GM Working On A 'Mustang Competitor'!!

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It was a swap you moron!
Go look at Hot Rod magazine from 68, and see the article. It was a straight 4 cylinder car and the swap took a good frame man at that time, something
you'd never accomplish. Because you're too stupid to know how to hold a cutting torch.
It was also a swap in the Tiger Alpine.
Not that you'd know anything about that either.
Now act your age and go to bed little boy, you're out of your league here!
Refinish King

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Idiot, Sunbeam sold them with 289s. Now please get back on your meds. There, I asked nicely.
Joe Calypso Green '93 5.0 LX AOD hatch with a few goodies Black '03 Dakota 5.9 R/T CC

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http://www.sunbeam.org.au/history /
(about 3/4 down)
Ian Garrad, manager of Rootes' operations on the West Coast of the USA, had been watching with interest the success of the AC Cobra. The Cobra was the result of fitting a Ford V8 into the AC Ace. In 1963, Carroll Shelby and Ken Miles were each commissioned to build a prototype Ford V8-powered Alpine.
The Shelby prototype was eventually presented to Lord Rootes who was sufficiently impressed to give the project the go ahead. The Mk I Tiger, introduced in 1964, combined the Series IV Alpine bodyshell with a 4.2 litre Ford V8 engine. The Tiger was assembled by Jensen in West Bromwich. It was dubbed Tiger in honour of the 1920's Sunbeam racing car of the same name. In some markets, however, it was sold as the Alpine V8.
http://www.sunbeam.org.au/models/tiger.htm
The Tiger, launched in 1964, was the result of fitting a Ford 4.2 litre V8 into the Sunbeam Alpine bodyshell. Initiated by Ian Garrad, it was developed from two Alpine V8 prototypes built by Carroll Shelby and Ken Miles respectively. The 4.2 litre engine produced 164bhp @ 4400rpm.
Tigers were built by Jensen Motors at West Bromwich. A small number were also assembled in South Africa from CKD kits. 6,546 examples of the Mark I were built.
The Mark II Tiger of 1967 received a 4.7 litre V8, developing 200bhp @ 4400rpm. Mark II production totalled 536 examples.
The takeover of Rootes by Chrysler led to the untimely demise of the Tiger. Chrysler did not want to be seen to be building Ford-powered cars, and did not have a suitable engine of their own.
The Tiger was sold in some countries as the Alpine V8. It is perhaps most famous for its role in the television series Get Smart.
...Ron -- 68' Camaro RS 88' Firebird Formula 00' Mustang GT Vert
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Thanks for that little bit o' history. I wasn't aware ol' Carroll was involved. The sports car club my parents belonged to had a couple of Tigers. So did a guy in the hood. They weren't rare in N. CA.
nb
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In 68 and later we were doing conversions to the four cylindered cars!
Plain and simple!
Refinish King

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Slow down there Joe, I've obviously had my differences with RK so I'm not defending him, but you're BOTH right. It WAS a swap, but it was also Factory engineered. Just like the Boss 429 project was a factory engineered *swap*. Both programs were similar in that the factory decided to shoehorn a motor into a chassis that was never built for it. Kar Kraft cut and reinforced shocktowers to make the Shotgun fit in the Boss cars. Sunbeam had some guy named Hans with a huge sledgehammer who knew just right where to beat the crap out of the firewall. The reason I know this is because I know people who have owned and currently own BOTH of these cars. The guy with the Sunbeam is a bodyguy and has shown me the sledge marks with the original factory paint over those marks. He knows exactly how it was done. The Boss needs no introduction.
--
Scott W.
'66 Mustang HCS
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Right. Simply put, the "first cut" of the Tiger was Shelby doing his thing, but it ended up being a factory-produced car. Call them what you will, but to me, neither the 429 nor the Tiger is a swap. They're factory cars.
Joe Calypso Green '93 5.0 LX AOD hatch with a few goodies Black '03 Dakota 5.9 R/T CC
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I found a post a I did in 2001 concerning the Lightning and 454SS. It should answer your Lightning vs 454SS questions...and maybe shed some light on the overall subject. I have NOT snipped any of the original post, allowing you to read why I was posting what I was. Now, after that is another long post I did on ALL of the original sport trucks...mostly. Anyhow, it is an old post, from 2001 as well, and should definitely be updated now that the bar has been raised. I hope you enjoy, sorry it is sooo long.
From: 2.3Sleeper ( snipped-for-privacy@mmcable.com) Subject: Re: Dodge VTS and Dakota R/T
Newsgroups: rec.autos.makers.ford.mustang Date: 2001-10-21 22:24:45 PST
V-8 performance from anybody is always a good thing. :)

