50 Billion dollars to GM is not real money

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First off I'm not an American. I didn't elect your republican president nor your democratic president. From this view point one can't see any detectable difference between the two.

Depends how you measure. That's the deceptice part with their stupid statistics. It's not possible to an accurate measurement. No two people are the same. Their purchases may be similar in some areas, different than others. The economy is far too complex. Measurements are generally done selectively and mostly by gov't so you can bet your shrinking dollar they will put a spin on the numbers.

What you say is true. Of all administrations. Points out the major defect of a democratic society. It will eventually self destruct.

War. War. War. Perfectly true. That's what gov't is all about. Gov't is always at odds with the governed.

Perhaps you can list a country that ISN'T following the same path? AFAIK, all are progressing at similar speeds, slower, then faster, then slwoer again but allin teh same direction.

While you watch the country to the north also melt down.
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labatyd wrote:

"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote."
"When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic."
Benjamin Franklin
--
Bill Putney
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Bill Putney wrote:

Being "well-armed" might have given you liberty in Franklin's time.
Today, a gun isin't going to help you when the agent of your destruction and turmoil is a letter from the IRS or a bank, and NOT a minute-man dressed in a quaint uniform carrying a musket.
The pro-gun lobby doesn't seem to understand that.
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MoPar Man wrote:

I'd say that both matter, i.e., are not mutually exclusive. Just because there's a new tyranny that didn't exist in Franklin's day doesn't mean the first threat doesn't exist anymore.
--
Bill Putney
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Why do you suppose the Feds want to take away guns? An armed and angry populace is not something the really wish to confront.

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Relax, just curious. I'm not plotting against you. If "the Feds" wanted to take away guns, they'd pass the laws to do it. Looks to me like they aren't even trying. But the NRA, lobbyist for the gun manufacturers, sure has the suckers lining up to buy guns and ammo. I've heard ammo prices are way up. Pretty funny.
--Vic
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Not paranoid yet. But I'll go out on a limb here and say that it will happen someday. Gun ownership still has strong support in the US backed by your constitution. It won't be easy to overcome but look how much has changed over the past century. Registration and restrictions will come first. Possible within the next term if Obama gets re-elected.
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You're already paranoid, and don't have the facts. Here's a "carry law" graphic for you. Probably won't change your mind, though. Maybe drugs would work. http://www.kc3.com/CCW_progress.htm
Hey, come on down to the states. I got some ammo to sell you. But it ain't cheap.
--Vic
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labatyd wrote:

Supposedly about 20 states are working on a plan to have guns manufactured in their states, clearly marked as so, and sell them only in those states so that Federal laws which only apply to commerce done across state lines will not apply under Constitutional state's rights.
http://www.saysuncle.com/2009/05/11/gun-battle-in-montana /
And for those who only accept information if it comes from left-wing news sources: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/30482736 /
Of course this will only work if the Constitution is not completely done away with.
--
Bill Putney
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Bill Putney wrote:

And just as occurs today, those 20 states will be sued as supply sources by states in which LEOs and rational legislators limit gun ownership.
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News wrote:

Laughable! Let's compare violent crime statistics of the pro-gun states with those with the (barf) "rational" legislators that limit, hinder, or just plain eliminate gun ownership of law abiding citizens, shall we? OK - so the more liberal "let's see if we can get some free money out of this by suing the other states" idiots do some frivolous lawsuits with lawyers of the John Edwards ilk rather than create a cultural and legal environment (you know - kind of like the Constitution says) that doesn't result in a black market for smuggled guns in their states.
I'd much rather have the legislators that are creating an environment of freedom, individual responsibility, and safety in their states than the ones who make their states ultimate hell holes by passing legislation and taking actions in the name of accomplishing safety and quality of life but in fact which actually create exactly the opposite.
Hmm - let's see. Live in a state that is free and values individual freedom and responsibility, *OR* live in a state that stifles same and creates a crime-ridden state in the name of doing just the opposite. Hmm - tough choice.
You have to ask what is the end result as far as freedom and safety and (again) abiding by the Constitution.
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