&$%^#)&* Power Windows

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I got an 89 full size Chevy. It's got those &$%^#)&* Power Windows. Last winter that damn passenger side window went down and not back up. I ended up with a car full of snow and a real bad attitude. I finally
got it back up after 3 days of freezing in my garage. I had to completely rip the door apart, found out there is no way to raise the window manually, but finally after beating the crap out of that motor and running power directly from the car battery, it went up. What's odd, is that there was power the whole time, but my jumper from the battery had more power somehow. So, my plan was to never lower that window again. Of course being on the passenger side everyone that gets in my car has to f**k with it. Partiucularly my neighbors kid who I told to NEVER LOWER THAT WINDOW. What does he do the last time I took him somewhere, he lowers the window. That time, it got stuck again, but finally went up. So, yesterday he gets in my car and the first thing he does is lower that &$%^#)&* window. This time it wont go back up no matter what I do. This time he ended up being my gofer, because I was pretty pissed. This time I decided that I was going to cut the wires to the motor so no one lowers it again.
Well, there is absolutely no way to raise that window manually. The motor has some oddball threaded rivets that can not be unscrewed, so there is no way to replace it, at least not without grinding those stupid things off (why the f**k they did not use bolts, I will never understand). I finally just took my grinder and cut a hole in the door from the inside. Then I cut thru that motor near the gears, and was able to put a vise grip on the shaft and raise the window. The wires are cut and I destroyed that motor anyhow.
My question is whether there is any sort of aftermarket thing that will turn that into a hand crank window. I am not going to spend the outrageous expense for the motor, not to mention I cant see how the hell to change it being all riveted to the door and to the bracket taht contains the belt to raise the thing. However, if there is some sort of crank I can put in there, I may consider it.
Anyone know?
The next time I buy a car, it WON'T have power windows. I hate them. They are just another useless P.O.S. to make cars cost more and later sell expensive parts. Apparently some people will spend the extra money because they are too lazy to roll a window with a crank.
Buggz
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I will be pretty hard to find a newer car today without power windows. Why didn't you just put DUCT TAPE over the power window switch so people would not use the switch or use the lockout switch on the driver's door?
snipped-for-privacy@hoohoo.com wrote:

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That sucks about the newer cars. I really never want another car with power windows. This must be why they say Americans are getting soft, if people dont have enough muscle to crank a window up by hand.
When I consider the cost and major hassle to change that motor, I just can not justify the little "convenience" the power windows offer. The old crank windows never went bad, except for the crank itself getting stripped, breaking, or falling off, and that was very easy and cheap to fix.
You are right about the duct tape. In fact I decided that yesterday when this problem happened again. But it was too late by then. Now the motor wont work again. I ground a huge hole in it, but left it unplugged just so nothing shorts out.
Actually I can roll it down and up now, if I remove the door panel and put a vise grip on that gear hub inside the motor assembly. Thats how I finally got it back up. I could probably even weld a shaft onto that thing, but I dont need to lower the window that bad.
Thanks - Buggz

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It is not about soft or not having enough muscle. It is about convenience. Some of us like the ability and safety of being able to raise or lower windows, other than the driver's, while driving. Not long ago I was driving a rented Stratus. It was plain awkward to lower the window at a toll booth. The handle was low and forward on the door. I decided at the first toll booth that I've never buy one with manual windows.
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wrote:

