Xantia Accumulator Sphere

There is a back issue of Car Mechanic mag which covers this work, give them a look.

PDH

from memory (wait a day or two before taking my advice)

if anyone knows better pipe up !

pressurise the system, crack the sphere but only just crack it.

depressurise the system and unscrew the sphere.

And there are apparently 7 of the things scattered around the car.

PDH

Aha it's the pressurising bit it was missing. Ta muchly.

I knew the back struts had to be pressurised before cracking the spheres but I didn't know about the accumulator.

works all round on sticky spheres, apparently, but wait for others to chip in with a solution.

hth

Number of spheres depends on the model. The Activa version has them all over. If you are within reach of Chorlton cum Hardy, 'Westroen' (father and son in a suburban semi) at 7, Nell Lane will replace all the spheres with recon units at £25 each. Three year guarantee. For another £40 they drain and replace the hydraulic fluid and change the filters in the reservoir. All that while you wait in about an hour. It's all they do and they know the job inside out. Their sphere removal tool is a big steel split ring with a big tensioning bolt, welded to a heavy steel bar that gets belted with a lump hammer. You're wasting your time with filter type wrenches (and can damage the mounting block and pipes if you try- particularly the rears which get clogged with road muck and corrosion). DaveK.

recon spheres ? hiow does that work then ?

"regassed" or new membranes ?

For that sort of money It's not worth buggering about doing it yourself.

There's your problem.

Crack the sphere with the egnine running, the system pressurised. Crack the seal, and NO more. i.e. about 1/16th of a turn. Then depressurise.

Tim..

Let me guess - more than 1/4 turn and they unscrew themselves - FAST!

No No No

Please don't try to even crack open the main accumulator sphere with the pressure on, you only need to do this with the rear suspension spheres and this is to stop the cylinders from moving.

To remove. Undo the 12mm bleed screw on the regulator by 2 turns max. Using a wrench, undo the sphere. Remove the O ring from the grove. Replacing, Fit the new O ring in the grove, Screw on the replacement sphere, as tight as you can get it by hand only. Start the engine and run for approx 2 mins Tighten the bleed screw.

The best tool for the job is a band wrench from Pleiades

Recon spheres ? How does that work then ? I have allways used recon spheres without any worries again from pleiades, the spheres are guaranteed for 2 years unlimited milage!! They dont have new membranes as they are sealed and I dont think that you could replace the membranes, but Pleiades tell me that the spheres are all inspected before re pressurising, thats why they can give them a long guarantee

Sorry if this post comes out twice, but I had an error message with the first time I replyed!!! Regards. Slim.

No No No Please don't try to even crack the main accumulator loose with the pressure up.

You only need to do this with the rear suspension, this is to hold the cylinder still.

To remove the main accumulator, Undo the bleed screw by a max of 2 turns, Using a suitable wrench undo the sphere. Remove the old O ring.

Replacing. Put the new O ring in the grove first, Screw the replacement sphere on as tight as you can do it by hand. Start the car up and run for approx 2 mins Tighten the bleed screw.

The best tool for the job is a band wrench from Pleiades

Regards. Slim

No No No

Please don't try to even crack open the main accumulator sphere with the pressure on, you only need to do this with the rear suspension spheres and this is to stop the cylinders from moving.

To remove. Undo the 12mm bleed screw on the regulator by 2 turns max. Using a wrench, undo the sphere. Remove the O ring from the grove. Replacing, Fit the new O ring in the grove, Screw on the replacement sphere, as tight as you can get it by hand only. Start the engine and run for approx 2 mins Tighten the bleed screw.

The best tool for the job is a band wrench from Pleiades

Recon spheres ? How does that work then ? I have allways used recon spheres without any worries again from pleiades, the spheres are guaranteed for 2 years unlimited milage!! They dont have new membranes as they are sealed and I dont think that you could replace the membranes, but Pleiades tell me that the spheres are all inspected before re pressurising, thats why they can give them a long guarantee

Sorry if this post comes out twice, but I had an error message with the first time I replyed!!! Regards. Slim.

Very FAST.

For all of those asking about recon spheres, apparently it has been a bit of a bugger in the past to obtain new OEM parts and there is a good trade in recon spheres. The ones removed from your car go back to be worked on for reuse. There is no performance difference on the quality of the recon spheres compared to the OEM units, they work exactly the same way.

Getting them off is the bugger though.

The other fault that you can diagnose if you have a suspension issue is the pump unit. Apparently it ticks every so often as it adjusts but if the ticking rate is under 30 seconds or coming reasonably fast, the pump is suspect. Again, an easy change job if you have the time and inclination. The major killer though of the whole system is and always will be dirty suspension fluid which will just wreck the whole thing over time.

PDH

fairysnuff ! I bow to your superior knowledge, slim ! < bows > :-)

:confused:

I've been told that the spheres which are re-gassed don't take into consideration the deterioration of the membrane. I know that the spheres are filled with nitrogen, right ? nitrogen molecules are supposed to be too big to escape through rubber (see also tyres) so why do the spheres fail ? is it the deterioration of the membrane ? where does the nitrogen go if it's not through the membranes ? if the nitrogen does escape through the membranes can it get into the LHM fluid and cause that to deteriorate ?

when I bought my xantia I noticed that 4 spheres were still under warranty and I managed to get them replaced at the main dealer when I took it in for it's 78,000 mile service. you should have seen the look on their faces when they told me that all 4 spheres needed replacing and I produced the warranty !! that's the only reason I took it into the main dealer, btw ;-)

for this reason, I haven't had the need to buy any spheres yet so I'm all ears as to why they fail in the first place. so many questions !

This is what I like to hear, somebody socking it to a dealer....! :o)

There is a god after all.

PDH

The gradual deteriation of a sphere is down to molecular diffusion (Grahams Law)

This diffusion takes place place as the nitrogen gas migrates through the molecular structure of the rubber diaphraghm. Much the same as a helium balloon going down, not because it's got a hole in it, just because they do!!

When you buy a helium balloon for the kids, you expect it to float up rapid, the next day or two we expect it to be on the floor, but still with no holes in it. If you had purchased a foil type balloon, this would stay up for much longer, the reason being that the molecular structure of foil is closer than rubber.

All spheres go down, we cannot avoid it, it's the way things are.

Typically on the Citroen the spheres reach about half the pressure within 3 years, if you have them recharged at this point there will be no damage to the diaphragm and they will last for another 3 years or so.

If you leave it untill the suspension is solid, the diaphragm will hit the top and at this point irreversable damage occurs, therefore your sphere is scrap metal.

The shelf life of a sphere is years and years, as when not being used the gas has to migrate not only through the rubber diaphragm, but also through the steel wall of the sphere, this takes a lot longer as the molocular structure of steel is a lot better.

When the diffusion takes place (ongoing from day one) the gas does go into the LHM system, but this is so gradual it will work it's way out to the reservoir and you wont even notice it.

I am suprised however that you managed to get a warranty claim to stick!! Most warranty companys will only pay out on sudden failure, not normal wear and tear. Lucky you !!!

Sorry its a bit long winded, but I am not to good at explaining technical bits.

Regards. Slim

Gas diffusion through steel, eh?

Giggle.

(No, it won't happen. Which if you're a diver is probably a good thing :-) )

cheers, clive