305 vs 350

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I recently purchsed a 79 Camaro for my son and was told it had a rebuilt 350 engine. Someone told me today that the motor is actually a 305. I cannot find the engine VIN number, how can I tell the difference between
the two motors?
thanks in advnace
Gary
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m wrote:

There's a few ways. Easy: look for a 305 or 350 (or if you're really unlucky a 267) cast into the side of the block. Not sure which Chevy engines did this, but I've seen a couple (Pontiac did that.)
Harder: Casting #'s on block AND heads. You never know if it's a 305 block with 350 heads or ??? The problem is reading the dang numbers - they're cast in and never accessible.
Hardest: Pull a cylinder head and measure the bore and stroke. (350 is a 4" bore, 3.48" stroke. 305 is 3.7something and a 3.48" stroke) - all those specs will be online or any shop manual.
I'm sure some of the other guys probably have some magic trick that works better. :)
Ray
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Just my $.02, but I want to say that small blocks never had the displacement cast into them until relatively recently, when some had the metric displacement (5.7, 5.0, etc.). I want to say these would be found not far from the casting number back on the bellhousing. Anyrate, casting numbers are probably the most reliable method. Sometimes detective work may be needed as a given block may have been used in more than one displacement. A prime example is the 3970010 block casting number, which is a common 350, a much less common large journal 327, or a pretty damn rare 302. Cylinder head casting numbers can be viewed simply by removing a valve cover. www.mortec.com hosts a pretty extensive listing of casting numbers for sbc/bbc/W blocks, heads and cranks.
By my experience, most of the time a "rebuilt 350" mystery motor turns out to be a 3970010 350 with 882 heads and a "generic" LM1 cam. They're good for about 170 horses if I remember.
Should you want to go deep into the ID process, www.nastyz28.com hosts a good breakdown of the VIN pad stampings, including a suffix code chart. This will enable you to determine the (as assembled by the factory) displacement, power rating, application, build date/plant, etc. Note that when a smallblock is decked, the VIN pad stampings are almost always totally shaved off.
And I second the comment about the 267; I had one once. Worst thing ever--thankfully they only lasted 3 years.
On Thu, 16 Oct 2003 20:38:56 -0600, Ray wrote:

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says...

On a machined pad behind the alternator there is a partial VIN stamped that will match the VIN number on the dash. If they match the car still has the original engine and you should be able to find out what it has. One of the letters or numbers on the dash tells which engine was originally in the car.
If not, then you'll have to start looking for codes stamped on the engine block.
--
______________________________________________________________

Dennis Smith
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only the crank will tell you forsure... if the engine is not the oem.

350
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The vin # on the dash plate is a G or H if a 305, and a L if it's a 350. Post that first.
As everyone else said, on the engine pad, behind the alternator, there's a bunch of #s. Post them all here and one of us will identify it. Joe--ASE Certified Parts Specialist & 10th Ann.Club Tech Director '80 Carousel Red Turbo T/A, 26k orig. '79 "Y89" 400/4 speed 10th Ann. T/A, 57k orig '84 Olds 88 Royale Bgm 2 dr, 307 "Rocket" (lol), 141k and still going.... '80 T/A project car...
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Someone told me that a 305 has the oil dipstick on the drivers side, and on the 350 its on the passenger side... I just bought an '88 Formula with a 350 and it has the dipstick on the pass side.. so I was wondering if that was true...
--
Well, catch you later,
-KITT
1985 Blue Camaro 2.8L w/ T-tops
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wrote:

I can tell you this KITT, my 88' Formula with the 305 / 5 speed has the dipstick on the passenger side. My 68' with a 69' 350 has the dipstick on the driver side. That doesn't mean that the later 350's didn't change but I'd check the casting numbers on the block just the same. Post the numbers in a new post and I'll look them up for you.
Is the motor original, what is the VIN?
...Ron -- 68' RS Camaro 88' Formula Bird
http://www.frontiernet.net/~rscamero
Newly updated
Some are wise and some are otherwise
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The dipstick location has nothing to do with the displacement. Sometime back the 80's they moved the dipstick to the passenger side on all SBC's. - Gary

on
350
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puked:

