GM's Pseudo GTO

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The NY and Pa state police use RWD CV's year around, as well. I wonder what the FWD buyers think we drove for all those years before FWD? As least with RWD one need not worry about putting
their vehicle into a spin by simply letting of the throttle. In the forties and fifties. they didn't even plow till the storm was over and they only put traction materials on the mountains and in the intersections. ;)
mike hunt
Rich B wrote:

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GRL wrote:

Horsepuckey. I live in the snow belt. FWD means you slide into the ditch forwards, RWD means you slide in sideways, and 4wd means you roll it in. Dumb ass driver + dumb ass driving = crash. I leave my Jimmy in RWD unless it's bad bad bad weather - I prefer to not kid myself about the lack of traction out there.
Ray
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Plain and simple, FWD is cheaper to build. More profit for the manufacturers. More expensive & complicated to maintain, won't hold up in heavy duty use, and that's why police and taxi cab companies like RWD.

on
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for
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Actually, although that is a very common conception, FWD vehicles are more expensive to build than a RWD vehicle of the same size. The reason being FWD vehicles require more of the relatively more expensive off line pre assembly of more components, than RWD vehicles. FWD. vehicle are much more expensive to insure as well as the things you mentioned.
mike hunt
noyap wrote:

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snipped-for-privacy@mailcity.com wrote:

Can you prove that? I'd like to use it in my never ending "FWD sucks" tirade. ;)
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As a retired automotive engineer, I can not reveal trade secrets such as cost figures. you can prove it to yourself by doing some research of the prices of the FWD cars that replaced RWD cars. The much smaller FWD Chrysler 4cy 'K' cars sold for as much or more than the larger 6 cy and V8 RWD cars they replaced for example. The smaller FWD Cadillac was more costly, same was true of the other GM FWD vehicles. 1981 Escort sold for much more than the 1980 Pinto it replaced. The RWD LTD that was sold alongside of the first Taurus, sold for $4,000 less, etc.
mike hunt
ray wrote:

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snipped-for-privacy@mailcity.com wrote:

Unfortunately, that doesn't work either as cost to build and sale price often have nothing in common. Take pickup trucks. Not exactly very high tech - they make a TON of profit on them and yet I don't see them on clearance very often. How many cars come out that cost LESS than the vehicles they replaced?
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01 Trans Am Ram Air - 13.41@104 mph (!CAGS - otherwise stock)
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That is true to some extent. Ford sold the first Escorts to dealers for less than the build cost for CAFE. The profits on the larger cars still subsidize small car retail price today. You would be surprised to know how relatively little more it cost to build a Town Car than a Taurus or a RWD Lexus over a Camry.
mike hunt

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No, FWD means you do a 180 and go into the ditch backwards if you let off the gas.
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RWD fun factor: forward donuts FWD fun factor: reverse gear donuts AWD fun factor: drag racing on heavy snow full 4WD fun factor: 4x4 tug-a-war
they can all survive snow. the limiting factor is how fast you can go. ABS braking is fun in the snow...
-a|ex
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I don't understand this whole "let off the gas" thing? Maybe that's why I sucked at doing 360s. ;)
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the
happy
You got that right! It's a Grand Am, not a GTO! I'm ashamed of GM.
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It's just a Holden. They've been promising to bring it to the US for a while. It's about damn time.
The new GTO does nothing for me either, but at least it's a step in the right direction.
- Andy

fire
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fire
They are doing it because Bob Lutz wants to do it and because it was a fast, cheap, expedient thing to do.
GM's history of 'mericanizing their foreign designs and trying to sell them in the states has been a flop every time.
The Cadillac Catera was a warmed over Opel ... and a flop. The CTS which replaced it is doing great.
The Saturn L series is a warmed over Opel ... and Saturn is having to bargain basement price them to sell any.
Further back in time there were the Opel by Isuzu for Buick embarrassments.
Why should the GTO be any different?
John
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