99 Lumina wont start

Your problem is in the "Vehicle anti theft" system.

1. Try your second key. Clean the "resistor pellet" on the key (with steel wool)
2. Check fuses 7(5A), 10(15A) and 12(10A) at the inside fuse block.
3. Check fuse "ignition switch"(50A) at the "engine wiring junction block 2" under the hood.

I'm inclined to agree after reading & searching on the net. Where is is located?

Extra key didn't work. I actually thought of that first & had my wife bring the extra key along with my tools.(Its in a store parking lot)

I checked the 3 15A fuses "F/INJN, PCM IGN, ELEK IGN",and "IGN SYST" relay under the hood on passenger side. Where is the inside fuse block located?

Fuse is good

I just got back from the car looking for the VATS. I just got this message and I appreciate it greatly. Ill wait a bit to here back before going to check fuses you mentioned in ">2." Thanks again!

Check to see if the security light is flashing...You may have a p1629 anti-theft concern

The VATS runs off the ignition cylinder. It's very easy to break. Is your security light flashing?

If memory serves, there should be a fuse box inside the car on one side of the dash, pointing towards the door's.

Did you change the ignition switch yourself? If memory serves, the VATS would have to be reprogrammed if you install a new ignition switch. That could be your problem.

Thanks 80 Knight for your response...

Here is the latest:

The interior fuse box is on the passenger side, accessed with the door open. Fuses 7, 10 & 12 are good. I only replaced the actual ignition switch on the lower sterring column, not the key switch.

(Without knowing anything about VATS I figured the switch wasn't letting voltage get to the solenoid or the fuel system because if I left the key on & jumped the solenoid to the starter motor with a screwdriver, it runs for 3 seconds then cuts off consistently every time)

I checked the resistance on the key(1.87K), and at the connector on the steering column(1.87K) I then traced the wires (purple with white stripe and white with black stripe) to a plastic box above the glove box with PN 16215659 on it (VATS?)

I just wish I could at least get it home but I'm afraid to try to bypass the VATS, besides, it looks like it ain't goin anywhere. Also, the car runs great and has no other problems that I can tell. It cranks up with no problem with a screwdriver over and over but only for 3 seconds-drives me crazy! (Wheres a good car thief when you need one!)

No Security Light is flashing. I looked for that.

The vats module is located above the glovebox and behind the dash. To get to it, remove the rt. side insulator (under the dash). Then remove the glovebox. I believe all the bolts are 7mm heads. The Vats mod. and starter relay should be seen on a bracket up under the dash. Two (looks like) 10 mm bolts hold the bracket to a cross beam.

Please tell me what the "Security" indicator light on the I/P does when you turn the key on. There are three choices: Off all the time, On all the time or Flashing. Each one means a different direction to look.

You cannot get a Vats mod. from a junk yard. Once they are installed and fired up the first time, the resistor from the key is burned in the memory. Only that resistor value will work from that point on. There are 15 different resistor pellet choices.

I don't know what your electrical and mechanical skill level is or how far you want to go with this.

Thanks johnoz19.

Yes to the above, I have the VATS module out already having traced the wires from the sterring column

I haven't seen it come on at all!

Yes, I was only thinking of getting a new one from a dealer and I've found & printed information about VATS, resistance values, operation. Mine is 1.87K (or key code 7) as stated in an earlier message.

I have very good mechanical and electrical/electronics skills but I'm not a professional car mechanic. I'll let the pros do it if i need to but if it's at all possible, I'd like to fix the thing.

On Sun, 18 Feb 2007 17:44:30 -0600, snipped-for-privacy@Datt.s wrote: I've been reading about devices that bypass the VATS module by sending a 30 Hz signal to the ECM in order to get the fuel injectors working but it doesn't say anything about the starter.

Does the VATS cut out the starter as well?

I can get around the starter but not the injectors.

My info is probably out of date, but as far as I know, the VATS system can't be bypassed. From what I recall, if the VATS system doesn't recognize the proper key, it won't start, no matter what. However, if your "Security" light isn't on, then it may not be the VATS system. My Grandparents have a '97 Lumina, and several years after having a remote starter installed, the car began to not start. They would just turn the key and it wouldn't do anything. I never tried activating the starter like you did, but it turned out to be the remote starter had gone, and it was buggering up the VATS. We removed the remote starter, and the car is fine now.

How can I tell if I have a remote starter?

The theft deterrent module performs one of the two following actions when you attempt to start the vehicle with a wrong ignition key:

. There are 15 PASS-Key® II resistance ranges. The PASS-Key® II resistance may be one of the 14 valid but incorrect PASS-Key® II resistance ranges. The theft deterrent module will perform the following actions when you attempt to start the vehicle (if the condition is present during an engine start attempt or for 1 second any time after the engine has started):

- Turns on the SECURITY indicator

- Sends a password to the PCM through the fuel enable signal circuit The password disables fuel delivery to the engine.

- Disables the theft deterrent relay, which disables the starter circuit

- Disables sampling of the PASS-Key® II resistance for 3 minutes The 3 minute time period is called the shut-down period. Disconnecting the battery will not clear the timer sequence. The timer sequence will resume when battery power is restored. Inserting the proper key during the vehicle shut-down period will not start the engine. The engine will not start until the shut-down period has elapsed. After the shut-down period, the engine will start if the correct ignition key resistor pellet is used.

. The PASS-Key® II resistance may be correct and allow the engine to start. Later during the same ignition cycle, the PASS-Key® II resistance may be one of the 14 valid but incorrect resistance ranges. The theft deterrent module will perform the following actions:

- Enters the fail-enable mode

- Turns ON the SECURITY indicator

- Sends a password to the PCM through the fuel enable signal circuit when more attempts to start the engine occur The password allows the fuel enable circuit to deliver fuel to the engine.

- Enables the theft deterrent relay, which also enables the starter circuit.

A remote starter would be an after market device in 99. I have access to all GM service manuals from 98 on. Please email me directly if you would like to continue.

Cranks & runs for 3 seconds? No sec light. Sounds like another problem other than VATS. Does it stop like you turn the key off or stall?

They are usually under the dashboard. Have you had this car since new? If so, you would know if you had a remote starter as you would have had to install it yourself.

Key off If I don't turn the key on (as I did when I first jumped the solenoid), it will crank & run about 3 times unti,l it seems to me, to run out of fuel.(because theres no power to the fuel system). If I turn the key on I can hear what must be the fuel being pumped, I can crank it over and over from the starter each time cutting off after 3 seconds.

I talked with a chevy dealership mechanic who said the most common fault he's seen is the wires/connectors in the ignition cylinder become worn or loose & won't make contact during cranking but may make contact with the key in. If this is the case then I should be able to bypass the ignition switch with a resistor which is what I'm about to try.

Thanks...

Bought it used

Here's the latest:

As for the security light, It stays on solid with the switch in run position. Also the Oil, Volts and Check engine lights.

After I jump it from the starter & it runs 3 sec then cuts off, the security light & check engine lights are off but the oil & volts are on. This is probably why I didn't notice it at first.

I checked the resistance again at the steering column connector with it disconnected and turned the key switch to start & off several times but it read a solid 1.87K.

With the connector disconnected, the security light flashed.

I bypassed the key/switch resistance with an equivalent resistance but it still didn't turn over.

The engine has proper oil, I put a new battery in just to be sure and still nothing.

Jeese!

replying to johnoz19, Everett wrote: How can i send a false signal to the pcm telling that everything is ok? i already did the resistor trick with the ignition. worked for awhile. im highly electronically capable. just don;t know what signal to send to bypass vats