What do you want. . .?

I tried this NG in both ways; nice/full of shit and mean/honest. Obviously, the mean/honest approach stirs responses and reveals the best from the ignorant. So I'll be mean and honest.
Recently did a D47 ball joint recall on a Durango and noticed the brakes were "real thin". Customer responded to the writer by saying; "why are you selling me crap I don't need, when I just want the recall done that I need?" After that, I chose not to mention the leaking front shocks and loose tie rod ends (not under warranty on this vehicle). After all, if brakes aren't important why is suspension and steering? Two weeks later the customer returns and complains to the service manager that we did not recognize the loose rod ends, and Midas who did their brake repair (that they did not need. . . remember?) did notice the problem. As a dealer we are cons for recognizing needed repairs while performing warranty services, yet we are idiots and inferior to independents when we don't. Make up your minds. Waiting to hear from the warranty kings and queens who have stories of repairs that "should have been done under warranty". Read the manual that you never opened, and came with the vehicle, it's not covered.
Brent
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Well Brent, it seems that your attitude is your worst enemy. Too many times, stealerships try to tack on extra work during recall and minor service calls that really isn't needed and people hear stories about it all the time. I would even go as far as to say that the stories heard make the problem seem far worse than it actually is and are greatly responsible for forming this attitude with the customers. Then you can tack on the dealerships rather high labor rates and parts costs and can you wonder why people react the way that they do? The point is that you also have an attitude when the customer doesn't listen to and do EVERYTHING that you say and think that they are asses and will be given and told nothing and that make you the biggest ass of all. How's that for being mean/honest??? The fact is that it WAS your responsibility to tell the customer everything that you knew was wrong with the car regardless of their attitude and because of your bad attitude, you didn't do it so you deserved to get complained about to your manager. What if one of these parts you chose not to tell them about failed and caused the customer to get into an accident? Would you justify your actions of not informing him/her by your complaint above? You actually should be fired if you keep this shit up.
--
If at first you don't succeed, you're not cut out for skydiving



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Your right on, this time .

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Stealerships?? Hmmmmm... there would be hell to pay in this NG if I referred to customers in such a disparaging manner...... but stealerships passes thru with comment...... double-standard?? Surely not!
Mike

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wrote:

interesting. a lot of the dealers on tdr resent that word. i would too, if i were in the business. the dealership that i go to isn't the greatest, but they do good work. they charge a ton, but i really don't resent that, their mechanics and employees need to make a good living too. i make a decent wage and don't resent them doing the same. on the one hand, i wish that they would show a little more concern for the problems that we customers bring in, but on the other hand, some of the things that they have to deal with would drive me crazy too. i just try to treat them right and for the most part, they do the same for me.

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Yup! The Golden Rule applies _both_ ways! Yes, the term "stealership" is resented. Those who use it paint with a mighty broad brush. When confronted, they always say somthing like, "well, I was screwed by a dealer once".... and proceed to relate a story that paints the dealer in a bad light. Well, in over 30+ years in the business, I could relate stories about customer antics that would make dealerships look downright honest! But, based upon the antics of a few, to paint the rest...... nope. Remember, you are usually treated by others the way you treat them.
Mike

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mean/honest.
the
recall
and
if
service
did
notice
it
make
you
everything
because
them
you
stealerships
dealer
LOL, you guy's love to make mountains out of mole hills. The term stealership was used more as a dig toward Brent with all of his whining about the customers than an attack on the dealerships in general. But the point still remains that I doubt that there is even a single dealership that hasn't ripped off at least one customer in either sales or service at some point in it's existence, including yours. Does that make them ALL bad ALL OF THE TIME??? NO, and I never said that they were so chill out.
--
If at first you don't succeed, you're not cut out for skydiving



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TBone:
I'm sure that could be said about ANY business or ANY individual for that matter.
Mike

