$100 per hour

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I was curious if anyone thought it was reasonable to pay someone with a High School education two times more than a senior computer programmer?
A unionized auto worker makes more than TEN average hourly workers.
They snap plastic parts together, give 2 hour breaks out of 8 hour shifts meaning they work 6 hours and get paid for 8 hours.
In 10 years Ford and GM will merge and move all factories to foreign countries that do not allow unions. They will never return.
Hey, at least those guys making $100 per hour can have honor.
Honor pays the rent, buys food, etc.
Just think, they could, after 30 years, make as much as $20 per hour at wal-mart as a mid-level manager.
Do you want nice or sincere?
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If that's what they typical assembly line worker is making for drone work it seems a little steep. At $100 per hour that would mean they make over $200,000 per year and I rather doubt that is the case. A quick look online produced a pay of $40 per hour, which I think it also too high for what they do.
On Thu, 29 Mar 2007 23:34:42 -0400, Bob Brown <.> wrote:

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They do not get paid $40 an hour, it is closer to $25 per hour in wages. The $40 is what it cost management in "labor costs per hour." That includes the cost of benefits, SS taxes, unemployment tax costs all the way down to the maintenance costs of employee parking lots etc. The actual wage difference is around $4 more per hour in wages than the import assembling workers earn in foreign operated plants. There total labor costs for non-union auto workers is around $15 per hour less, (except for the workers in the UAW GM/Toyota plant in California,) because they do not offer equal benefits nor do they offer a pension plan.
What is ironic is selling price of import assembled vehicles do not reflect those lower labor costs. Vehicle from Toyota etall actually cost the buyer and average 20% to 30% more to drive home than a similar size and equipped domestic vehicle. That reveals a lot about import buyers, it seems.
mike

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On Fri, 30 Mar 2007 12:29:46 -0400, "Mike Hunter"

Add BENEFITS and WAGES together and you reach $100 per hour for senior level unionized line workers at GM or FORD.
They each spend more on health care insurance than steel.
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On Fri, 30 Mar 2007 15:06:43 -0400, Bob Brown <.> wrote:

I was a skilled tradesman in a GM plant until I retired in 2005. My pay rate was $31.15 per hour. Line workers made 3 or 4 dollars less. There's NO WAY my benefits amounted to $68.85 per hour! Based on 2,000 hours per year, that's $137,700 per year - NO WAY.
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On Fri, 30 Mar 2007 17:24:59 -0400, David Starr

YOU didn't pay those extra BENEFITS so of course you'd not know or believe what it costs.
YOU don't pay my phone bill but that doesn't mean it isn't real.
Congrats on landing a $31 per hour job, something most people with 4-year degrees will NEVER attain. But I guess cancer researcher's aren't worth $31 per hour.
Good day
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Bob Brown <.> wrote:

And you're in a better position than David to know the true costs because?
Hell, anyone who has ever paid for health insurance under COBRA knows what the employer pays.

What does your phone bill have to do with what an assembly line worker is paid?

Who's fault is it that they're bad negotiators?

If that isn't what they make, apparently not. If you are a cancer researcher and you're not happy with the pay, you probably should have put a little more thought into what motivated you to pursue that line of work to begin with.
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I guess there was some part of, '$40 is what it cost management in "labor costs per hour." That INCLUDES the cost of benefits, SS taxes, unemployment tax costs all the way down to the maintenance costs of employee parking lots etc.'
Perhaps he is not aware the college professors, that belong to a Union, are better paid than those that do not. Same is true of unionized nurses and auto workers. ;)
There are all kinds of kooks running around the internet. Some are prone to believe anything. Hell some in the NG believe the WTC was imploded by the CIA and Americans never landed on the moon. LOL
mike
"Bob Brown" <.> wrote in message wrote:

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On Mar 30, 11:44 pm, Bob Brown <.> wrote:

Wipe the rabid spittle off your chin and do the math.
$31/hr is $64,480 per year. A research assistant with a basic science degree would earn around half that figure, but it's an entry-level position that doesn't involve much more than tending machinery and writing down results as directed by the senior researcher.
A senior researcher in the biomed field would be in the neighborhood of twice that salary, maybe as much as $250K for someone well- renowned.
An entry-level New York City schoolteacher earns roughly $30/hr (not $64K/yr because they don't work a full 2080-hour year).
A midlevel engineering job - four years school plus two to five years on the job - would be between $30-$35 per hour.
Once you've cured cancer, etc, come back here and we'll all chip into a subscription to get your raise to $31.50.
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Your source that says $100 is obviously wrong or else GM is lying to us shareholders! GM stockholders report list just over $40 per hour in average wages and benefits per represented employees. The average for exempt and non exempt workers is somewhat higher
From what I know about the total labor cost vis a v the Machinists Worker Union that represented the workers in my business is that "labor costs" includes wages as well as the cost of all their benefits, SS taxes, unemployment taxes, uniforms and other costs all the way down to the maintenance costs of our employee parking lots etc. ;)
mike
"Bob Brown" <.> wrote in message wrote:

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Even though Subarus, Toyotas etc are non union they cost more because of better QUALITY. Instead of using the cheapest components they buy better ones. The greedy auto workers killed the US car makers. Even $25/hour is high for unskilled assembly work. Pay that to someone without the UAW entitlement mentality and they will work hard and be diligent building a better car.

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Ya' right. Just because import brand charge so much more for parts is no indication the are any better. The foreign car companies KNOW their customers. They know they will pay more when they buy parts, just like they paid more when they bought their cars and accepted less than wholesale for their trade. They know that they will gladly pay $20 an hour higher shop rates when they have them serviced, because they "think" they are better. LOL
mike
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snipped-for-privacy@backpacker.com wrote:

Yeah, it's all those greeeedy union workers! http://money.cnn.com/2007/04/05/news/companies/ford_execpay/index.htm?pos tversion 07040510
--
B.B. --I am not a goat! thegoat4 at airmail dot net

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On 7 Apr 2007 04:09:57 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@backpacker.com wrote:

You've not been watching or reading the news...
http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p447
SteveL
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wrote:

$100 per hour is WAGES + BENEFITS and is certainly $100 per hour for unionized ford/gm line workers.
Each company spends more of Health Care Insurance than Steel.

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Your post leaves much to the imagination.... "auto worker" is a broad term and $100/hr is, these days, typically in the neighbourhood of a dealers door rate.... I can assure you that the only "auto workers" earning that kind of faloose will be guys like Dale Armstrong (Double A Dale used to be Kenny Bernsteins tuner). If you don't know who these folks are.......
Anyway.... I don't belong to a union and I'm a grade 8 drop out and I'm gettin' real long in the tooth.... I can't do a brake job or what have you any faster than one of our young lions..... Ohhh, but the stuff that is in my head.... A lot of it will never be found in a manual.... A lot of it is stuff that another tech will spend hours and hours trying to discover (not learn - discover). Computer programmers are, sadly, a dime a dozen unless they have some fantastic new way of writing code that is tight, simple and makes a good cup of coffee (not like the current crop of bloatware that makes us need bigger and bigger hard drives, faster processors and bigger bank accounts).
Are there overpaid auto workers? Oh, you bet..... But there are techs that are worth their weight in gold. We are the guys that can take a tough concern and fix it for what I would consider a reasonable price (as in not replacing everything looking for a cure).... we are the guys that can take a concern where damned near everything has been replaced and fix it....
If my job was easy, you wouldn't be asking this question.....
Me? I'm just curious if anyone thinks that a computer programmer should be worth 32 billion dollars (give or take)????? Might have something to do with what he had in his head....
"Bob Brown" <.> wrote in message

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<...>

Actually, computers are cheaper than ever. And I have never seen a way of writing code that makes coffee.
Jeff
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oh, I thought you where telling me about the new rates that the high school graduate mechanics where charging.
I guess it isnt fair that paying for an education dosnt guarantee you a good job but its probably supply vs. demand and none of us want to take our own garbage to the dump apparently.
"Bob Brown" <.> wrote in message

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wrote:

Hey why not? Let's support the idea of paying assembly line workers more than people who research cancer or other non-important jobs.
Sounds like a winner.
I aint mad, jealous or nothing. I just find the DEFENSE of those kind of wages silly.
Why would anyone defend people who contract themselves out of a job?

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What union are you referencing? The employees in my company were members of the Machinist Union. Our contract required those will higher specific skills to be paid more than those on jobs requiring lesser skills. We could demote or fire any employee that failed to maintain the skill level at we compensated him. We had total control over production levels, staffing and job assignments
We never were forced to keep a 'poor' worker. We could fire any employee who constantly failed to do his job properly, come to work on time, left work early, failed to report off when they were unable to work was insubordinate, stole for us or had a physical confrontation in the workplace etc.
I can't imagine a much large company than my under 500 employees, with much better lawyers, signing a contract that would have any less control over its employees then I had over mine
mike

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