The end of cheap gasoline

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Check out the latest Rolling Stone magazine's article"The end of oil" or it can be found on a search engine by just entering The Long Emergency.
It describes very convincingly that the world's peak oil production, i.e. the point when we'll produce the most we ever will in a year and after that it will begin it's irreversable and irreversable decline, is right now--as you're reading this. 2005. Then, let's just say some bad things are going to happen. And there are no viable alternative energy sources on the horizon, at least not anything which would available on even a small fraction of the scale required to replace oil, etc... The picture is grim to put it mildly, and I don't see any basis to doubt anything it says. Please check it out and post your thoughts, I'd like to hear them.
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For me, I want to hear what the experts have to say...not someone who stands to make a huge profit off of a doomsday scenario book... Sounds like there may be a grain of truth to what he's saying, but the question is - how big is that grain? He talks of oil prices being at such an all-time high...I read an article a few weeks back that was talking about how prices today are still lower (when adjusted for inflation) than they were at one point in the 70's or 80's (can't remember exactly when the article said). Not to mention the fact tha we still pay a good bit less that folks in many parts of the world...
Wesley

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Yes, but who ARE the "experts?" I think anyone would agree that the guy who wrote the article sounds very well informed. Can't he be one of them? And he's published in Rolling Stone--that gives him some credibility in my book. But point taken, about a profit motive with a doomsday scenario book...but the thing is that it all seems totally plausable, kind of echos the sentiments I've had about the whold matter for a long time. Every writer, every periodical, has their subgect or topic they're generally dedicated to; and as such they're usually well informed and often even passionate about it: whether it be politics or cars or dogs, etc. You ask ten "experts" you'd get ten different answers, probably--and his is just another one. But like I said, I don't see any glaring holes in his assessment of the situation. In fact, quite the opposite.
Incidentally, I would have posted the link directly to that article but wasn't able to do that easily on this webtv setup. I can email it to people but not get it to post onto usenet.
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On Sun, 10 Apr 2005 00:01:23 -0500, snipped-for-privacy@webtv.net (James Goforth) puked:

It's been a long time since I've read Rolling Stone. Do they still talk about which celebrity is sleeping with whom and whatnot? -- lab~rat >:-) Do you want polite or do you want sincere?
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Actually I just picked it up and read it at the local library while my son was in there doing some school work. I'm not a regular reader of the mag myself, and yes, there's a lot of celebrity gossip in it, music news, et.al.
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On Wed, 13 Apr 2005 09:56:34 -0500, James Goforth wrote:

Do you think you could learn to quote a little of the text that you are referring to, so people might know what you're talking about?
--
If you're not on the edge, you're taking up too much space.
Linux Registered User #327951
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See my pervious posting: "Link to 'The End of Oil."
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On Wed, 13 Apr 2005 11:14:04 -0500, James Goforth wrote:

You just don't get it, do you?
--
If you're not on the edge, you're taking up too much space.
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On Sun, 10 Apr 2005 00:01:23 -0500, James Goforth wrote:

LOL! Hunter S. Thomas was published in Rolling Stone!!!
RS should get back to reporting about music and leave politics and speculation to those best suited for it...

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You're joking...right?
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I know what you mean, I could count the times on one hand that I've read a Rolling Stone in the past decade. I just gave them credibility in that they're a very large publication, and many of the articles in it are from outside authors, rather than their own staffers--the same as Playboy or any of the other major pubs, that's all. Myself, I read Car & Driver, Time and Newsweek. I suspect the responses to the article would have been different had I not mentioned that it appeared in RS.
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"James Goforth" wrote in message: "Check out the latest Rolling Stone magazine's article"The end of oil" or it can be found on a search engine by just entering The Long Emergency. It describes very convincingly that the world's peak oil production, i.e. the point when we'll produce the most we ever will in a year and after that it will begin it's irreversable and irreversable decline, is right now--as you're reading this. 2005. Then, let's just say some bad things are going to happen. And there are no viable alternative energy sources on the horizon, at least not anything which would available on even a small fraction of the scale required to replace oil, etc... The picture is grim to put it mildly, and I don't see any basis to doubt anything it says. Please check it out and post your thoughts, I'd like to hear them."
Its not just cheap gas that is going, the lost of oil would mean we would have to revert back to caveman days, Many of today's modern conveniences are made from a barrel of oil. Medicines, plastics, and synthetic clothing are just a few. We all must learn to recycle, reduce and reuse as much as possible.
I not an expert on oil but I bet there is a lot more then what the public is lead to believe. There are areas where the oil reserves have not been touched. There are several areas where engineers have not been able to use modern technology to tap the oil reserves that are there. One such example is the oil sands in Canada. The cost out to refine cost more then the oil is worth. Another example was on discovery channel a while back. That is oil that seeps from the ocean floors into the sea to be disbursed. This occurs naturally at depths we have not attempted to drill for oil yet.
Sarge
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That was part of the article--yes, there's still a fair amount of oil left, but it is:
1. Extremely difficult and expensive to extract 2. Of considerably inferior quality 3. In a place where "they hate us."
In other words, way more trouble than it's worth, not going to do us any good, and not even really in the equation. Meanwhile, everybody thinks there's still lots of oil left...there isn't. I'm going to TRY to post the link to that article.
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www.rollingstone.com/news/story/_/id/7203633
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On Sun, 10 Apr 2005 11:38:09 -0500, snipped-for-privacy@webtv.net (James Goforth) puked:

