Vibe vs. Matrix

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Hello,
I am a long time (20+ years) VW enthusiast who has grown tired of the last few Golf/Jetta models and am looking for a better alternative. The
Vibe/Matrix and Subaru Impreza are on my short list and I would appreciate some comments from users.
Along with general impressions of the Vibe; I would also like to know why people selected it over the Matrix. I prefer the styling of the Vibe and the added features that Pontiac includes. However, some auto reviewers have advised that the Matrix costs less and will most likely have a higher resale value down the road. What to others think?
I am looking to purchase the standard model with manual transmission, upgraded radio, ABS brakes and package that includes the power locks/windows. So comments concerning these options and manual transmission would be helpful.
If anyone has an opinion of the 2004 Impreza I would appreciate hearing it.
Thanks,
Vern Tarbutt
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I have a 03 Vibe and love it. It has great pickup. I think the GT would be fun too. Don't get the optional 17 tires.I gety about 32 mpg. .

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"Vern Tarbutt" wrote in part: | | I am a long time (20+ years) VW enthusiast who has grown tired of the last | few Golf/Jetta models and am looking for a better alternative. The | Vibe/Matrix and Subaru Impreza are on my short list and I would appreciate | some comments from users. | | Along with general impressions of the Vibe; I would also like to know why | people selected it over the Matrix. I prefer the styling of the Vibe and | the added features that Pontiac includes. However, some auto reviewers have | advised that the Matrix costs less and will most likely have a higher resale | value down the road. What to others think?
Matrix will DEFINTELY have a higher resale. In the USA, it also has a better warranty than the Pontiac.
OTOH, styling is a matter of individual taste, but to my eye the Pontiac looks much better.
I would also consider individual Toyota and Pontiac dealers. Do you use dealers for service? Is service better at one than another? What about sales and prices? And what about parts departments?
john cline ii, who hopes that helps
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We looked at both Matrix and Vibe when they were first introduced. My preference would have been for the Toyota as it is "home-grown" (i.e. made in Cambridge Ontario), but the local dealers were typically Toyota-arrogant, refusing to do anything other than call when a suitable vehicle was delivered. In addition, the equipment choices on the Canadian models were much more restrictive than offered in the U.S., and my impression of the Toyota styling features (side sculpting especially) was not positive. We found a rural Pontiac dealer that was helpful, co-operative and pleasant (some of the 'big-box' stores were shameful in their loading of "mandatory options"), and the vehicle has been a pleasure since delivery.
One warning though --- don't know what Toyota is fitting, but the oem Continental tires on the Vibe are, in my humble opinion, crap. Regular rotation is an absolute MUST every 10,000 km or so just to prevent cupping of the tread, which leads to so much tread noise you'd think you were on off-road tires. I replaced the full set (even though only the fronts were worn out) with Uniroyals and the dynamics of the car were improved instantly.
From what 2 different tire dealers tells me, this rear tire 'cupping' problem is common on several fwd cars with fully independent rear suspension (which the fwd Vibe/Matrix does NOT have), but they are seeing it consistently on the V/M twins now too. When I went to the Bridgestone guy, he knew the mileage on the car within 2,000 km without even looking at the odometer, just from the state of the tires. He said that it looked like 30,000 kms (less than 20,000 miles) was pretty much the limit on the Contis he'd replaced.
Hello,
I am a long time (20+ years) VW enthusiast who has grown tired of the last few Golf/Jetta models and am looking for a better alternative. The Vibe/Matrix and Subaru Impreza are on my short list and I would appreciate some comments from users.
Along with general impressions of the Vibe; I would also like to know why people selected it over the Matrix. I prefer the styling of the Vibe and the added features that Pontiac includes. However, some auto reviewers have advised that the Matrix costs less and will most likely have a higher resale value down the road. What to others think?
I am looking to purchase the standard model with manual transmission, upgraded radio, ABS brakes and package that includes the power locks/windows. So comments concerning these options and manual transmission would be helpful.
If anyone has an opinion of the 2004 Impreza I would appreciate hearing it.
Thanks,
Vern Tarbutt
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Who cares about "Vibe" Shampoo vs. the "Matrix" movie?
Since when does this newsgroup include buying decisions about tires on rice rockets in Canada?
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Spoken like a true Neanderthal. Post again as soon as you learn how to walk upright ..........
Who cares about "Vibe" Shampoo vs. the "Matrix" movie?
Since when does this newsgroup include buying decisions about tires on rice rockets in Canada?
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Wiley Coyote.
Are you really a Canuck computer nerd, geek, mental midget or a rocket scientist?
In order for you to walk upright, apparently you require the services of a Proctologist so you can again learn to walk upright!
I am impressed at your mastery of Word Power and diction.
Which time era do you live? I happen to be living in 2003.