Performance period is a good thing.

They were produced from 1990-1993, just 4 short years. Under the hood was a 7.4L EFI 454ci big block. Total number of units produced was 16,953 its best year in 1990 with a total of 13,748 units sold, that left a total of 3205 sold from 91-93. 1/4 mile times were low to mid 15 second range (stock) with a little timing work and a few other goodies these trucks were easily dipping into high 13's. They came with 3.73 gears, 32mm Bilstein gas-filled shocks and a 32mm front stabilizer bar, 12.7 to 1 steering ratio, and also a reduced payload capacity (sounds like the lightning huh?). You could get the same engine *special ordered* from the factory in a "Sport" edition of the truck (minus the other goodies), but not many of those were done. The truck was the official pace car of the 74th Indy 500.
Stats on the truck are as follows: (1990) 230hp, 385 ft/lbs torque The engine was worked over in 1992: 255hp, 405 ft/lbs torque
Introduced in 1993, the original Lightning followed a tried-and-true Detroit formula: Install a big engine in a small body. Small in pickup-speak means a two-wheel-drive regular-cab body, into which Ford slipped a 240-hp, 5.8-liter V-8. Performance was good for a pickup -- 0 to 60 in 7.2 seconds, 15.8 seconds in the quarter at 86 mph -- but nothing special in carland.
Twelve thousand of those Lightnings, priced at just under $22,000, (the 454SS went from $18,000 to $20,000) were sold between 1993 and 1995. After 1995, the Lightning went on a four-year hiatus until a new model based on the current F-150 debuted in 1999.
The Lightning returned in 1999. It could roar to 60 mph in 5.8 seconds and still tow a 5000-pound burden and carry 800 pounds of stuff. They only produced 8966 in 1999 and 2000.The truck made 360hp in '99 and '00. Thanks to a 90mm mass airflow meter (10mm larger than last year's), a larger intake-air opening in the fender well, and a higher-flowing intake manifold, SVT engineers have netted 20 more horsepower and 10 more pound-feet of torque from the supercharged V-8. The horsepower now stands at a massive 380 at 4750 rpm, and torque is 450 pound-feet at 3250 rpm. The Lightning runs $32,460 -- only $1460 more than last year's model -- and for that money, you get more horsepower than in any other production truck sold in the U.S.
*NOTE* Here is the kicker.
The new Lightning has a shorter final drive -- 3.73:1 vs. 3.55:1 -- and that means acceleration times have improved dramatically. Sprints to 60 mph now take 5.2 seconds, 0.6 second quicker than in the previous Lightning. The quarter-mile now whooshes by in an amazing 13.8 seconds at 104 mph, faster than an SVT Mustang Cobra and only a few ticks behind the $55,675 Mustang Cobra R, which performs the feat in 13.0 seconds at 111 mph. Top speed also crept up 3 mph to 142.

Good point.

