Volvo Amazon with BW35 auto box - Slipping out of 1st

Hello Everyone I have an Amazon with a BW35 auto box - keeps slipping out of 1st when i try to pull away. If i pull away really slowly on level ground it is ok (usually) but sometimes i can't even engage 1st without engageing reverse a few times.

The oil is murky and has never been changed. I've had the car twenty years and this has been getting worse over the last 1000 miles. I'm not sure if i adjusted the bands (which apparently can be done from outside) i could save it.

Also, I have the chance to get a BW box from a pall who has a new (old stock) one for a granada mk 1. I was wondering if it would fit? I should think it probably would if i retained my volvo housing - any ideas? If not any ideas where I could find out?

Thanks In avance if anyone can help! Ian

Reply to
IanHurrell
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Reply to
mike whiskey

From memory only one band is adjustable - and usually by the time they start slipping adjustment is too late. The dirty ATF suggests things are not well as this indicates much wear on the friction material.

But it's a very easy box to overhaul - no special tools needed. Any period Jaguar, Rover, or Triumph factory workshop manual gives full details if the Volvo one doesn't. All you need to be careful of is cleaning everything properly. I'd also change the torque convertor for a new one - or one from a car where the fluid was clean as they can't be cleaned out easily.

One for a different car will physically fit if you swap the bellhousing, but may not have exactly the same internals or power handling capabilities.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

Reply to
IanHurrell

Thanks Dave, I'n my simple way of looking at this i am suffering from one of two things:

1=2E Some sort of dirt sticking some sort of valve. In which case droping the sump, cleaning and changing the oil could help. I think i will try this over the weekend.

2=2E No meat left on the clutchy type bits.

I think your guess would be the latter.

In which case I reckon I could buy the NOS one for the granada and put that in. I'm not too concerned about the fact that the internals may offer different performance characteristics (unless you think I'm being foolish in the regard)

Some questions to do with compatibility between the two boxes:

Where the box joins the engine: I would use the Volvo bell housing but there must be a spline or something to provide the power transfer. Could this be different diameter? Could I swap it over?

Similar question where the box meets the prop shaft.

Gear change linkage, kickdown cable and dipstick may cause problems but again I'm presuming I can use the original parts?

I like the idea of getting down and dirty and overhauling the internals but reckon if I can get a NOS box for =A3200 I'd be best to go this route. I would imagine the parts would exceed =A3200 - are they readily available.

Thanks Dave, I really appreciate any help you can give me, I've had the car for 20 years and keen to keep the old girl on the road! Ian

Ian Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Reply to
IanHurrell

Trouble is this won't remove the dirt from the valve assembly - or more important from the TC which can't be drained and contains somewhat around half the total capacity.

It's usually the brake bands that wear first - the clutches are multi plate types. The diaphragm spring on the clutches can break resulting in them not disengaging - but not in your case.

I was basing it on the fact that some earlier boxes were designed for small cars only - but later beefed up internally to be used with more powerful ones.

I think they are all the same. There are two concentric power transfer paths - a spline and a tang - for the TC. The correct way is to remove the TC and box together, and replace in the same way. This avoids the possibility of damage to the seals when trying to replace the box only to the engine with the TC in place. However, some manage it ok. You have to make sure the tang is lined up if doing this.

Again, I think they're all standard - or at least the drive flange could be changed.

Yup. And don't forget to check the speedo drive. Although if different might need the internal gear changed too - but this is a guess. Other boxes do have differently geared drives.

There's probably an overhaul kit available with all the likely needed parts. Dunno the cost these days though - it's many a year since I fixed one of these.

My main worry would be the dirty ATF and bits of friction material left in the TC which will contaminate the new box. It's common practice to fit a new or reconditioned one at overhaul time where a box is contaminated.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

Thanks ever so much for your detailed reply Dave,

Forgot to say that the granada box comes with a new TC. So my question really was would there be compatability problems where the TC joins the bell housing?

I believe the TCs are either 9.5 or 11 inch so I need to find out the size for the volvo and the granada and see if it will fit. Any ideas?

Also, i think there are two band adjustment screws accessible from the outside of the box, do you think there is any chance that adjustment could help in the short term?

One more question, do you think I'd be mad to spend =A3200 for the granada box and TC? I'm pretty handy with mechanics and i would be confident pulling both boxes apart.