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Good for you! Coherent sentences. Now if you can drop the red-neck attitude you might just make the evolutionary selection process

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What rock did you crawl from underneath?
Are you brain dead?
Did your parents have any children that lived?
You must be the red neck to be able to refer someone else as one.
Only a fancier of rice rockets posting on this newsgroup worries about his own evolutionary selection process. So when will you leave the North American Continent for either Japan or Korea? They would be glad to host your demented presence.

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LMAO......you are GREAT........keep it up........haven't laughed this much in a long time (I'm sure Don Rickles could supply a few more witty phrases for you)

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VIBE IS MATRIX MATRIX IS VIBE SAme car different name.

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Thank you "Tj" for the clarification. Since I don't care about Asian cars, are these two rice rockets?

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any particular reason why you despise Asian cars?
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That answer is very simple why I despise Asian cars, those Asian cars being made overseas displace American workers to the unemployment lines and the profits go to their native country. Ultimately, this will contribute to the decline of middle income America and our standard of living as a nation. Thus, a nation of haves and have nots.
We as a nation by purchasing foreign junk actually contribute to the apathy, decline of Yankee ingenuity, and decline of the domestic multiplier effect of private sector manufacturing jobs. Those manufacturing jobs are being replaced by private sector service jobs with a lesser multiplier effect. We maybe unknowingly have become a nation of cheap skates! Try serving a product liability suit for shoddy merchandise against one of these Asian companies?
By purchasing annually foreign products we have caused the US to become the world's largest debtor nation. The US balance of payments reflect that we import more than we export.
I cited these reasons because I was asked. My answer is based upon 35 plus years in the auto parts business. There are some that will read this reply turns wrenches for a living and relies upon a computer to do their job probably doesn't understand my reply.
I do not care to be lectured how anyone perceives how wrong I may be. I have first hand experience observing the decline of our domestic auto and auto parts industry. Seven of those years included being a direct aftermarket parts account of AC Delco div. of General Motors. GM went from almost 50 percent domestic auto market share in the 1960's to less than 30 percent today. We also as a nation from then to now saw a decline of hundreds of thousands of auto production and auto parts industry jobs just went poof.

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Dear '39 Plymouth-Lover
Since you apparently haven' t had the time to read a newspaper since '65 (so much to do, I know), I'd be overjoyed to help you out here.
The Toyota Matrix is assembled in Cambridge Ontario Canada by the Toyota Motor Manufacturing Company (TMMC), from largely North American sourced components.
The Pontiac Vibe, though structurally and mechanically identical, is assembled in California by the General Motors-Toyota joint venture company known as New United Motor Manufacturing Incorporated (NUMMI), again, with some major exceptions, from locally-sourced components.
The engineering was split between Toyota and GM, but originated with the North American market Toyota Corolla.
Obviously since both come from such overwhelmingly Asian locations, they MUST be termed "rice rockets"
Always glad to help out a friend with such a terrific sense of humour (oops! I used the "foreign" spelling ... hope that doesn't offend you too much ......lol)
As always,
Your friend, The Chevrolet-driving "fancier of rice rockets" (sorry, never cared too much for Plymouths)

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I also drive daily and enjoy domestic made Chevrolets.
You "Chris Moore" are probably very ignorant that Plymouth was the first mass produced car to have hydraulic brakes in 1928. There were other historical milestones Chrysler had introduced from then till present including the alternator and push button automatic transmission control.
The 39 Plymouth actually is drivable and inherited from my father's estate that needs a frame up resto. It doesn't require computer diagnosis. In their heyday prewar Plymouths were observed getting about 21 mpg without meeting government mandated emissions.
Having 35 plus years in the auto parts industry, I have fond remembrance at the beginning of my tenure of customers asking for parts for a Chevrolet, Ford, or Plymouth and not Accord, Matrix, or Vibe.
Why should we deny the fact for many years Chevrolets, Fords, and Plymouths were the top selling domestic car brands in the US?
Since, I am a American Veteran and accept the US was the victor in the Pacific Theater of WWII against the Japanese. My body and torso will not fit into rice rockets very well. I don't care to purchase a rice rocket anytime soon.
So why should I care about Matrix's or Vibe's, their engineering or where they are assembled? Also, I don't care where "Chris Moore"'s rice pacifier and rice diapers originated.