A 327 has the dipstick on the driver's side, btw. -- lab~rat >:-) Do you want polite or do you want sincere?
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I have seen Formulas with the "Formula 350" deacls on the doors, and some with just "Formula" Like mine.... anyone know what the difference was?
--
Well, catch you later,
-KITT
1985 Blue Camaro 2.8L w/ T-tops
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The ones without the 350 in the Formula decal are 305 equipped cars.
If you look at the hood scoop on some of those that say FORMULA, you'll see "5.0 LITER". Joe--ASE Certified Parts Specialist & 10th Ann.Club Tech Director '80 Carousel Red Turbo T/A, 26k orig. '79 "Y89" 400/4 speed 10th Ann. T/A, 57k orig '84 Olds 88 Royale Bgm 2 dr, 307 "Rocket" (lol), 141k and still going.... '80 T/A project car...
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Na, this one according to Carfax.. ya that was pretty much a waste of money, said that there was like 6 owners.. but anyway.. it has been repainted.. so all the stickers and everything have been removed, but the "Formula" decals for the doors were replaced. I know it was repainted, kinda a shitty job too, because the dr door used to be red, you can see it in some places, and there are several places like around the headlights and around the spoiler where they sprayed blue where it shouldn't be... so all I have is the possibly finding the numbers on the engine. Oh, I was looking at the PHS page, and was wondering, it says I will get: A copy of the factory invoice or billing history card for your Pontiac, A letter decoding the options (where necessary), A copy of the dealer order form for that year, An official photo for that year Pontiac (if available). Other specific information for that year and model Pontiac (where available).
Now is that factory invoice the build sheet?
Well, catch you later, -KITT 1985 Blue Camaro 2.8L w/ T-tops 1988 Blue Firebird Formula 5.7L OR IS IT A 305?!?!?!?! w/ T-tops (Still looking for an '82 Black T/A!!!)
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Sounds rough. Hopefully you didn't pay more than 1000 bones for it, as that would be the most it's worth. These cars are a dime a dozen, so I'd pitch that one and go for something in better condition.
A 305 TBI is really a waste of time to soup up. Try to find a 350 Formula. At least you'll have something solid to build on (if mods are your thing).
PHS will give you copies of the Pontiac invoice/shipping documents for the vehicle.
That year has no "build sheet" per se, but you will get the major options on the sheets they send.
If the vin on the RPO sticker matches the VIN on the dash which matches the VIN on the door (probably doesn't you said it was changed), then you can start to decode that and see what was originally there. Then, get the codes from the engine and post it here.
Not sure what you're trying to do or what you've figured out already. If it was advertised as a 350, it would be an MFI engine originally. If I got there and saw a throttle body, I would have walked away because I know:
1) The guy is lying and really has a 305 in there, because a 350 never came stock TBI in an F body.
2) The engine was switched if it IS a 350. Who knows what you have there in what condition.
Me? This thing would have a for sale sign on it as fast as I could get to Home Depot to buy one. LOL.
Joe--ASE Certified Parts Specialist & 10th Ann.Club Tech Director '80 Carousel Red Turbo T/A, 26k orig. '79 "Y89" 400/4 speed 10th Ann. T/A, 57k orig '84 Olds 88 Royale Bgm 2 dr, 307 "Rocket" (lol), 141k and still going.... '80 T/A project car...
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KITT wrote:

I just thought of something. Do you know anyone in the racing business? Local short track nearby? They might have a "pumper" that can tell you the volume of one cylinder... most tracks have a limit of around 355-360 cubic inches and they test the winner's engine - quicker than a full teardown. Otherwise you need the numbers off the block or one head pulled (and the bore measured) to tell for sure exactly what's in there.
Ray
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Unfortunately around ehre that is something that (other than the ricers at night) isn't around here. (It being a college town and all) And there isn't a track for atleast 200 miles of here... so I dunno. But I pulled the alternator, and there was no numbers.. but then Dennis said thats because my alternator is on the dr. side, so I have to pull the A/C comptressor.. so I have to do that in the next few days.
--
Well, catch you later,
-KITT
1985 Blue Camaro 2.8L w/ T-tops
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Okay, so you looked at the block did you use a miror to try to see the numbers. Anyway to heel with the technical. Go to carfax type in you vin# it will tell you right off the bat what motor the car left the factory with. If you want an easy way to rule out the 350 if you have drum brakes then you dont have a 350. The Performance option group was standard with the 350 and included disk brake and a posi axle. If you do have disc brakes you have a 25-75 shot of having a 350 as performances option still had the 305...
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Your method might work if we were talking the original combinations of parts, but since this car is a hodge podge of parts anything could be under the hood.
However the answer is that the vehicle has the original 305 TBI vin code E engine, he already posted that a few days ago :).
(As most of us suspected). However he was told it was a 350, so he got duped a bit :(
Joe--ASE Certified Parts Specialist & 10th Ann.Club Tech Director '80 Carousel Red Turbo T/A, 26k orig. '79 "Y89" 400/4 speed 10th Ann. T/A, 57k orig '84 Olds 88 Royale Bgm 2 dr, 307 "Rocket" (lol), 141k and still going.... '80 T/A project car...
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Ok, I just took off the air cleaner, and looked under it (by the distributor) and I got soemthing... it says:
WI (or W1) GM 14102182
Can anyone tell me what that means?
--
Well, catch you later,
-KITT
1985 Blue Camaro 2.8L w/ T-tops
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Nothing of substantial value.....what are you looking to figure out? Joe--ASE Certified Parts Specialist & 10th Ann.Club Tech Director '80 Carousel Red Turbo T/A, 26k orig. '79 "Y89" 400/4 speed 10th Ann. T/A, 57k orig '84 Olds 88 Royale Bgm 2 dr, 307 "Rocket" (lol), 141k and still going.... '80 T/A project car...
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