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I have found it is all in the presentation. My 05 2500QC Cummins 4X4 has the dreaded "vibe". Talked to the SM and the shop foreman and they agreed to send both shafts out to be balanced, then if need be change the pinion angle. If that fails to do it, they will get the factory rep involved. Can't ask for more than that. Well, it shouldn't have the vibe in the first place.
Roy
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On Thu, 7 Apr 2005 00:13:41 -0600, snipped-for-privacy@webtv.net (Brent D) wrote:

======================I am a guy who plays with cars as a hobby....do enough of my own work that I have not one but two lifts in my garage ... BUT I hear what you are saying... and the only thing I can say is that your experiences are similar to almost any other individuals who "deal" with the general public... ..
Its called human nature,....
I will admit however that I avoid Dealers when I have to pay someone to do something on my cars that is beyond my capabilities...(skill, equiptment or time) .. I use a small independant shop .. I know the guy turning the wrenches ..what can I say.
Bob Griffiths
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On Thu, 7 Apr 2005 00:13:41 -0600, snipped-for-privacy@webtv.net (Brent D) wrote:

i think your problem is that you take everything personally. even the responses here brent. my advise is to grow up. what you should have done was to notice or mention everything for the customer that you felt needed attention, including the tie rods and shocks. that is pretty much the job that you do or at least should be doing. you are a mechanic, so be a mechanic and quit whining. if the customer choses to ignore your notice, let it go. not your problem. don't get pissed off about it, they own the friggin car, they get to decide what they want to do with it, even if they are an idiot.
worry about what you can control. you can control the honesty and quality of your work. you can control your own attitude.
don't worry about what you can not control. you can control what people do with the advise, no matter how great and honest it is, that you give them. you can not control other peoples attitudes.
or, if you decide to not follow my advise above, a good idea would be to invest in a good cemetary plot now because you are going to blow an o- ring before long.
just my thoughts brent.
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Brent D wrote:

Think of it this way: 1/2 of the paycheck you take home is for your mechanical skill set. 1/2 is for your people skill set. And finally, the other 1/2 is for Uncle Sam. ;)
Craig C.
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< snip the bad news >

It's friggin' ass wipes like you that make people hate service departments at dealership's. You are supposed to be an expert in the automotive repair/maintenance industry; Maybe it's time you acted like one. People don't hate you, they just hate hearing bad news. You have to deliver that bad news; it comes with the career YOU chose. Hell, if I take my car to Valvoline to get my oil changed, they always document on the bottom of the invoice things they see that need to be looked at. A simple note on the invoice is all that people want. Not too many times you run into people who LIKE to hear of problems with their vehicle, but that doesn't make it OK for you to be negligent in your job.
Which dealership do you work at again? I would rather walk then let a asshole like you work on my car.
--
Regards,
Slick Willy
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In alt.autos.dodge.trucks , Brent D wrote :

I was just in today for dealer service included in extended warranty/service pkg. On top of that they wanted to do a trans flush on a dakota with only 34,000 kms on it ! that would have been $200 can !! I asked if they were ready yet to replace my warped rotors, they weren't so they aren't getting the gravy either now.. If a vehicle model has proven chronic faults, ie ball joints and rotors then dealer should be alot more accomodating with warranty coverage.
PS you should have not still have put all that in writing on the work order report ?
<snip>

Where in my manual or sales contract does it say that ball joints and brake rotors will fail before my 32,000 km service interval ?
To add, while waiting in the waiting room I overheard then telling another client that their fairly new car would need a brake fluid flush and the fluid alone would cost $85 !! what ???? 5 star ????
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<mindless troll bait snipped> Don't know or care what your problem is but your are becoming a fool.
Roy
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On Thu, 7 Apr 2005 00:13:41 -0600, snipped-for-privacy@webtv.net (Brent D) wrote:

On the rag again Brent?
beekeep
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Brent, I want to know everything. What my truck needs what it cost (parts,labor,supplies=Total) and if the parts are in stock. Now I may or may not have the dealer due the repair. I will take your list go home due what I can on my own, what I can't will most of the time go back to the dealer.
example : Took my 02 Dakota in for the upper ball joint recall. When the job was done I had a list that said I needed the lower ball joints replaced, power steering flushed, brake fluid flushed, and that I had 35% left on front brake pads.
The only thing that I cared about was the lower ball joints. Parts were not in stock, the cost 125ea. labor 65x3.5hr = 227.50, front aliment 55 Total 532.50. Did the ball joints myself, used Moog ball joints list price 122ea, my cost 57ea (I have a cash and carry account at the parts store.) It took me 3hr. using hand tools only. I had a local shop do the front aliment $45. Total cost 159 and a Saturday morning.
A note to the wise if you don't have a good 1/2 inch drive socket set, and a very good ball joint press(I have a OTC/ snap-on) don't attempt this job.
Will deal with brake fluid flush when I do the front brakes. Will deal with power steering when I do the transmission and trans case service.
This would have went to the dealer if I couldn't have done the job. Have I had problems with my dealer? Yes, I had a transmission flush and they refilled with ATF 3 not the ATF 4 that it was shipped from Dodge with. They wouldn't fix it, and after I e-mailed Dodge several time the only thing they said was that we recommend ATF 4 in your Truck. Not that your must have ATF 4. Recommend?? is a big gray area to me. 10,000 and the trany is still good. I will change both filters and top off with ATF 4 after another 10,000 miles.
I still think when it comes to late model cars, and trucks your dealer knows best. But the dealer parts are overpriced. If you buy new from the dealer, how about a discount on parts when the dealer does the service.
So Brent, tell them everything even the ones that want to be an ass.
(Brent D) wrote:

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Suddenly, without warning, Brent D exclaimed (4/7/2005 7:13 AM):

So, just what's wrong with nice/honest, eh?
Incidentally, if I'd ever been to your shop, with your attitude, I'd take my truck elsewhere right quick. Not that I would end up there, since I ask around before choosing who will work on my truck, and I suspect that word-of-mouth would have me avoiding the place. Trust me, word gets around.
It's your *job* to tell me what's wrong with my truck, whether I like it or not. It's *my* job to decide whether or not to trust that what you're telling me is honest, and respond accordingly.
(I've been to shops that assume 'cause I'm a lady, I don't know anything about vehicles. They've been disabused of that notion, and will never again get my business. Word of mouth has lost them lots of business, now.)
Incidentally, what it sounds like to me is that the customer *did* listen to what you said, just use a poor way to say "Thanks. I'll get it fixed elsewhere", and did just that. That's their right as a consumer. You should have told him the full story, or at least put it on the invoice.
I prolly would have done the same thing. If the repair is not under warranty, and I have a second shop that I trust and is less expensive, I'll kindly thank the mechanic for pointing it out, state that I don't really want to get it fixed today, thanks, and go to my independent. Again, that's my choice as a consumer.
It's the dealership's choice to be more expensive than the competition, and I know for a fact that it's not because Mopar or whatever parts are better quality than what I'd get elsewhere.
jmc
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<snip>

No, it's not impossible. Factory training is quite political in a sense, the training involves only what the OEM allows, so true crap isn't identified as the crap that it is (the why is explained in the next paragraph). Also, and especially in the case of Chrysler, GM and Ford, factory training isn't necessarily performed by factory employees, it's subcontracted out to a private vendor, that private vendor hires (surprise) people off the street, dealership experience is not an absolute pre-requisite. (BTDT) Tools; available to anyone who wishes to purchase them. Some aftermarket equipment is better than what the OEMs offer to their dealers. 90% of it is still wrenches, screwdrivers, sockets and ratchets which we all buy from the same sources.

Repetition, don't know if it -is- an advantage, but it does -have- its advantages. Me, I'll take technical aptitude any day, after that, a fix it right mind set comes in a close second.

Quite possibly because there isn't XX degrees of separation between the customer (you) and the person who owns the business.
It's not unheard of for a dealership to farm certain work out to an independent because they don't have someone who has the skills to perform a certain service procedure or because they've long ago lost the tools needed to perform that service. My local Dodge dealer refers customers to me all the time. (Mikuni carburetors being a prime example) <snip>
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