Ford F series loses title as top-selling vehicle in May

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On Wed, 4 Jun 2008 11:09:43 -0400, "C. E. White"


Are you joking or trying to look like a maroon?
That "smaller" Hilux is still 4100+ pounds, just like the North American Tacoma. I sat in one in Iceland.
2.4 inches narrower and 1.2 inches shorter? <G> Those are slightly different body contours. The width is probably the plastic over fenders that snap on.
I gotta' say it again... _1.2 INCHES_ SHORTER??? =8^)
Ed, know when to let it go! <G>
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"Valued Corporate #120,345 Employee (B A R R Y)"

The length for a truck is pretty much dictated by the smallest cab that people can fit in and the length of the bed. The track of the Hilux is almost 3 inches less and the wheelbase is over 6 inches less. None of those is related to the plastic fender flares Toyota tacks on to the Tacoma in the US. In my prior note, I only compared the dimensions for similar 4 door models with the short bed. I would expect the length to be similar for these vehicles. UK men are not substantially smaller than US men, and the bed lengths are the same. The shortest US Tacoma (4x2, reg cab) is 190.4 inches long. The shortest UK Hilux is actually longer, but then they don't offer a short bed on the reg cab in the UK.
The curb weight of the European Hilux trucks range from 3604 lb for a base regular cab 4x2 to 4177 lb for the double cab 4x4. All the UK spec Hilux trucks include diesel engines, which I suspect are considerably heavier than US spec gasoline engines. The US spec Tacomas are actually considerably lighter than the Hilux. The regular cab 4x2 has a curb weight of only 3200 lb. The Tacoma 4x4 double cab with the long bed (which is not available in the UK) is close to the European Hilux with a curb weight of 4155 (despite the lighter engine and much longer bed and the much longer length - 221 in, 14 inches longer than the longest UK Hilux). The US spec Tacoma also has a lower payload capacity, only 1495 lb compared to over 2300 lb for the UK spec Hilux.
I guess the net is, although I like the US Tacoma, it is unnecessarily larger and can carry less than the Hilux trucks available elsewhere. I suspect it also rides better, has a nicer interior, and is much quieter. For use on my farm, I'd love to have the 2300 lb payload capacity. I've actually had more than that on my Frontier (46 50 lb bags of seed, plus me, plus tools - probably a total payload over 2700 lbs) but I would not want to drive far like that. It seems to me with a 2300 lb rated payload capacity, I'd be able to get 3200 on the truck or more...
Ed
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On Thu, 5 Jun 2008 13:37:00 -0400, "C. E. White"
Have you sat in both trucks?
I have.
So, feel free to write paragraph after paragraph of "yabut".
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"Valued Corporate #120,345 Employee (B A R R Y)"

And what does that prove? You seems to ty to claim that the Hilux sold in Eurpoe and the Tacoma are the same truck under the skin, when clearly they are not. You seem to dismiss difference in width, track, wheelbase, and payload as trival, yet they are real. I agree that the current European Hilux is much larger than prior models, but it is still not as large as the current US spec Tacoma. Interestingly, in Australia, they sell yet a different size Hilux:
Lenght: 4975, 5130, 5255 mm = 196", 202", 207" (similar to a Tacoma, but we discussed why that would be the case already) Width: 1760 mm = 69.7" (almost 5" narower than a Tacoma) Track Frt/Rr: 1510 mm = 59.5" (almost 4" narrower than a Tacoma) Wheelbase: 3085 mm = 121.5" (around 6" sharter than a Tacoma)
Is this a significant difference?
And in Austraila, they get the gas V6 and I4 and the 3.0L Diesel. I am jealous.

