Correct. It occurs to me that cars with standard transmissions will not need the torque converter removed. Although, I guess it could be argued that said tranny could indeed be removed without touching a torque converter. Or... am I missing something else on this?
Whatever Neil. You've contributed nothing to this thread but this inane distraction. Have it your way, as I've no interest in playing your little game. Next time why don't you consider offering advice to a thread instead of this kind of useless crap.
Hardly Mike. You've got two experienced mechanics with a probable combined experience of over 70 years disagreeing with you.
On the contrary, I've likely saved the OP from doing something that he'll wish he hadn't were he to follow your recommendations.
Not -my- game, it's the OEMs game, they specify the removal procedure. (usually, they're correct)
Advice on usenet comes in many forms, if the soccer daddies would shut the f*ck up, the pros wouldn't need to spend time correcting the wild goose chases, i.e., the 01 Malibu belt thread...
======== ========
Mike Marlow wrote:
========== ========== Mike, you are missing something.
Most FWD trannies ......MUST...come down with the convertor still in the tranny.
trust me on that.... A fact.
If the OP wants to attempt this thing...... at home..... on the ground... with a floor jack.... no air compressor... no impact guh.............. no engine hanger............. no experience.....................
he better get ready to yank the engine out!!!!!!!!
cuz......
when he gits that sucker bout halfway out hanging by the wiring harness, filler tube lodged in the coil pacs, rack'n'pinion jerked out the steering coupler, back of tranny case wedged into the fender well, oil pres. switch broken, cv boots ripped open, ..............
well.........
he's gonna have to yank the eng to make things easier for him to fix.
that's all IF.......he done dropped the thing on his body and crushed a vital organ.
I personally don't see the scense in him taking 4 days to add a couple hundred dollars to the task, or living with parts he damaged, simply because WE.....didn't tell him that he BETTER NOT....try this at home. He's going to end up having to buy parts he broke...that he shouldn't have broke.....or wouldn't have broke.....if he would jest realize that this little task here.....is outside his ability to perform in a proficient manner.
respectfully submitted for review, debate, confirmation, discussion.
take it for what it's worth... consider the scource.
~:~ marshmonster ~:~
Two? You're the only one who has hung up on this point.
Right. You just keep telling yourself that. While you're at it Neil - why don't you just list all of the problems the OP would have encountered by removing the converter from the trans? Get creative because you haven't set the world on fire with your points up to this point.
Ok - so post the OEM procedures and demonstrate where they differ from what I posted. Without that is, relying on your weak semantics game. As I stated early on in this foolishness - please explain how the flywheel is to be removed with the torque converter attached. Forget all of your other word games and try - I know it will be hard for you, but try to understand the context of a comment without trying to prove you know so much more than the next guy, and hanging on trivial minutia as the mainstay of your argument.
Hell - I admitted my misunderstanding there - never took a stand that I was right. Unlike you, I don't mind not knowing everything. I don't feel the need to show up the world like you do.
Here Neil - let me make this easy for you. I stand in awe of your knowledge (even though you haven't demonstrated any of it in the form of helpful advice). I'm nothing in the shadow of your greatness, even though you don't demonstrate it beyond your demand that other simply accept it. No problem. I don't waste much time with folks like you Neil. Won't waste any more. You'll be right on things in the future and I'll be wrong on something again - I can deal with that. I'll simply satisfy myself that I don't waste any money (and I haven't for over 35 years), on talk-too-much, offer-too-little "pros" like you. I've survived very well without the likes of you and will continue to do so. Soccer daddie? If only you had a clue...
Trust me - I'm not disputing that. Never did. The semantics battle with Neil never resulted in me saying the converter should come off in any order - just that it had to come off.
Go back and read my reply to the OP - I stated the same - that he should not try the job.
Mike, you were correct in saying that the torque convertor has to be removed to replace the flywheel. Whether it's removed with the transmission or otherwise, it still has to come out of the vehicle. The problem, as I see it, is how you said it.
"you have to pull the transaxle and remove the torque convertor"
Your words *imply* pulling them separately, which is never the preferred way of doing it. There are several reasons why, including high risk of damaging the pump and/or seal or bending the input shaft. Not to mention that there often isn't enough clearance to pull the tranny back far enough to clear the convertor.
Having said all that, nobody is perfect (including myself) and people who come here for advice get what they pay for. You are one of the most prolific on topic posters here and I enjoy your participation. Keep 'em coming.
Dave
You do lack reading comprehension Neil. I asked where the OP had heard that, he replied, and another poster posted the procedure. Pretty simple. I never stated an objection to the OP's claim in the first place - simply stated that my older model was not the same *and* allowed that there might even have been changes made over the model years. You are a peach Neil - when you get desperate in an argument, you keep shifiting and bringing up anything you can grasp - the dying breaths...
So profound. I'd ask you to get more creative, but you gave that your best shot yesterday. Not sure you need any more encouragement to talk the dirty talk.
That wasn't better - come on, you can do better than *that*.