The guy has an active imagination. I'm always wary of 'the sky is falling' crowd, so I did a Google search on him and came up with this:
http://www.answers.com/topic/james-howard-kunstler
It doesn't appear that he has any formidable credentials and is essentially an editorialist. Perhaps his books have more footnotes to back up his assertions, but he makes a lot of dramatic leaps in the article you posted.
It reminds me of some of the predictions of the 1950's where we are commuting in personal aircraft and living on the moon by 1990... -- lab~rat >:-) Do you want polite or do you want sincere?
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On Sat, 09 Apr 2005 19:59:02 -0500, James Goforth wrote:

The most a refinery can run at is 95%. This is due to limitations in the design and efficiencies. Oil refineries are now running at 95%. The reason the price of gas keeps rising is because demand is outstripping supply. Since there is no 100% in the refinery business, there very well could be a gas shortage.
How often has this happened? I recall 4 times in my lifetime. We haven't run out yet, and there are a couple Exxon Valdez' worth in Alaska...
Sure OPEC isn't just sqeezing for a little more dinero?
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Utah, Colorado and Wyoming are full of oil shale folks..........and I mean FULL

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Rob wrote in message: "Utah, Colorado and Wyoming are full of oil shale folks..........and I mean FULL"
Yeah, but the environmental wacko's would protest the drilling or mining of that also. Just like the do with every new drilling or mining of natural resources. If they only realize that modern day world revolves around a barrel of oil. Man won't change his habits until he is forced to. We all can do a better job with the three "R's" Reduce, Recycle and Reuse.
This statement not only applies to gasoline but everything from plastic to other commodities that are made from chemicals that come from a barrel of oil.
There are lost of other sources of oil that has not been tapped for environmental reasons. There is a constant seepage of oil from depths of the ocean that we have not been able to drill for due to technology has not been developed. There are oil sands in Canada. Shell and other oil companies has spent a good bit of money trying to develop a technology that will make this a feasible resources.
Sarge
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nope...been mining its sine the 1930s thanks to the US navy, only now is it becoming profitable thanks to modern technology.

of
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that
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You mean Shell has spent a good deal of Our (government) money developing ways to extract the crude from the oil sands. I understand it is economically viable at about $65 to $75 US a barrel. (means they will be making their regular shitloads) we will be there soon and there is enough oil there I'm told for the whole world for 50 to 100 years!! Plus all the capped wells in alberta that are not being pumped now. Offshore oil is a vast resource world wide!! As for the 3 r's i generally put out a full blue box and a small 1/2 Glad kitchen bag a week. My used oil and trans fluid go to an used oil refinery in town hear. So does my antifreeze!! Dodgem
But they will pry my 2001 Ram Quad cab from my cold dead hands. best gas mileage I ever got on a 1/2 ton though!!!
Reducing pollution is likely a far more serious problem. Like they still won't take the sulfur out of gas till the government makes them. I heard Ervin oil down east did it on their own just because they felt it was their corporate duty!!!!!!!!!!!!
All in all hydro is the cleanest power next to wind but god forbid you flood some indian land (not to mention the activists)
Nuclear power is clean when you think that its waste, although troublesome can be entombed underground in areas when no one will ever roam, live or vist. whats the big deal!!!!!
Sarge wrote:

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