I guess for some people this is a convenience. For me, who fixes my own cars, its nothing but a pain and an annoyance. I drive older cars and this is the first car I ever had with these things. I hope it's the last. I never had any trouble with the old crank windows, unless they got stiff (which just meant they needed some oil and grease, and all was well again).
I think our whole society is going crazy with all this "convenience" crap. It's funny, because yesterday I went to Walmart. I had to take a shit so I go in the restroom. I find the toilet is full of someone elses shit. Well, I am not going to use it that way, and it has a sensor flush thingie. There is no way I can make it flush without standing or sitting in front of that idiotic thing. Fortunately the other stall was empty, so I go to that one. Halfway thru doing my business, the toilet just flushes while I am sitting on it. Like I really want water splashing up my ass. After a few cuss words I move on to the sinks. There are 4 of them in a row, all have sensors. I wave my hands in front of one of them, get no water, so I go to the next, and the next. The 4th one finally decided to work, but stopped halfway thru, and would not restart. I finally got the second one ot work to complete washing my hands. Instead of one simple arm movement to turn on a faucet, I spent several minutes waving my hands around like an idiot to get any water, and wasted several minutes to do it.
Things like this are not convenience, they are assenine. If they always worked as intended, they might be a convenience, but they dont. Maybe if they were maintained and repaired every week or so, they would work better, but look at all the extra expense for maintenance and costly parts. Guess who pays for all of that? The customer pays in higher prices. Give me a plain old flush handle toilet, and a plain faucet with a handle. Yes, go ahead and use a spring back handle so I dont leave the water running.
I wont even get into the part about the electric hand dryers.... I hate those damn things....
Yeah, this is off topic of autos, but it's just that our society seems to have gone crazy with convenience crap that's not a convenience at all. It's an annoyance or worse.....
One other thing. If someone was to have a wreck and need to get out of a car quickly because of a fire, it's unlikely the power windows will work, since many fires start from electrical problems. The old crank will always work unless the car was smashed into on that door. Now tell me which is safer? I know that I cant even open or close the windows in my car unless I insert the key and flip the ignition switch. I find that extremely INCONVENIENT when it starts raining and I have to run outside to raise the car windows. I get out there, and forgot the keys are in the house. By the time I get back in the house grab keys, go back to the car, I am soaked and so are the car seats. "Convenience" ??????? NOT !!!!!!
What's a convenience for one person is not for another !!!
Buggz
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You must be a joy to have as a neighbor or relative
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You're right, I am !!!!!
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Instead of ranting/raving, which hasn't done a bit of good, why don't you just FIX it? Since you fix your own cars, this is something you can fix. In a previous rant you found out there was power at the motor. That is normal. The up/down window motors are controlled by the grounds. The window buttons, at any door, are the electrical contactors for the circuit grounding methods of the reversible motor. Replacing the button modules at the master switch assembly or each door is not difficult or expensive. Those switch contacts get dirt/corrosion/gunk in them and the brass reeds become corrupted over time. It's really a simple fix.
Dave S(Texas)
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snipped-for-privacy@hoohoo.com wrote:

Meds running low?
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Likely it wasn't the motor. Most likely the switch.
Ken
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wrote:

After beating the crap out of that motor and running power directly from the car battery, it dont go up. Buggz
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Don't let that little sh*t in the car again.
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That is what they make sticks for.
I've had three (all rear) windows in two cars fail in the past 9 months. Remove the door panel. If possible, disconnect the window from the mechanism. If you have it up, at least remove the power connections. Not cut a stick to proper length and jam it under the window.
I never put the back windows down anyway so this was a simple, inexpensive fix for me. The first one took over an hour, but now I can do it in 20 minutes.
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Where do you want my pharmacy to send the Valium ?
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Geez, after almost 17 years of service your window motor dies and you go berserk. Parts wear out. Parts needs to be replaced. Why can't people understand this ? Your lucky you got that many years out of the window motor.
If I were you the simplest thing to do would of been to unplug the wire connector to the power window switch once you got the glass up, that way nobody could open the window anymore. Cutting the wires will go over big with the next owner of the vehicle. I can only imagine the names he'll come up with about you if he ever pokes his head inside that door.
I'm surprised with all the beating & pounding you did on the motor that you also didn't post, " the $%^&ing window shattered too " ! LOL.
Judging by the prior problems with the window motor over the last several months, it was giving you several warnings its life expectancy was nearing the end, but you chose to ignore the warnings and not address the issue of replacing the the motor - say last year instead of yesterday.
The manufacturer uses rivets to hold the window motor in place. To remove the motor the rivets have to be drilled out - not to hard to do, inconvenient yes, but on the assembly line it saves time by not having to use nuts & bolts and two wrenches. Nuts & bolts are what are used when a replacement motor is needed, but GM replacement units do give you rivets if you want to reuse rivets.
I've only replaced one window motor when my car was 8 years old. The driver side was stopping on the up cycle, but would go up after 3-4 minutes. I took my time & it took maybe three hours to complete the job.
Good Luck on the other 3 windows.
harryface 05 Park Avenue 44,595 91 Bonneville 307, 156
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Ii agree about the 17 years. My LeSabre rear windows went out at 5 years. They have rarely been used and the only reason they were used when they broke was I accidentally hit the wrong button. To make matters worse, they don't stay up. The cable, not the motor is the problem so they have to be propped in place. That pissed me off. One broke, I'd say it was "shit happens", but two in a few months, that is poor quality material/design.
My Regal just lost a rear window, but at 16 years old, I'm not concerned about that because of the age.
Unlike the OP, my next car will still have power window.
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I have a 2000 Buick Century in which three windows (all but drivers) failed within a few months of each other. Out of warranty, of course. I called Buick, and after putting me through gymnastics, they're paying for half of the repair ($1100/2 = $550) but that's still a ton of money. Especially since those window "regulators" can't cost more than about $30 to manufacture.
The component that holds the "up" cable is made of what looks like nylon plastic. If it goes, there's nothing to hold the window up.
Also, there's a tendency for the "down" cable to come off its lower guide. Then the winch takes up too much down cable and when you try to roll the window up, there's no room on the winch spool for the up cable so the motor jams and it won't go up.
To make matters worse, the winch spool is made of that same nylon plastic, so if it takes up too much down cable, it will probably be deformed and/or broken, plus the cable gets bent and frayed inside the spool.
Anyone know of a site that's tracking these failures? I was told by the local dealership that they do 6 - 7 windows per *day* and the Buick representative told me that the dealership diagnosis was that the parts are "defective".
If the parts are defective, shouldn't they be paying to replace the whole thing instead of half? That last question is sincere, not rhetorical. If they're putting in defective window components, why aren't they picking up the whole cost of repair?
The first window that went out, I fabricated some sheet metal, pulled out the whole regulator assembly and bolted in the sheet metal between the frame and the window, to hold the window up. I put a 'U' bend in the sheet metal to act as a spring, so the window would stay all the way up and it worked well. But three windows, sheesh.
--
A friend will help you move. A real friend will help you move a body.

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.

According to a Buick service manager I spoke to, all the car makers are using the same basic cheap, breakable design.

Because they are bigger that us and can get away with it.
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snipped-for-privacy@io.com (Jeff Walther) wrote in

If the parts are defective, shouldn't they be paying to replace the whole thing instead of half? .... \ no. no they shouldnt be 'required' to pay for anything not in the written warranty!.....but, its also a very good reason GM is losing market share as we type! im not downing GM at all. i just realize its a gamble buying domestic now (since the mid 80's actually) and am willing to take the risk and pay the piper when poor engineering bites me on the arse. so i still buy GM by choice.......it is a matter of choice ya know!
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If the car also came with a disclosure that says something along the lines of, "We've engineered the window regulators to have a mean time between failure of 5 years with a sigma of x" I would agree with you. Given that they don't provide a disclosure telling me that they engineered the car to self-destruct in expensive ways right out of warranty, I think maybe they should pay the whole cost.
Just because the warranty is four years, doesn't mean that they're entitled to design the car to melt into jelly at the end of that time.
Any purchase is a risk and I don't mind paying for repairs out of warranty when it's an honest act of probability. When something is so poorly engineered that it can't last more than a few years, that's not a simple act of reliability probability.
Plus, I doubt these windows were cycled up and down more than 30 times in their life time. How much operation time is that? Maybe 5 minutes. So these windows fail after 5 minutes of operation?
--
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