more was clearly a regular metric oil plug that was a bit larger than my original 1/2 x

20 plug. I haven't yet determined exactly what size the plug is; that's for later today. I do know it's bigger than M12 x 1.5, likely M13 or M14. The tip of it (tapered) just fits inside a 1/2 x 20 threaded hole. This 'oversize' plug is clearly NOT what I'd have expected to see which would have been labeled a single oversize plug for 1/2 x 20, and should have had cuts in it so that it would be self tapping in the aluminum hole, with the same thread pitch as the original plug. Am I right?

It seems to me that replacing a stripped 1/2 x 20 with a larger metric plug that's a) got a different thread pitch, and b) isn't a self tapping plug is a recipe for the kind of damage I've seen. I'm going to pay a personal visit to Dealer B tomorrow to discuss this with the service manager since it's their tech that caused the gross damage that IMHO would have been repairable with the correct oversize plug application. Someone's going to buy me a new oil pan, and it's NOT me.

Reply to
Bruce Baxter
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You're right, but I'll be surprised if you win.

Reply to
JimV

The 'proper' oversized oil drain plug is tapered with cuts in it for self tapping as you suspect.

Just go to any auto parts store and ask for one.

Putting a larger plug in without cutting threads can cause the pan to split so it does need to be replaced. That is usually done by sleaze ball garages that want to soak you for a big repair bill next time or by some back yard 'mechanic' that doesn't know better...

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's

Bruce Baxter wrote:

Reply to
Mike Romain

Reply to
mic canic

Holy cow! $250 for an oil pan? Why don't you call around, I'll bet you could find a good pan in a wrecking yard.

If it was me I'd put in a rubber plug than call around for a new pan. In any case I don't see why they cannot just drill and tap it for a larger thread, and use a standard bolt and washer. If that's impossible to do because too much material is gone, you have them pull the pan then take the pan to an aluminum welder who can build up the area with a weld, then it can be redrilled and tapped. Not only would this be cheaper than a new pan, it would probably be stronger than the original.

Ted

Reply to
Ted Mittelstaedt

Your original plug was M14-1.5. Almost every auto parts store has an oversize M14-1.5 plug made for the job, but too late for that one now in yours, eh?

You could helicoil it to make it infinitely more resistant to stripping by the gorillas that do your oil changes. Many times the pan must be removed to do that to gain clearance for the drilling and tapping tools (if the hole points to a frame member 5 inches away, for example) - some labor costs there, but not as bad as buying a new pan. The risk to that is getting the helicoil in straight so the gasket mates up squarely with the sealing land on the pan, otherwise you start over with another mess.

You should be able to find a new oil pan for under $100, but of course there is labor for swapping it. One from a salvage yard will be 1/2 to

2/3 the price, but you run the risk that its threads have also been damaged by the idiots who change oil these days. For the little difference in money, I would go with new and avoid the risk of it also having problems.

My choices would be new pan or helicoil the old one (in fact I just had to make that choice myself). Drilling and tapping to a larger plug (M16-1.5 would be the logical choice) would work too, and it would be somewhat stronger than M14-1.5 in aluminum, but for not much more effort and expense, you can go with the M14-1.5 helicoil and end up with the ultimate goal of (almost) idiot-proof threads and stay with the factory plug size.

Bill Putney (to reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my address with "x")

Reply to
Bill Putney

An aluminum pan should be able to drilled & re tapped using a larger plug. If a proper drain plug cant be found, a bolt will work. Take it to 9/16, get a short bolt & a gasket to fit, have a nice day. This will be much cheaper than a new pan & much cleaner than the oversized junk that the morons tried to stuff in there. Any foreign metal your worried about (other than whats in there already) will be in the bottom of the pan & can be flushed out by dumping a qt. or 2 of oil in the top with the plug out. Good luck.