Thanks aga> > > I'n my simple way of looking at this i am suffering from one of two > > things:

Reply to
IanHurrell

UPDATE - I now think the problem is due to the gear change linkage.

The gearbox mounting has perished and the box has moved about an inch from where it should be. So this means the linkage was out of adjustment and could not move the gear selector enough to engage drive properly.

I'm in the mids of renewing the mounting but i did a road test in which i removed the linkage and engaged drive myself on the box with my hand. Ran around the block perfectly. FANTASTIC - was over the moon especially when I had spoken to someone who could get me out my problem for =A31200!

I'm still stuck with murkey oil so i plan to drop the sump, clean and refill.

THANKS TO EVERYONE WHO REPLIED.

Reply to
IanHurrell

Don't know how I missed this the first time 'round, but.......

Yes, the trans mount is often a problem on these cars. I'm trying to recall if the auto used the same configuration as the standard, but that escapes me right now. Too many years away from those cars.

If it *does* use the same configuration, replace it with an engine mount. They're a tougher component, and tend to last longer. As well, the linkage on those autos can wear, causing similar issues. With the stiffer mount, there is less movement, helping keep the linkage where it belongs.

As for your fluid change, I'd suggest finding a flush service. Not just where they drop the pan, but a system where the fluid is allowed to be drained out through the cooler output, and fresh fluid drawn/pumped in through the cooler line input.

Again, going from memory here, the 121/122 didn't utilize the trans cooler. But all the ones I worked on had either plugs or a bypass tube installed. Simple enough matter to make up a couple of tubes to do the work. On the two that I owned, I installed na aftermarket trans cooler. I had a couple of early 140 series that were the same, on those I installed a newer rad with trans cooler, and utilized that....

Reply to
Raymond J. Henry

Hello Raymond, Thanks for the reply!

I have already put the gearbox mounting in (well almost, started getting dark last night). Actually, it seemed beefier than an engine mount.

I need to make up a nylon bush for part of the linkage as one is missing causing about 5mm play.

Was funny how i found the issue. I took the top part of the linkage away and pulled and pushed the down rod to see how the gear engagement.

1 click at a time caused P R N and R! again. Must have got this wrong I though, tried 3 more times, then I watched what was happening to the final part of the linkage and could see what was happening - the angles were all wrong and a move that should have pushed further into D was actually pulling back to R.

Good job I had that mousetrap game as a child otherwise I'd never have worked it out!

So, now i have to think about the blood transfusion.

I appreciate the advice you gave 'cos someone else told me that at lease 50% of the fluid would be in the torque converter and that wouldn't get drained by a sump off job.

Seems, like the method you're describing would be a "keep on replenishing 'till the fluid goes red" approach. - much better. Actually, I'm told there is a filter that could be cleaned when the sump is removed - so I better do a combination of both methods.

I think there is a cooler on my 121. Or am i getting confused with a cooling line coming from the rad? Anyway i imagine the approach is to tap in to the circuit - I'll have a good look for plugs etc when I'm finishing off the linkage work.

Raymond - thanks one again for your help

Ian

Raym> On 16 Jun 2006 22:42:20 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@Talk21.com wrote: >

Reply to
IanHurrell

They can be a bugger. I had a '68 I never did get right, but got close enough to function without problems.....

Basically..... Generally, the machine that does the exchange gets dialed in to pump in a specified volume of fluid, whatever the manufacturer states. But yeah, if you're doing it at home, I've heard of guys that have someone up top slowly pouring it in while a guy below is draining the line. I'm not a fan of that method, think that there is too much probability of running the pump/TC dry.

Sounds like either they marketed them with the rad cooler over their, or someone has already done a change up. Or maybe a factory option? Either way, if you've got two lines running from the trans to the rad, you're good to go with a proper fluid change/flush.

And yes, if *I* were doing it, I'd drop the pan, clean it & the filter, top it up, run it 'round the block, then bring it back to do the flush. Sure, it will set you back about 3 -4 litres of fluid, but it'll do the job right. And if you're doing it yourself, you're still going to save.

And if you've got digital pics of your car, I'd sure like to see them. They have pretty well all disappeared round here...... IMO, they were one of the best cars EVER made..... Sure miss mine.... Still got a shed full of parts, including a couple of OD 4-speeds....

Reply to
Raymond J. Henry

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