It may not be fun for anybody. Nothing like this has happened before,
The government has taken an unprecedented role in private business, not just
bailing them out but making managerial demands.
This has undertones that are not funny at all.
The GOVERNMENT didn't put GM into bankruptcy.
GM's highly paid, highly talented management set the course....
And the UAW helped grease the wheels.
Imagine the weeping and groaning
if the government didn't try to help.
All we can do is make the best of a shitty situation.
Let them whine like slugs.
99% of the others that get laid off didn't whine. GMers are losers because
they selfishly think this is a GM thing. Well GM being a weak corrupt and
pathetic company is a victim of it's own doing. As are plenty o other
Just that the depression isn't going to allow the BS to continue.
The US economy will not recover until GM is history and people and
businesses in the US pay their debts and bills. Maybe learn to repect
others rights to fiscal liberty.
Like heck. This is fascism. The gov't has taken over bank and has now
undertaken the auto industry. I'd say Ford hasn't a chance. It will be next.
If you are enjoying this you'd be pleased as hell to be part of Italy or
Germany 3/4 century ago. We fought a war and lost thousands of soldiers to
get rid of that crap and here we are.
You think this is funny.
If the gov didn't step in, you would have seen chaos.
It was the foremost leaders of capitalism crying for the gov teat.
The absolute scions of capitalism.
How could you have forgotten so soon?
Entirely contrary to the facts.
Wouldn't expect more from the tinhats though.
Yes. Enjoy what it has wrought. Many have grown fat and lazy off
that cheap foreign labor. Now it's time to pay the piper.
Learning Chinese would be a start.
I won't quibble over definitions. You can look it up.
Seems to be working. Of course if you don't like it, you can roll
your own country.
Then they'll got tossed out too.
You're funny. Do you even know more capitalistic countries than the
I'll give you 2. Commie China and Somalia.
Pack your bags. Your paradise awaits.
Not to me. I'm a capitalist. Part of that is being able to add
assets versus debt and guard your wealth. Mom taught me.
And to know that some enterprises will fail.
What's this talk of pension plans?
Smacks of socialism, wouldn't you say?
I'm beginning to suspect you aren't what you claim.
Besides, surely you know that GM was a capitalist enterprise.
What exactly are you complaining about?
Personally, I saved the fruits of my labors working for capitalist
enterprises and never invested with the Bernie Madoffs or expected to
get wealthy off the sweat of others' labor.
I have fairly simple wants. Always viewed Wall Street as too sleazy.
And simple compounded interest has done well by me.
All FDIC guaranteed of course.
Driving used Chevys alone has probably added well over $100k to my
bank account over the years. Simple aversion to debt.
Anybody with sense can do that. Won't work for greedy people though.
The banks have used my money well to fuel capitalism.
Makes me proud to have contributed both my labor and money to
capitalism. We worked well together indeed.
You tinhat investors are an odd lot. Puffing up your breast feathers
when capitalism is providing you good investment returns, exalting in
your investment acumen, then whining like puppies when it falls off,
and blaming anyone but yourself.
Nobody made you do it.
Buck up and be a man.
Nobody owes you an easy living. Start your own enterprise if you want
to be wealthy, and encourage capitalism.
I'm sure you are more honest than the capitalists that have hurt you.
That "anybody can invest and get rich" scam has played itself out.
Some did well, and some didn't. Typical Ponzi.
Different world now. The Chinese have the assets.
But a good energetic capitalist can still become a millionaire.
If that's your dream, of course.
If starting your own company doesn't suit you, you might try trading
commodity futures. I've made some money at that, but never bet what I
wasn't willing to lose.
Be very careful. Wrong trade and you lose your house.
Part of the excitement of capitalism.
Actually - it hasn't. At what point did the government step in and leverage
their financing by demanding of K-Mart management? At what point did the
governement pour this amoung of cash at an ailing company?
When they stepped into Harley Davidson when AMF drove it into the ground
and handed the employees a load of money for them to "buy the company".
The "owners" so far have developed NOTHING new. If you look over those
famed "American Made" bikes you will discover a LOT of imported parts.
Another time was when they stepped into Chrysler the first time they
filed for C-11 bankruptcy. The feds handed them a bunch of money and
turned out the upper staff. That was when Iaccoca stepped in and took
over and introduced the K car, Which has to be the longest running
platform in history considering that the current Caravan runs on an
updated K car base!
Some big differences then.
Chrysler only borrowed $1B and was in much better shape than today.
Today they were run bankrupt without a turn around for far too long. And no
one asks what happened to the $11B Chrysler had at the end of October that
That is a common misconception, that the government LOANED money to
Chrysler, at the time.
The fact is Chrysler did not get a cent from the feds. What Reagan did was
agree to guaranty the loans that led to Chrysler getting back on its feet.
The money came from the Union Pension fund and five banks, to whom Chrysler
paid interest. In return the US Treasury got Chrysler PREFERRED stock to
secure the loans.
When Chrysler got up and running again Lee Iacocca wanted to buy back the
preferred stock from the government at the value when they were given to the
Treasury but Reagan said no, they had to buy the stock back at the current
much higher value because Reagan said the taxpayers were entitled to the
profit made possible by the federal loan guaranty.
As to the amount of imported parts on Harleys, if you ever tour their plant
in Pennsylvania you will see the members of the Machinist Union there use
American steel to make just about everything from the wheels up the
handlebars including the chrome plating, and actually a very limited number
of minor imported parts, like shocks and some electronics.
Motorsforum.com is a website by car enthusiasts for car enthusiasts. It is not affiliated with any of the car or spare part manufacturers or car dealers discussed here.
All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.