GM U.S. July sales down 19.5 percent, Honda up 10.2%

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The only "good" news for GM was that Ford and Chrysler were off even more at 34% for Ford and 37% for Chrysler.
http://yahoo.reuters.com/news/articlehybrid.aspx?storyID=urn:newsml:reuters.com:20060801:MTFH53056_2006-08-01_18-18-15_N01198474&type=comktNews&rpcD
http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/060801/latu106.html?.v `
http://yahoo.reuters.com/news/articlehybrid.aspx?storyID=urn:newsml:reuters.com:20060801:MTFH52516_2006-08-01_17-50-29_WEN2865&type=comktNews&rpcD
http://yahoo.reuters.com/business/newsarticle.aspx?type ΊsicIndustries&storyID=nN01439295&WTmodLoc=HybArt-R2-IndustryNews-2
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According to the news tonight, Toyota is #2 for July, passing Ford.
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surprises me, since Toyota cars are so bland and boring and ugly. Give me a Taurus, Windstar, Superduty, or F100. But hell, whatever. People have shitty taste. That's why we have that turd Bush in the White House.
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grappletech wrote:

I don't understand your comment. Given the choice between a Camry and a Taurus, I find them both bland and boring, but one has a good reliability record and the other has a reputation for eating transmissions like potato chips. I don't have to wonder about the "taste" of the buying public at all for making decisions like this. Even the 500, which is by all reports a hell of a lot better car than a Taurus, is practically coma-inducing to look at. Really, only Chrysler is making any interesting American cars anymore, but I'm not tempted by any of them as they're all fairly large and automatic-only.
nate
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Interesting, in an ugly sort of way. I'll take a used Pinto rather than drive one of those big oversized grilled, tiny window things. I'm amazed that anyone actually pays money for them. Kind of feel sorry for the people that actually have to sell them. The big ass Chrysler looks like a locomotive that got lost when it is coming at you.
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Edwin Pawlowski wrote:

True, but they are at least RWD and V-8 powered, which is what used to set American cars apart from everyone else. Now front engine/RWD sporty cars are pretty much BMW's territory, unless you want to talk about sports cars like the 'vette, S2000, Miata, etc. Wouldn't it be great to be able to buy a new Nova or Cutlass?
nate
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The Chrysler 300 is one of the ugliest cars in production.
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more
Confrimed in the Business section of our paper today -- "July vehicle sales rise for Toyota and Honda..." GM sales were off 31.2% for trucks and cars down for 2.7%. Chrysler was downs 40/23.5 percent respectively. So even their cars present sales problems.
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Toyota and Honda sales are bolstered by the midget cars that are in vogue today. GM and Ford do not offer midget cars. Seems to me that is temporary. Midget car buyers are not generally the average US new vehicle buyers that buys a new vehicle every three or four years. Fords hit was the F150, but it is end of the model year. Major F150 buyers will soon be buying 2007s, not leftovers.
mike hunt

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Mike Hunter wrote:

You are the master of SPIN Mr. Hunt. Perhaps you should be working in PR or as a government Press Secretary.
Yes the market has moved to more fuel efficient vehicles, and no, the US makers are not strong either in product or brand image with regard to said fuel efficient vehicles.
Ford and GM lived high off the great 1990s truck boom, but that fad is over and is not likely to come back. Large trucks are likely to fall back to the 20-25% of the US market they enjoyed for many decades and away from the ~50% level of the 90s and early 00s. Fads come and go, it is their nature. This fad is over and the US makers are caught with their collective pants down, again.
John
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You are entitled to your own opinion but I am simply stating facts. Actually the fuel economy of the comparable cars and trucks that both GM and Ford have to offer are as good, or better. than import brands. Where they fall short is in the midget car class where the do not generally offer a competitive vehicle. When one considers the drive home price difference between the domestics and most imports, the domestics have the advantage for an astute buyer. One need prepay for their fuel by spending an extra 20% or 30% to get a few more MPG. The Koreans do a far better job of fuel economy for the price than the Japs. Both GM and Ford have more vehicles that get 30 or more MPG than any of the imports.
mike hunt

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What you call the "midget class," oh top posting one, is the class of the future, at least until some kind of technological breakthrough allows us to move away from fossil fuels. The US mfgrs. should have known this but instead of planning long term, they've been milking the SUV craze while it lasted, and now they're paying for it. You're also completely disregarding reputation for quality, which is indisputably in favor of the imports. One thing that you got right in your post is that the Koreans are likely going to make a strong showing over the next couple years.
nate
Mike Hunter wrote:

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If what you are saying is true, the Pinto, Vega, Horizon, and other little crap boxes would still exist. I heard your words many times in the past, but it was only temporary.
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The Omni/Horizon were decent cars. They had the 2.2 4 banger -- great little durable engine. Small cars get bad reps for being junk, unreliable. Usually it was lack of maintenance. People who buy cheap cars tend not to maintain them as well as more pricier cars because of the cheap initial cost of the cars and that these economy car buyers tend to be of a lower socio-economic class. A lot of Yugo buyers never bothered to change their oil and would have the Yugos with their seized engines towed to the dealer angrily demanding a new engine and when told no, replied "you expect me to change oil on a $3900 car!?" But the Yugo engine is actually a bulletproof, reliable, easy to maintain engine.
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An engine made by FIAT to boot ;)
mike

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designed, not made. However, if you can keep the rust monster at bay, an old FIAT will actually last quite a long time; when I was a kid a neighbor down the street had one of those little red boxy looking FIAT coupes, and his wife drove the wheels off of it. It was a cute little thing, and since he kept up with the maintenance (and squirting oil up into all the nooks and crannies apparently,) last I heard it was handed down to his daughter.
Apparently you can make a neat little GTI type racer by mixing and matching FIAT and Yugo parts...
nate
Mike Hunter wrote:

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Edwin Pawlowski wrote:

well, the Fox-body certainly lasted long enough... I think that had some Pinto genes in it, no? the Vega was a POS from the get go though, although it certainly was a sharp *looking* little car. Too bad GM didn't see fit to put an actual engine under the hood instead of the grenade they stuffed in there. You forgot to mention the Chevette as well, which was another GM compact that simply disappeared off the roads almost as soon as it was discontinued. The Horizon was a poor imitation of the Rabbit...
meanwhile, up until very recently, any of the import brands offered just the kinds of vehicles that you sneer at. Now that fuel prices are going up, they're bringing over some of the smaller models (Yaris, etc.) to fill the gap left when they moved their existing models upsized and upmarket.
nate
(still miss my old VW Scirocco... couldn't kill the damn thing even at 240K miles, and it would get close to 30 MPG if you could keep your foot out of it. Sold it because I thought I wanted a new car, that was dumb. Can I have it back now please?)
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I bought a Chevette when they first came out.
In form and function, it was the perfect suburban "go-to-work" and "run errands" vehicle. BUT underpowered, poor gas mileage, engine probs, and indifferent dealer service cured me.
I dumped it in less than 2 years.
<rj>
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Among my collection of old cars there is a 1971 Pinto. Currently there is 305K on the clock. Looks and runs as good as new. It even wins it class at old cars shows. Know what I have yet to see at an old car show? ANY Japanese cars, in my class, except for a low mileage XR7 or a 'Z' car on occasion in the sport class. Lots of British, German, even French and Italian small cars from that era but hardly ever see a Jap car ;)
mike hunt

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wrote:

That's because they're still on the road being driven..... ;o)
<rj>
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