valve clatter

Actually, this is what you need:

Anyone know exactly what years the plenum gasket is an issue? Seems to me it effects model years up through 2000. I only know of one person who has ever said they had problems with a 2001. I have a 2001 with

76,000 miles on it and so far no problems. It was pinging bad the other day while under load up a hill but I think I just got a bad tank of gas. Have to keep an eye on oil consumption.

Carol> Actually, this is what you need:

Mine is an '01 and mine was leaking.

thanks, i know about the kit, but I am not sure if that is the issue.

Fill up with premium and see if it gets better. Sounds like ping, or spark knock, because valve noise has no reason to be load sensitive.

*** Posted via a free Usenet account from ***

What grade of fuel are you using?

Something to try...if you're using regular unleaded. Before you gas up again, run the tank to empty...then run some premium and see if it still makes the same sound. I'll venture to say that right now you are running regular...and also that when you run the premium, the noise will still be there...but nowhere near as much. If this is what happens, then you'll need that plenum kit. It's a simple way to check.

You really need more than 87 octane gas but some are really fixated on using 87 octane no matter what. I do not use 87 octane in anything except a old tractor and a 79 J20 truck tha only has 8 to 1 compression. They put 87 in manual for sales reasons not because it is best fuel. You should also know that detriot uses premium fuel in cars during EPA test and has for many many years but they are not required to state that on sticker.

----------------- The SnoMan

I run my 97 on regular, always have, and have yet to hear it ping. Many of the manuals now clearly state that putting fuels in above the required octane may actually hurt performance and is otherwise simply wasting money. If your vehicle requires fuels of greater than 87 and some of them do, then you should use mid or super but otherwise, with an average of a 10 cent per gallon increase per grade level, I just don't have that much money to flush down the toilet.

False. ALL EPA TESTING MUST be done with the fuel and lubricant specified in the ownwers manual. NO EXCEPTIONS. This is true since something like 1994. BIG fines for cheating.

*** Posted via a free Usenet account from ***

IF the engine pings on regular, and does not on premium, even the $0.20 per canadian gallon difference from regular to mid, and again from mid to premium, can pay for itself. My friend's G35 Chevy Van, with 350 V8 gets 6MPG towing his 30 foot trailer on regular 87, and

12MPG on premium 93. Lots more power on premium too, as the ECU isn't retarding the spark 9 full degrees.(checked with the ecu monitor) *** Posted via a free Usenet account from ***

Off corse you do not hear it ping because your ECM it controlling it before you hear it duh... I guess you believe everything you read in the manual which is written to be understood and address the concern or sales and the simple minded uninformed motorist. 87 octane is only good without spark control up to about 8 to 8.5 to one compression, beyond that, there must be spark control to control it and everytime you retard the spark you loos more power and MPG and cost you far more than the 10 cents a gallon that you are saving at todays fuel prices. Hook up a real time monitor to your OBD2 port and watch the spark with

87 vs higher octane gas and the difference is clearly seen. I had a 2006 Chevy 2500HD loanerwith a 6.0 this week and when I got it it was low on gas. I hooked up my equipment to it and monitored the timing and performance with the 87 in it and then put some 93 in it the there was a big difference in performance and likewise in timing. WOT timing was 5 degrees higher and overall part throttle was 3 to 5 degrees as well and less mass airflow and manifold pressure was required at same cruising speed and truck was a lot more responsive too. Those that think otherwise have never tried it. Also Detriot would not exclusively use 93 in MPG tests if it made no difference at all.

----------------- The SnoMan

You do realize that a 318/360 has no ability to retard spark based on knock/pinging, right?

Oh really, and how exactly is it accomplishing this? I am unaware of any knock sensor in my dodge.

I do believe that I clearly stated that it didn't ping. If it did, then you would be a fool to continue to operate it that way and I assumed that most in here would know that but if it doesn't AND the manual states to use 87, using higher will simply waste money.

If it "rattles" only under load, it is not valve noise, it is spark knock or ping. And I've driven cars where even though you could not hear ping, higher octane fuel provided more power and better economy - on a carbureted engine with no electronic controls.

*** Posted via a free Usenet account from ***

My 98 had an issue with spark knock under load there was a TSB and the PCM need to be reflashed with a new software version, they even put a sticker under the hood, I have not had a problem since and now have a 130k on her. Coasty

I agree that it is a waste of money using a higher octane fuel than required. The owner's manual recommendation isn't going to be right all of the time. As an engine gets older it forms carbon deposits on the pistons. These deposits create hot-spots that can cause pre-ignition (ping) when using low octane gas. You can tear the engine down to clean off the carbon deposits and continue to run 87 octane gas, or simply switch to the mid-grade or premium to stop the pinging.