Read above. It is! It seems that Chevy got out of the Performance truck game right as Ford was coming into it. For the record, every piece of info I can find on the 93 454SS and the 93 Lightning, show the 454SS being a touch faster in the 0-60 and the 1/4 mile. Maybe Chevy should have stayed in the game. Can you imagine where the 454SS and the Lightning would be now?
Don ManningFrom: 2.3Sleeper ( snipped-for-privacy@mmcable.com)Subject: Stats on several Performance trucks. Newsgroups: rec.autos.makers.ford.mustangDate: 2001-10-23 20:24:57 PST There is a thread going on in here about several different trucks and the performance numbers. I have taken the liberty of finding some info on these vehicles and am now posting it here, and in the before mentioned thread. I hope you guys like this!
I am sure most everyone here knows how fast the Lightning is and what it's hp and torque ratings are. As well, I am sure we all know what the 1/4 mile times and top speed are. Nevertheless, since we are having such a good debate over the quickness of these vehicles, I am going to post times for the different truck platform based vehicles which have been built *almost* strictly for performance and ass kicking. Here are the ratings and times for a select number of Sport/Performance Trucks.
454SS (1990-1991): 230hp, 385 ft/lbs torque. (1992-1993) 255hp, 405 ft/lbs torque. 1/4 mile = 14.9-15.7 Engine: 7.4 Liter 454ci Big Block V-8
Dodge Ram Indy 500 (1996): 245hp, 360 ft/lbs torque. 1/4 mile = 17.1 @ 83mph Engine: 5.9L V8
Ford Lightning (1993-1995): 240hp, 340 ft/lbs torque. 1/4 mile = 15.7 @ 86mph Engine: 5.8Liter 351ci V-8
Ford Lightning (1999-2000): 360hp, 440 ft/lbs torque. 1/4 mile = 14.1 @ 99mph Engine: 5.4Liter Supercharged 330ci Triton V-8
Ford Lightning (2001): 380hp, 450 ft/lbs torque. 1-4 mile = 13.8 @ 104mph Engine: 5.4Liter Supercharged 330ci Triton V-8
GMC Syclone (1991): 280hp, 360 ft/lbs torque. 1/4 mile = 13.8 @ 101 mph Engine: 4.3Liter Turbocharged/Intercooled 262ci V-6
GMC Typhoon (1992-1993): 285hp, 360 ft/lbs torque. 1/4 mile = 14.2 @ 98 mph Engine: 4.3Liter Turbocharged/Intercooled 262ci V-6
Dodge Shelby Dakota (1989): 175hp, 270 ft/lbs torque. 1/4 mile = 16.26 @ 84.08mph Engine: 5.2Liter 318ci V-8 (This was an authorized Shelby Vehicle)
Dodge Lil' Red Express (1978-1979): 225hp, 295 ft/lbs torque. 1/4 mile 15.7 @ 88mph Engine: 360ci V-8 (This was the truck that helped start it all)
So there ya go, I hope everyone appreciates the time it took to find this info. There are a few other trucks that could be included, as they were released as GT or Sport Editions, but these vehicles posted are *Limited Production* Performance Trucks. If you think any other truck platform based vehicle should be included than speak up damnit! Also, I took all of the 1/4 mile times I could find for each vehicle and calculated the average for each one. Obviously a Lightning and a Syclone could beat each other in times, depending on sea level, weather, temperature. So please don't tell me my info is inaccurate. I did my best to present a fair and accurate report on these vehicles.
Info gathered from http://www.syty.org , http://www.sportruck.com/factory/factory.htm
Don Manning---Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com ).Version: 6.0.709 / Virus Database: 465 - Release Date: 6/22/2004---Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com ).Version: 6.0.709 / Virus Database: 465 - Release Date: 6/22/2004
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I greatly appreciate it! Thank you. :)
I was never a hot truck fan, but a true hot rod fan never turns up his nose at kick-butt power and go-fast technology, no matter the platform. My brother had a '57 Chevy with the fish-bowl rear window and a 4-speed hydromatic. That sucker was quick!
I also remember the Lil" Red Express. A neighbor up the street had one in mint condition in about '88. Loved the vert stacks. But, I say the real origin of hot trucks was the Lil' Red Wagon, that drag strip show-off that gave every redneck on the planet a whole new reason to believe! :)
http://www.legacydiecast.com/xq/asp/id.H6150086/maker.Dodge/model.A100+Compact+Pick+Up-+Lil+Red+Wagon-+Bill+%22The+Maverick%22+Golden/scale.All%20Scales/qx/showroom_make.htm
(click on the small picture)
nb
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snip
Needed update:
Dodge SRT-10 (2004-?): , 500 hp @ 5600, 525 lb-ft @ 4200. 0-60 4.9; 1/4 mile 13.6 @ 105 (Feb '04 Car and Driver) Engine: 8.3 Liter 506 ci small-block based V-10