No, I have not sat in a European Spec Hilux (unless you mean the "good old small ones"). Have you sat in an Asian spec Hilux? I have sat in a Tacoma (my SO's father ownes an Access Cab and I test drove one before I bought the Frontier). Specs are specs. Despite your assertions, the specs indicate that the European Hilux is both smaller and more capable than the US Tacoma - at least if you actully need a truck instead of a reduced function car. This is my major gripe about half ton trucks inthe US. They have gone from being work trucks to some sort of jacked up faux car thing. Ford has been as guilty of this as anyone. In seems that each new F150 model is a less attractive work truck than the previous model (at least since the mid 90's). The current Tundra is even worse than the current F150, at least if you want a work truck. I suppose if you want a hulking pig to impress your neighbors, it is as good a paper weight as anybody else's POS but as far as I am concerned it was a huge mistake (as is the current F150, and probably the future F150 as well).
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On Thu, 5 Jun 2008 13:37:00 -0400, "C. E. White"

Enjoy the pics, Ed...
<http://www.tacomaterritory.com/forum/showthread.php?t ‡835>
That white Hilux is shockingly smaller than the silver Tacoma.
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Mike hunt wrote:

What draws you to this conclusion? Mr. Truett chose not to discuss the sales figures for the Tundra or, for that matter, other lines of trucks, like the trucks made by the auto maker who sells the most light trucks, GM.
Toyota reported sales of 12,144 Tundrae (or Tundras).
http://www.toyota.com/about/news/corporate/2008/06/03-1-sales.html
Jeff

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Probably because the trend is that trucks as a market segment are universally in a decline.
nate
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Not shocking. I imagine novelty truck usage is dying with the soaring cost of gas prices.
F150's and trucks will always be a seller because of commercial use... However, even in my ritzy suburb, we have seen a drop in the use of trucks by teenagers and so forth.

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On Tue, 03 Jun 2008 20:58:08 GMT, "Don't Taze Me, Bro!"

There you have it...

Exactly.
Some people really do _need_ Suburbans, Silverados, F150, 250, and 350's, Tundras, etc... Even E-series vans, 4x4 V6 Tacomas and Frontiers, etc... have uses.
It's the Ridgelines, Avalanches, H2's, and the 24" wheeled Tahoes and quad cab, 5' bed F150's, Tacomas, Silverados that'll be gone.
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"Valued Corporate #120,345 Employee (B A R R Y)"

Some do, but not the majority. I don't think we have seen the end of large vehicles though. Large vehicles bring comfort. Vehicle companies are hard at work making these vehicles evergy efficient.

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Don't Taze Me, Bro! wrote:

I think Valued might be right about the Hummers. However, the Ridgelines, Tahoes, Quadcabs, etc., have uses that some people find worth the price (including the fuel).
But more people will be buying cars than trucks for personal transportation. Toyota, hwoever, makes a Toyora Tacoma that gets 25 mpg highway, with a small engine and manual tranny.
Jeff
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"Valued Corporate #120,345 Employee (B A R R Y)"

How dare you forget to mention the Escalade!
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Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:

Don't forget the drug dealers, Hollywood types and Hollywood wannabes will still buy the Escalade.
Jeff
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Yeah, you're right the economy is in the septic tank and the gas prices are in the stratosphere.

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Of course. The new F-150 is butt ugly!!

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Actually, there are other big changes in the US market:
1) GM sold less than 10,000 more vehicles than Toyota. In other words, Toyota sold almost as many vehicles as GM in the US. 2) GM is closing four plants that make trucks/SUVs. 3) Total GM sales down 28%. 4) Chrysler is in deep doo-doo, with truck sales down nearly 1/4 and car sales around 1/3. 5) Toyota sales down 8%. 6) Honda had its best month ever in the US, with a 15.6% increase in sales.
Interesting month for car sales.
Jeff
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Ford even had some good news as far as car slaes were concerned. Fusion, Focus, and even the Taurus are doing OK. The Mustang is in the toilet though. Overall Ford CAR sales were up in May. Of course a minor increase in car sales could not offset a major decrease in ttruck sales.
However, overall, I would have to give Fords new CEO high marks. He amde some tough decisions when he came on board, but for the most part they appear to be the right ones. IMy farm is near the Norfolk Ford palnt that was closed down. It was tough on the worker there, but clearly it was the right move for Ford. I do wonder if Ford might reconsider the decision to shut down the Ranger plant. Seems to me that truck might get new life with current gas prices.
Ed
Ed
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rode well, too. i'm not a ford fan and was really impressed. it beat the chevy and subaru same-class boxes i've rented recently.
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