Nope. Don't drink. Don't need it.
Sure Neil - the ones who held the warranty on the car. No reason for me to do what they are obligated to do for free. I've done the job myself on the GM motors. I don't need to prove to myself that I can do it again.
Good Neil - another redeeming trait - creativity. There hasn't been one lie I've posted. You are showing your colors again Neil. Desperate, and grasping. Keep it up, this shade of red looks good on you Neil.
Dave:
Thanks for the comments. I agree with everything you posted above and tried to even acknowledge that very early in my participation in this thread. For more than one reason my acknowledgment didn't take and things have degraded in a fast way to the point where they are now. Not the least of that is my responsibility for continuing this from my end. Sometimes I can rank right up there with the worst of them at not letting go. Some of it has to do with a couple of posters who seem more intent on stirring stuff up than allowing for the way conversations go. This really could have been a much different thread...
You can wish in one hand and shit in the other.
Duh. But you couldn't help yourself. Just had to interject some totally irrelevant factoid in classic usenet dweeb fashion. hell, I'll bet that there's been changes made since 1964, why didn't you offer advice for a 1965 then?
Does that mean you want to eat me?
No dying breaths, just pointing out the obvious.
Ummm... you were saying something about 'bringing up anything you can grasp?'
Good for you.
So, you scorn "pros" such as myself as long as there is money involved. All that means is that your standards vary according to price. It also means that the gaskets are going to fail again, probably out of warranty at which point you'll get to prove to yourself that you can do it again. Unless the camshaft snaps, or the crankshaft bearings get wiped out. Damn, you're so smart!
Nothing creative about questioning a statement such as: "You have to pull the transaxle and remove the torque converter." (your exact words)
Pull the transaxle and remove the torque convertor. reads like; Pull the transaxle, then remove the torque convertor. The way you list it and the order in which you list it suggests that the OP should first pull the transaxle and once he's done that, remove the torque convertor. Must be something special about that torque convertor that it justified it's own separate mention, don't you think? I mean, out of all the precautionary advice you -might- have given, you chose the superfluous, the redundant, that which didn't need mention. May sound different to you, may sound different to everyone else subscribed to this group. May be that you and a bunch of others can't parse a sentence. Pity your parents paid for such a crappy education. I'm certain that you feel that the bell curve makes you.... equal.
Well Mike, you've put so much spin on this that it's starting to look like a barber pole. Quite the expert you are....
Now, that would be a selective parsing you chose. You're spinning Neil. Come on Neil - pull out of it and put something good on the table. Go back and grab my following quote where I stated that the above meant to pull it from the car - the same exact wording that your bud Marsh used, albeit before he said those words. It's unfortunate that you understand so little of the nature of conversation. You likely end up in ether battles like this often, don't you Neil?
It's amusing the way that you suggest alternative precautionary advice that I might have given when your very own postition and contribution to this entire thread has been nothing more than obtuse comments and sophmoric attempts a insult. You sir, might have picked up on my original comment with a suggestion to the OP, or you might even have asked me to clarify what I meant since it so clearly disagreed with what you *might* has said, had you indeed offered anything. Rather, you chose an obtuse approach which I replied to in like manner. In fact, there came a point where that clarification was made. You elected that it wasn't good enough and that you were going to play the semantics game. You should take your own advice and study sentence structure with an eye on your comments.
You've displayed an amazing ability to be the pot calling the kettle black during this dialog Neil as well as a very advanced ability to jump from point to point as you have lost credibility in your position. You mastery of ad-hominum attacks is without equal. Unfortunately, what you've displayed in your technique is that you really did not have much of an argument to stand on and you've had to shift from argument to argument in order to *attempt* to keep me on a defensive - something you've never achieved. Now you're on to sentence parsing. Yet another diversion. You've failed Neil - this is not the big catastrophic event of usenet history that you're trying to make it. A simple conversational comment which was later qualified, and you've not rested in your attempt to turn this into something that it's not.
Spin? - That would be your technique Neil. All I've done throughout this is respond to your comments. Any rotational direction is to your credit and yours alone. But... that's the nature of a spin artist - create the spin and then blame the other party.
Ahhh - but I never claimed to be an expert - that was your claim. Spin Neil, spin.
Where's the original poster? He's in an insane asylum after having been thoroughly confused by this thread. Yes, it's a slam-dunk no-brainer that he shouldn't attempt this job since he doesn't have the experience or equipment to do it. Normally the threads in this room, while they can be long, are still interesting debate, but this one isn't. Are you guys drunk? (:-)
One could accuse me of being a bit out of my mind, but drunk - nope.
Looks like LUVTHYTIGERS didn't want to run through the jungle with the lions in this newsgroup. 4 days and he hasn't been seen since.
LOL!
Harryface
05 Park Avenue 34,477 91 Bonneville LE 306,078
======== ======== James, so far......i've found it to be a very interesting debate.
but.....unlike Mike, i'm drunk.
00 L O~:~ Marsh ~slips some shroomjuice in mikes coffee while he's out the room~
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