Reply to
PA-ter

Reply to
Bruce Baxter

Are you sure about the M14 x 1.5 size? I looked the thing up on several sites that indicated it was 1/2 x 20. I thought that was odd, given the car was assembled in Canada. I just looked it up again, and it may, indeed be M14 * 1.5. It looks like the 95 2.4 was 1/2 x 20, and newer ones were M14 x 1.5. The 'oversize plug' that was installed two oil changes ago was M14 x 1.5 and this one had a rubber gasket moulded into the head of it with a tapered tip, but it did NOT have any cutting thread slots, telling me it was NOT an oversize plug.

Reply to
Bruce Baxter

Reply to
High Sierra

If he keeps getting his oil changed at the same dealerships what are the chances they won't screw it up again? I would rubber plug it. My father did that to a van he had and the plug laster a really long time with no problems.

-------------- Alex

Reply to
Alex Rodriguez

x-no-archive: yes

The original oil pan is tapped metric. The original plug is metric-I think it's an M14x1.5. All Chrysler products to my knowledge the past 10+ yrs have used the same size. The oversize is an M14x1.5 OS.So no issue here with someone replacing an SAE threaded plug with a metric one.

It's real easy to strip these. I had to replace the pan on my 97 Stratus

2.4L because the dealer kept overtightening it. Even when the new pan/plug alignment was clearly marked with white paint, the dealer routinely overtightened the new one by 90 degrees.

Good luck.

Bob

Reply to
Robert Meyer

x-no-archive: yes

That describes the original plug exactly.

Bob

Reply to
Robert Meyer

A properly installed oversize oil drain plug or helicoil kit will not leak. If they do, the job has failed and 'then' you need to go spend the big bucks to some fool at a dealership that wrecked it in the first place.

But then you would have to have actually worked on a vehicle to know that.

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's

mic canic wrote:

Reply to
Mike Romain

If this aftermarket plug supplier (mfgr.?) chart is correct, then after '95, all 2.4L pan plugs are M14-1.5.

BTW - I really like the plugs with a rubber gasket or o-ring inserted into the underside of the head. Soft so it seals, is re-useable, has controlled crush, so minimum torque guarantees reliable sealing. What's really stupid is that many cars come from the factory with that type, but if you order a new one thru the parts department, you get the type without the molded in soft gasket but with a really hard gasket that doesn't seal well and temps people to really crank down on it. Of course even if you have a good sealing soft gasket, unconscious monkeys will try to strip the theads out anyway. Bill Putney (to reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my address with "x")

Reply to
Bill Putney

Oops - left out the link:

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Bill Putney (to reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my address with "x")

Reply to
Bill Putney

I disagree that it's real easy to strip them. It takes a concerted effort - either using an impact wrench or putting everything you've got into a longer than normal wrench.

I got a Subaru back from an oil change one time. Fortunately it had a steel pan. It was so tight, I had to whack a wrench with an 8 pound hammer repeatedly to break it loose. It asbolutely would have stripped out had it been aluminum.

That kind of tightening is inexcusable. I can't imagine what people who do that kind of thing are thinking.

Bill Putney (to reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my address with "x")

Reply to
Bill Putney

That's one of the reasons I still do my own oil changes, even though it makes little sense economically. I've never stripped or forgot to tighten a drain plug in 30+ years of changing oil on a wide range of vehicles. You just take more care when it is your own car, in my opinion.

Matt

Reply to
Matt Whiting

The monkeys at Canadian Tire on Sheppard Ave. & Leslie St. in Toronto ruined my pan the same way. I noticed my car rocking back and forth when they were working on it and asked the manager if there was a problem. In his opinion, there wasn't (of course).

Three months down the road, I took it to my dealer who told me the hole was stripped and the car was unsafe because at any time, the plug could pop out and I would lose my oil on the highway. $250 later, I drove out with a new pan. I couldn't prove that Canadian Tire did the damage because I was too stupid to have the problem written on the receipt when I changed the oil there.

No more Canadian Tire, Mr. Lube or any other chain places for me. If I get the oil changed in one place (at the dealer), at least I know who the culprit is.

We get too soon old, and too late smart.

Reply to
Arthur Alspector

Reply to
mic canic

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