Built like a Mercedes (?)

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On Sat, 11 Feb 2006 14:37:47 -0500, clare at snyder.on.ca wrote:

some liberal publication that ignores all the true facts

Funny, my finance charges each year are zero. Fuel costs are $9 per 100 miles, maintenance is negligible since I refuse to waste money at a dealer, and a Honda requires virtually no maintenance, but figure $3 for that, $2 for insurance, $0 depreciation. That comes out to $14. Now, the fare for mass transit may only be $14, but that does not include the cost of road taxes that go to the mass transit that should be going to our roads, nor of gasoline taxes that are misdirected, and other taxes such as income and sales taxes that go to support Metra. Real cost, probably in the neighborhood of $75.
Clearly, mass transit is FAR MORE EXPENSIVE than autos, and does NOT PROVIDE service to the vast majority of people who need to be able to get to work and the store.
************************* Dave
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Until you buy another car when this one fails.

Rubbish. Its a machine, so it wants maintenance. Unless you don't change the oil, and never put tires or brakes on it, you put money into maintenance.

Over what period of time or mileage? Your figures have no basis if you don't quantify the duration over which you spend that money.

More rubbish, since you are claiming the costs are altered by corruption, taxes and fees that are not only unspecified in cost, but are unproven assumptions.

More crap. You haven't proven the expense, and worse, you haven't figured out the problem.
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Max

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On Sat, 11 Feb 2006 11:08:25 -0000, "Huw"

Also from: http://www.rco.on.ca/factsheet/fs_b02.html#Canada/%20Canadians
Energy
The energy equivalent of 575,000 barrels of oil a day are required to produce 10 million cars in the U.S. . [Greenpeace International (1991) found in: "The Recycling of Automobiles: A Study of the Scope of the "by Mike Carriere / file industry sectors automotive] DOT (Department of Transportation [U.S.]) says the average one-way commute is about 10 miles. To accomplish this flat, a 3000- pound car with a single occupant uses about 65,000 BTUs of energy. It would be roughly 3,5 times more energy-efficient to travel in a four-person carpool; 7 times more efficient to go by bus; 35 times more efficient to go by subway; 60 times more efficient to go by train. ["Motion sickness" Friends of the earth. Vol. 21 No. 2 Spring 1991] It has been estimated that between 66 and 105 gigajoules of energy are needed to produce a motor vehicle, depending on the proportion of recycled materials used. This is equivalent to the energy contained in between 2000 and 3000 l of gasoline, or the amount of fuel consumed by 16000 to 26000 km of driving. [A state of the Environment Fact Sheet No. 93-1 "Environmental implications of the automobile" Environment Canada therein: References: Jacques, A. 1992 Canada’s greenhouse gas emissions for 1990. Ottawa: Environment Canada, Conservation and Protection] A comparison of energy use by transportation mode
Transportation mode Fuel electricity use (L/100 km) Number of commuters Energy use (MJ/person-km) Automobile 10 7 1 4 1 4 3.16 0.79 2.21 0.55 Diesel bus 56 40 0.52 Subway 2.61 kWh/km 75 (per car) 0.13
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You wanted facts. You got them. Either you post more up to date facts or stick with your fairy stories. One day you might get good at it.
Huw
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On Fri, 10 Feb 2006 10:12:47 -0000, "Huw"

Table A19 of the document you reference shows average HOUSEHOLD vehicle miles to be 29000 per year - with - and this is one thing I stated that you poo-poo'd - the RURAL mileage being 36,000, and the urban 27,000. These are 2001 figures, published in 2005.
The forces that have raised those numbers over the last 10 years have not diminished in the last half of those ten years. These numbers, you need to understand are PER HOUSEHOLD - and NOT PER HOUSEHOLD WITH A VEHICLE.
Yes, more than one vehicle per household drops the average per vehicle, but households with no vehicle raise the average as well.
And you know the old saw - figures never lie, but liars figure. and - there's statistics, damn statistics, and lies.

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Huw wrote:

Actually, I'd EXPECT small-town heartlanders of the midwest and southwest to have the among the lowest mileage figures (and the most relaxed lifestyles). The high mileage would be suburbanites that commute to cities.
Again, I dont' have a dog in the fight, its just that the numbers quoted feel awfully wrong, given that every city I travel to has traffic reports in the morning and evening that show a LOT of cars travelling a lot of miles to and from the 'burbs.
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Floyd Rogers wrote:

Geesh. Loosen your jockstrap, Floyd. Its cutting circulation to your brain.
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Individual anecdotes may be interesting but don't help with a conclusion about driving habits overall.
With all this to-ing and fro-ing I have become almost interested in the subject, i.e. whether North Americans really do drive more p.a. than Brits or, indeed, other western Europeans.
Many British "secondary" (non-motorway, if that is what you mean) roads are actually dual carriageway and pretty 'fast'. They are just not quite at motorway standards (different and fewer access points, no small motorbicycles or pushbikes, e.g.) for a variety of reasons.
Would Germans have a higher average mileage? More motorways, no physical borders (except a small one with the North Sea and Baltic in the north)...
DAS
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Richard Sexton wrote:

And that's only about 150 miles further than Orange, Texas to El Paso, Texas, travelling Interstate 10 all the way.
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<clare at snyder.on.ca> wrote in message >>

Ah! Back to the perrenial "mine is bigger than yours" arguement. Very original.
Many Canadians

Done that myself. Actually 1800 miles in seven days with a 24ft caravan behind. No problem.

