GM says it lost $4.3B in last half of 2009; sees chance for profit

Still a loser, old GM/New Gm
GM says it lost $4.3B in last half of 2009; sees chance for profit http://www.usatoday.com/money/companies/earnings/2010-04-07-gm-earnings_N.htm
DETROIT General Motors says it lost $4.3 billion in the second half of 2009 after its July 10 emergence from bankruptcy, but is sticking to its promise to pay back U.S. and Canadian government loans by June this year.
Today's release is the first peek into the new GM's post-bankruptcy financial status. It uses "fresh-start accounting," which allows companies to revalue their assets after bankruptcy. It can't be compared with financial statements made before the automaker's bankruptcy filing.
The fresh-start accounting marks an important milestone for the new GM that needed to occur before the company can issue stock to the public again.
"We are building the foundation that will allow us to return to public ownership," CFO Chris Liddell said. "Completing fresh-start accounting is an important step in that process."
The now-private company is 60.1% owned by the U.S. government, which converted most of its $50 billion in bailout loans to equity. Except for GM's repayment of the remaining loans which total $8.1 billion between the U.S. and Canadian governments taxpayers won't be able to recover their money until the company is public and the stock can be sold. GM executives have said an initial public offering could come as early as this year.
Liddell told analysts and the media on a conference call that he thinks there's a chance the automaker could be profitable by the end of 2010 but he said he didn't want to promise that.
"This company has been guilty in the past of overpromising and under-delivering," he said. "I would under-promise and hopefully over-deliver. When we put the runs up on the board, we will come out and tell you about them."
Still, Liddell says "there's nothing I've seen in the first quarter that changes my opinion that there is a good chance we'll be profitable this year."
The company burned through $1.9 billion in operating cash in the last quarter of 2009, in part because it repaid some of the government loans. In the second half of 2009, the company generated $1 billion in cash after it emerged from bankruptcy.
GM will report first-quarter earnings in mid-May.
GM has been working on a turnaround plan that is supposed to allow the company to break even in a U.S. sales market of just 10 million vehicles a year. The industry's seasonally adjusted annualized selling rate in March was 11.78 million vehicles.
GM's results only measure the period from July 10 through Dec. 31.
The company reported revenue of $57.5 billion. That compares with $47.1 billion in revenue from Jan. 1 July 9. GM said it earned $109 million in the period from Jan. 1 to July 9, under old accounting.
GM made a $1 billion payment to the government in December and another $1 billion payment in March.
Under new CEO Ed Whitacre, since July the automaker has shed four brands Pontiac, Saturn, Saab and Hummer made a series of management changes and cut thousands of salaried employees.
GM, which remains the largest car company by sales in the U.S., saw a slight gain in U.S. market share the first three months this year compared with a year ago. Sales of some of its new crossovers, including the Chevrolet Traverse and Equinox and GMC Acadia and Terrain, have been particularly strong.
GM last reported earnings in November, when it said it lost $1.2 billion in the third quarter. That was before the company completed the fresh-start process. It lost $6 billion in the first three months of 2009 before its stay in bankruptcy protection. It lost $31 billion in 2008.
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On 07/04/2010 12:25 PM, Jim_Higgins wrote:

They mean pay us back with our money and $100 billion debt transfer from corrupt auto to taxpayers. Add up the costs of GM, Chrysler, Delco, Cerberus, Carlyle, various suppliers and GMAC. What a load of corruption this is.
Mike Hunter will not like March sales numbers.
They will just keep on sucking.
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----- Original Message -----
Newsgroups: alt.autos.gm Sent: Wednesday, April 07, 2010 8:40 PM Subject: Re: GM says it lost $4.3B in last half of 2009; sees chance for profit

