Re: Foreign cars pass Big 3. but not on a steep grade

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And which have more rollover crashes? SUVs or cars?
There are tradeoffs in everything we do. If car crashes with SUVs take so many car passengeror lives, why are there more SUV occupants killed, compared to cars occupants?
Jeff
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Probably because SUV drivers gain a false confidence by having 4WD, so they drive more carelessly in bad weather, and die more often in wrecks. They think having 4WD means they're automatically safer. But the 4WD only is operational if they actually have it in 4WD, and they may be travelling too fast to have their vehicle in 4WD mode in the first place. Sure when driving slow in the snow, a 4WD is safer than a FWD car, but at the speeds that most people actually drive, you can't have the 4WD engaged, so the FWD car is easier to control than the rear wheel drive SUV, with its high center of gravity, that is going too fast to be in 4WD mode. Also, SUV drivers tend to be aggressive people, so they drive that way, thus raising their risk of dying behind the wheel. Driving to work, I saw a brand new Ford Explorer weave in and out of traffic wrecklessly, NASCAR style. Well, he flipped, and rolled end over end about 3 times. He crawled out of the wreckage, cell phone in hand. He was probably talking on it, as he was executing the NASCAR Jeff Gordon type driving. Asshole. Deserved what he got. Thankfully, the people he hurt by being the dumbass he is weren't hurt too bad.
-
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All 4WD vehicles these days will cruise at highway speeds in 4High. There is no such thing as too fast for 4WD anymore.
As well, 4WD offers nothing to benefit driving beyond the ability to go. It does not help stop, it does not help turn, and in fact 4WD can often cause control problems when trying to turn on slippery surfaces. Not problems that are any greater or more of a risk than that of what FWD or RWD would offer - only different. The driver has to be prepared and knowledgable in how to control the vehicle. Most often for those who don't really understand the vehicle under their ass, they experience surprise when a 4WD takes off under them on a slippery curve. Shock even.

I would say that most SUV drivers tend to be women these days.
I would agree that the higher center of gravity of a 4WD vehicle makes it less stable but none of them are simply prone to roll overs for most types of driving conditions. It takes quite an extreme turn to upset one. That said, they will roll faster than a car will. I suspect driver issues as well, as the primary cause of accidents with these vehicles. I really do not know what the crash numbers include so it is hard to argue why the SUV statistics look to be so high. It is far too simplistic to simply say that they experience more fatalities per 100,000 miles without really understanding what is behind the numbers.
--

-Mike-
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snip

Submitted without comment: http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/jk/021127.htm http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/jc/esc.htm
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The anti SUV invironuts have been playing with statistics for years, in an effort to scare buyers from buying the, larger safer, SUVs they prefer to buy. Wheelbase, vis a v height, has a greater effect on a vehicles ability to roll, when maneuvering, than the center of gravity. The center of gravity of the average SUV is less than two inches higher that the average car. No vehicle is prone to rollover, none. Even if lifted to 45 degrees or more, they have a tendency to fall back on the wheels.
Watch all of the SUVs in movie stunts. Stunt drivers spin them in circles, but they do not roll. To make a vehicle roll the stunt people run one side of the vehicle up a four foot high ramp, hidden behind something, to create the roll. Watch the NASCAR truck races. Even at 150 MPH, lots of spins, but few roll unless the hit something. If the center of gravity was what made a vehicle roll over, one should expect to see six wheeled trucks rolled over daily. LOL
mike hunt

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ability
degrees
Actually, you are wrong there Mike. Subject to eratic turns the SUV is indeed more likely to roll over than a car with a center of gravity several inches lower. BTW - the ctg is more than a two inch difference. Don't argue - just simply go look out your window.

circles,
side
create
rolled
That has got to be one of the most assinine statements I've ever read.
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-Mike-
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(...)

They do get to go faster. Just that they stop at the same speed as cars and SUVs without 4WD.
But, I do agree that a lot of people get a false sense of security from driving SUVs and from 4WD.

I have never heard of 4WD systems where the 4WD kicks off after attaining a higher speed.

I think they would drive just as aggressively in a Ford Escort.
But, a Ford Escort would be less likely to turn over.

That's not NASCAR style. NASCAR and its drivers are very concerned about safety and avoiding crashes. While they seem to weave in and out, considering how fast they are going and the G-forces on them, the driver you are talking about is not driving NASCAR style at all.

No, he was not executying Jeff Gording style driving. Maybe Home Simpson style driving.

Neither he nor anyone else deserved what they got.
Jeff

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Well, if anyone got hurt, he certainly deserved it more than the innocent people he endangered with his wreckless driving. The dude was driving recklessly. I witnessed it. He was weaving in and around other cars and was speeding. If anyone got hurt from it, it's best to be him, since he caused it.
-
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Mike Marlow wrote:

Most marketing estimates put the fractor of truck buyers who have a significant need for such a vehicle at between 25% and 50% of the trucks sold. Perhaps you are in that segment which has a real need for trucks, but surely you must know that a great many truck buyers are motivated by style or image concerns rather than real need.
John
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That may be your opinion but in the opinion of those who buy them the must need them or they would not be buying them. Just like you and every other buyer you spend you money where you wish. ;)
mike hunt

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What you think will only come into play when you buy their vehicles for them, or build a train station near where they live and work LOL
mike hunt

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Jeff wrote:

Not Mike. He drives two cars *everywhere* even if he needs to do it personal!
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Actually I fly more than I drive. ;)
mike

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With $3 Gas, Detroit Pays for Its Past
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/07/28/business/worldbusiness/28auto.html?_r=1&oref=slogin&pagewanted=print
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I wouldn't register on the traitorous New York Times site for any article.
Post the article or go home...
--

Scott in Florida

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wrote:

I won't post copyrighted material in violation of the copyright law.
Jeff

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Then go home would be my advice....

--

Scott in Florida

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