I don't know what in Hell you think is so unique about your conditions. I have over a 200 mile round trip to music concerts and I do them after six pm and get back before 2am. Nothing unusual. I travel in excess of 20,000 miles per annum in my business vehicle alone and my wife and I also put in another 18000 miles in our private Range Rover. Nothing unusual. I have a friend who does in excess of 50,000 business miles per year, all in the UK. That would be considered high mileage.
Huw
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<clare at snyder.on.ca> wrote in message wrote:

A long distance for me is anything over 300 miles in a day. What is it for you?
Huw
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miles wrote:

In the UK, recreational trailers ( other than the dreaded 'caravans' ) are all but unknown.
Graham
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On Fri, 3 Feb 2006 09:27:23 -0800, Martin Joseph

MOST north american roads are pretty good by world standards, but there are more miles of bad roads in North America than all the roads put together in most countries of the world, due to the overwelming number of miles of road involved. Many "urban" light trucks do not carry ANY load - but that is pretty well made up for by those who habitually overload them by magnitudes of 4 or 5, and occaisionaly 8 or 10. In our area, it is NOTHING to see a 1/2 ton truck loaded with 2 tons. - just like it's nothing to see pickups that have NEVER carried as much as 500 lbs in the box. (but some have over 700 lbs just on the front seats)
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On Fri, 3 Feb 2006, Pooh Bear wrote:

I'm sure if you think about it for half a minute, you can come up with some concrete and quantifiable ways in which Americans are harder on vehicles than are owners in other parts of the world. I know I can.
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On Thu, 02 Feb 2006 17:27:28 +0000, Pooh Bear

but then pooh, i fail to see any logic period, everytime you post.
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Max Dodge wrote:

Yes I knew you would be saying "my dick is bigger than your dick". All so very predictable.
Huw
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On Wed, 1 Feb 2006 23:03:46 -0000, "Huw"

The old L200 MitsuShitty was sold here as a Dodge D50 - a half ton truck in America.

Well, virtuall the same Mazda/Ranger is sold here as a half ton by both Mazda and Ford..

MOST Hilux are sold as 1/2 ton trucks, although the frame is the same on the 1 ton. Yes, the Hilux is sold as a 1 ton - but not NEARLY all of them. We used to have Hilux 1/2 and one ton pickups, as well as 1 ton commercial cab and chassis when we imported them from Japan. Our Tacoma is American built, and not available as a 1 ton - as MOST american users require a larger truck when they want a 1 ton capacity.
In North America we have the Toyota Tacoma 1/2 ton, and a few 3/4 ton versions,(875-1640 lb payload) as well as the honking big Tundra. (1455 to 2025 lb payload capacity - including passengers on the Tundra.) It will tow 6500 lbs though.

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clare, at, snyder.on.ca wrote:

Many panels on modern cars are also galvanised. That makes a *big* difference.
Graham
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On Mon, 30 Jan 2006 10:10:24 -0000, "Huw"

Can you drive at that speed for say, 14 hours without stopping in Limey land, or anywhere else in Europe? Get on the Interstate on the east coast and drive to the Pacific coast in 4 days, or less with 2 drivers. Then turn around and drive back, with no repairs. Or drive from Northern Ontario to Key West Florida without stopping except for gas, food, and washroom breaks, and virtually NEVER be under 65 MPH?
I remember driving from Kitchener Ontario to Murray River PEI in 18 hours, non-stop in a '53 Dodge.That included the ferry crossing at Tormentine. Do the math. There was no loafing.
Yes, some Euro cars will do it - and in some you may even be relatively comfortable.The old Rover 2000TC comes to mind. A 2.5 Mondeo would fit the bill too, if there were only 2 adults.
But take a big American Chevy and wind it through the hedge-rows of old Limey ---- Not a chance.
Differnt ponies for different tracks.

Yup - I've driven those roads.

But 200,000 miles can easily be put on a car in 3 years in parts of Canada and the USA.

The Heavy Half Hilux and the Toyota one ton pickups in the eighties easily handled 2-3 tons, and lasted better than the Chevy pickups of the same period.My dad used both in his contracting business, and the Toyota didn't take a back seat to Chevy OR Ford at the time.
And we didn't get the Stout or the Dyna. What they would handle with a puny little 4 cyl engine was unbelievable. The L series and B series diesels, particularly the Turbo L, were almost unstoppable, and even the 3R, 5R, 6R, 8R and 20R gas engines lasted incredibly well.

Untill we load 2 face cords of hardwood on 'em. Then you se 'em squat!!

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I am entertained by the idea that driving conditions in the USA are tougher than in the Third World... and that inter-regional variation within the US is so great. Oh man, you should get out more. (Yes, I know California isn't Arizona isn't Vermont weatherwise, but still.)
DAS
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