Actually the March sales numbers for GM were not horrible. They were up by 34% comapred to February 2009 and up 20.6% compared to March of 2010 (this 20.6% is when you compare sales for the remaining GM brands in 2010 to all GM brands in place in 2009 - if you just compare March 2010 sales for Buick, Chevrolet, Cadillac and GMC to 2009 sales for just those brands, then sales are up 43% - but this is sort of bogus...).
I wonder how long GM can lose billions before the "new GM" has to declare bankruptcy. GM is losing market share and millions more in Europe, and the Opel workers in Germany are on the verge of rebelling over possible plant shutdowns.
Ed
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On 07/04/2010 8:51 PM, C. E. White wrote:

But looks like GM is now in #1 spot for the second month in a row. Forsd is now #1 in the US. March, April, May are make-break months for auto. Numbers always go up from Jan/Feb into Mar/Apr/May.
Good question as Nov 2010 is where pro-bailout supporters have to face an rightfully angry constituancy and the last thing they need between now and then is for more GM bailout money to hit the table.
But Obama will slid them a few billion on the hush, as he knows how sensitive this is at the momement. Maybe have GMAC/Ally loan GM money...
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That's a laugh. GMAC is in horrible shape. I've seen it mentioned in the press that there was a desire by the Government to see GM reabsorb GMAC....
Ed
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On 08/04/2010 7:02 AM, C. E. White wrote:

I think they have now had 4 bailout packages. Bad credit, no job, no downpayment, Obama and GM supporter no problem...
Government already owns a chunk of GMAC. Keeps feeding them taxpayers money too.
Funny how all that cash they supposedly had some 5 years ago just "disapeared" and Obama isn't asking questions.
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They are feeding all banks money. Wouldn't you like an industry where you could borrow money at essentially 0 percent interest and then loan it out - particaulrly if you had credit cards with 18% to 21% interest rates?

Why limit your complaints to just the current administration. GWB and the Republicans aren't clean either. They only differ slightly on which groups should get the most money, not on the basic principals.
Ed
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On 09/04/2010 5:23 AM, C. E. White wrote:

Well to me, it is corruption gone mad. When Bush started it, I turned on him like a dog. When Obama escalated it, I did the same. Both are in other peoples pockets. I don't know if it is payola or extortion, but government no longer represents the people.
My guess is like GM, US government has so screwed up with debt and corruption they have no wiggle room. And no one is coming clean on how screwed up the money management of congress has been.
So how does Obama fix a debt problem, goes out and borrows/creates more. Makes no sense. Now we have the GM family of companies as perpetual corporate welfare recipients. Pump enough cash into GM and let them go is the motto I here.
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We can hope GM eventually recovers. The signs are not good. GM is a high cost producer, in a country which already burdens manufacturers with restrictions beyond those imposed by other countries. I think the decision to save GM was not a "one party" decision, no matter what the Republicans (at least some of them) would like the public to think. There was just too much political pressure from too many groups to let GM fail (or should I say, to prop GM up after it had failed). Consider these thoughts:
1) For most of my life GM was the one of the largest non-governmental employers in the US. It was one of the largest (if not the largest) company that actually made things. Having your flagship company fail is not something a lot of politicians want to see happen.
2) I think there was real fear among the financial community that the collapse of GM might set off a cascade of other failures as GM suppliers followed GM down the rat hole.
3) Having a Government bailout a major manufacturer is not unique to this time period or to the US. The Japanese and European governments do it repeatedly. At the same time GM was getting billions from the US government; Toyota was doing the same with the Japanese government.
4) I am sure the thousands of GM car dealer across the company were pressing their representatives to bailout GM. Car dealers have always been powerful lobbyists.
5) The UAW was particularly interested in stopping GM from going through any sort of conventional bankruptcy since the existing contracts and pension plans likely would have been terminated and replaced with far less favorable terms.
6) The Government had a vested interest in keeping GM in business and maintaining the current GM pension plans. Otherwise the GM pension obligations would have ended up with the Pension Guarantee Agency...and likely would have made it even more insolvent.
I can see where a lot of politicians saw this as a case of pay me now, or may me a lot more later. What I hate is all the posturing by both sides. I am sure many Republicans were just as anxious to see GM bailed out as the Democrats. But instead of working together and making the reasons for the bailout clear to the American public, they are playing the blame the Democrats game - again.
I've always been a reluctant member of the Democratic Party. I don't really agree with the much of the national agenda, but because of the way local politics worked in the past, changing to the Republican Party didn't seem to be a good idea. Now I am glad I am never did. Not all Republicans are bad, but many of the national leaders are disgusting low lifes who would rather see the country crash and burn than work with the Democrats. They may win in November, but if the people that come into power are anything like the idiots I see ranting on TV, then I will be truly afraid.
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On 09/04/2010 7:41 AM, C. E. White wrote:

Hit or miss at this point, and as you say the signs are not good. Much depends on management savvy. For the first time in a generation of GM workers, they need to proactively deal with waste, politicial waste and any other kind of waste they have. And do a program like GE, 5% of the worst performers get the axe each year, especially management.
The time for screwing around has ended if they want a shot at survival.

Yep. And Yale and Harvard need to take a second critical look at why GM screwed up so bad for so long. And the appathy of the Wagoners and the board to change course. That includes admiting the screw ups all had Harvard grads.

False fear. As they didn't measure that investors don't like US corporate bonds as GM welshed and the government rolled the problem over and spilled in across the country. Add in that the taxes will go up leaving less money for people to spend when the bill comes in does not add to future economic recovery.
Also not measured were how many other non-GM but auto Americans who lost jobs because GM was subsidized?
Governmetn clearly failed to look at the collateral damages in debt to the taxpayer, what is right, screwing others for the GM pig... and the corruption. Used to be we thought pork bailouts and marxism like that was Chavez, not Bush and Obama.

Hisorically, when the fat lady sings bailouts do not work. They just become very expensive corporate welfare patients.
While it might be nice to have a GM Olympic sprinter that is 450 lbs get a free ride for gold, it isn't ethical, nor moral nor the right thing to do.

I am sure. It was a rich persons bailout all along. The big winner was Carlyle.

Which is why the UAW/CAW should have had their contracts shreeded. Not renogitiated, de-unionized. And just like 99% of the rest of the people who got laid off, screwed.
But UAW did get their pay off for selling out fellow taxpayers for big time corruption.

You mean keeping senator, congress and politicial contributes a flowing.

I am more cynical. Money gets people elected and money motivates our representatives. 79% of the people were against bailouts and they ignored it in the believe the rich money would get them re-elected.
Not many stood the moral ground. Even fewer called Bush/Obama's misappropriation of TARP for auto. Just a ruse for the public, as they all had their calls from the rich insiders.
And it was organized.

My guess in Canada and the US, 90% of our representatives are dirty scum bags.
Would sell us out in a heart beat. They did with TARP and auto. There is no way a non-auto worker in Montana should be paying debt for GM, Citibank, BAC or other.
And the root cause of this whole freeking depression remain untouched.
A nation addicted to debtor dysfunction is destined for doom.
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Why not? As usual you don't know what you are talking about! Do a search and you will discover that GM is still number one is sales, year to date, in the US, has all of the billons it cost for all of its totally new model cars and truck paid off, is earning enough profit, on it core business, to have already been repaying billions of its debt to the feds, even though it now has only five brands to sell.
When GM gets its five true eclectics, that cost much less to build, on the market they will be in a great position when it stock offering is made.

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wrote:

Maybe GM will have enough $$$ to cover this ??

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Only if Obama saddles more debt onto the taxpayers to make GM's books good.
By the time GM is over, would be good too see how much money was lost of GM as a total, my guess including it's GMAC and Delco included, certainly over $250 billion cost to the taxpayers.
History is going to look dim on this corruption when the soverign debt spreads.
On 08/04/2010 7:39 AM, Mike Hunter wrote:

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