180 Out TS 28
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Yeah, I know updates are needed. It has been 3 years since I did all that.
Don Manning

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So how does the Dodge Ram SRT-10 compare to the Ford Lightning? Yeah I know it's more money but let's just compare performance.
On Thu, 24 Jun 2004 07:47:31 GMT, "2.3Sleeper"

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This basically sums it all up.
Usenet: One man's tech source, and another man's fantasy forum.
CobraJet
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"Refinish King"

OK, and you're yelling at him for crossposting. 'tard. Attention span getting shorter everyday huh? There's been great advances in Alzheimer's these past few years, take advantage of them.
--
Scott W.
'66 Mustang HCS
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Yo momma says what?
Refinish King

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On 21 Jun 2004 15:54:44 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@hotmail.com (180 Out) puked:

Curb weight includes the weight of the fuel. -- lab~rat >:-) Do you want polite or do you want sincere?
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Refinish King wrote the following, which while being attributed to fact was none the less being challenged::

I hit one of those in my 59 Ford truck one time, back in '79.
There I was, rounding a corner on a dark country road, and lo and behold, here comes this big-headed kid running down the road in flip-flops, granny panties and a Duke University shirt...
I had to swerve at the last minute, but I got him... ;)
Wm
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LOL!
But on a serious note, these children have parents who suffer the consequences of the misfortune every day.
I go out of my way to help underprivileged children in my area. i.e. building computers, with take off parts from the area computer stores, and help out troubled children. With less than desirable parents.
But, that was still funny as hell!
Refinish King

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Refinish King wrote the following, which while being attributed to fact was none the less being challenged::
I'm reminded on the motto "No man is as tall when he stoops to help a disabled child" which is adopted by The Shriners.
I am a Special Olympic volunteer, and have rallied my company to not only make monetary contributions but to help in local events. Our last event other than the Games themselves was an airplane pulling contest out at RDU airport this past May. With 125 teams of 'pullers' there, as well as tv & radio coverage (I actually was on WBBB 96.1 Rock's team this year, where we finished 8th overall, which IMO is not to shabby for a rag-tag team of radio call in people getting together for the first (and probably only) time) it was quite an event.
All my friends growing up were deaf. I learned sign language (ASL) to be able to communicate with this one guy, John Cunningham, so we would stop using so much paper writing notes to each other all the time. In that particular group of deaf people, someone non-deaf who is willing to take the time and learn their language, so to speak, is not an common occurence. You get to meet and learn of most every deaf person in a wide area (and as this was in a suburb of Sacramento, CA it was truly a wide area), and they invariably will ask you to translate for them, such as in civil proceedings and the like, where there is in fact a noticible lack of translators.
I have nothing but respect for the parents of these kids, all of them except for the father of John Cunningham himself, who was an complete ass and earned the disrespect he received.
I know this post is getting long, but will end it with this quick story:
While visiting John while he was in ASL class the language department at UCDavis, I mistakenly approached the lady working at the desk and, in sign ASL, asked her for the whereabouts of John. She replied, in ASL, that he was out for something but would return in just a few minutes. We started bantering back and forth, and 'talked' for nearly 10 minutes when all of a sudden the phone rang. She picked it up and, much to my amazement, fielded the phone call.
Afterwards, I looked at her and said aloud "I thought you were deaf?" to which she replied "I thought -You- were deaf!"
Wm

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LOL
A good one!
Refinish King

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