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"5WindowCoupe" a.k.a.Ken Heslin, ( snipped-for-privacy@columbus.rr.com ) a.k.a. a
wrote in message

Ignorant would appear to be the operative word Ken. Check out this website under "Brakes":
http://www.motorera.com/history/hist07.htm
There you will learn, and I quote that: "In 1918, a young inventor named Malcolm Lougheed (who later changed the spelling of his name to Lockheed) applied hydraulics to braking. He used cylinders and tubes to transmit fluid pressure against brake shoes, pushing the shoes against the drums. In 1921, the first passenger car to be equipped with four-wheel hydraulic brakes appeared -- the Model A Duesenberg.
Carmakers as a group were not quick to adopt hydraulics. Ten years after the Model A Duesie, in 1931, only Chrysler, Dodge, Desoto, Plymouth, Auburn, Franklin, Reo, and Graham had hydraulic brakes. All the others still had cable-operated mechanical brakes. In fact, it was not until 1939 that Ford finally gave in, becoming the last major manufacturer to switch to hydraulic brakes.
The basic braking system we have today was pretty much in place by 1921, including a refinement some regard as contemporary -- power assist."

Wrong again Ken! GM holds that title. You may wish to check the attached link under "Electrical System":
http://www.motorera.com/history/history.htm
There you will find and I quote: "During World War II, the military needed an electrical generating unit that could provide more current than the d.c. generator. They found it with the a.c. (alternating current) generator, commonly called the alternator.
In 1962, the alternator for civilian vehicles arrived none too soon: The number of electrical devices manufacturers put on cars by then began to strain the limits of the d.c. generator. The first car manufacturer to make the alternator available was GM, followed shortly by Chrysler."
Ken, check your facts before labelling someone else as ignorant. Just remember Ken, when you point your index finger at someone, you have the three other fingers on your hand pointing right back at yourself! You seem to be a very bitter man Ken. Has life dealt you a bitter hand Ken? Or were you the dealer?
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Interesting facts sir, I always appreciate a knowledgeable, reasoned argument.
Seems Ken is longing for the "good old days" of American isolation. None of us will see such days again, and ranting on about it just puts one into the 'dinosaur' category (they make good fuel, but poor farm animals .... lol)
I would also question his grasp of global economics when he states that computer 'geeks' wouldn't understand. Well, I used to work for Westinghouse building home appliances (long gone now), work at a steel company now (but who knows for how long?) and am currently watching a vast number of computer service jobs disappear to India. So, do I "get" it? Absolutely! Do I wish it were otherwise? No, not really .... life goes on, and you either adapt or die.
In addition, I am far more aware of the multitude of American engineering innovations than you imagine, as I have performed 2 or 3 "frame-up" restorations myself over the years; but as they say, "that was then and this is now". I have never claimed that American vehicles are crap, though some have qualified as such, but then so have several of my "foreign" cars over the years. I merely object to anyone using derogatory terminology to advance a close-minded, obsolete view. Name calling doesn't make your point more correct, just more pathetic.
Mr. Heslin, I am hardly in need of a "rice pacifier" as I am on the far side of 50, and have owned many cars (US, German, British and Japanese) over the past 35+ years. Once again, you try to fit people into a mould that suits your argument and it works against you.
and with that, sir, I leave you .........
(btw. "Veteran" should be a description of something you have done, not of who you are)

Ignorant would appear to be the operative word Ken. Check out this website under "Brakes":
http://www.motorera.com/history/hist07.htm
There you will learn, and I quote that: "In 1918, a young inventor named Malcolm Lougheed (who later changed the spelling of his name to Lockheed) applied hydraulics to braking. He used cylinders and tubes to transmit fluid pressure against brake shoes, pushing the shoes against the drums. In 1921, the first passenger car to be equipped with four-wheel hydraulic brakes appeared -- the Model A Duesenberg.
Carmakers as a group were not quick to adopt hydraulics. Ten years after the Model A Duesie, in 1931, only Chrysler, Dodge, Desoto, Plymouth, Auburn, Franklin, Reo, and Graham had hydraulic brakes. All the others still had cable-operated mechanical brakes. In fact, it was not until 1939 that Ford finally gave in, becoming the last major manufacturer to switch to hydraulic brakes.
The basic braking system we have today was pretty much in place by 1921, including a refinement some regard as contemporary -- power assist."

Wrong again Ken! GM holds that title. You may wish to check the attached link under "Electrical System":
http://www.motorera.com/history/history.htm
There you will find and I quote: "During World War II, the military needed an electrical generating unit that could provide more current than the d.c. generator. They found it with the a.c. (alternating current) generator, commonly called the alternator.
In 1962, the alternator for civilian vehicles arrived none too soon: The number of electrical devices manufacturers put on cars by then began to strain the limits of the d.c. generator. The first car manufacturer to make the alternator available was GM, followed shortly by Chrysler."
Ken, check your facts before labelling someone else as ignorant. Just remember Ken, when you point your index finger at someone, you have the three other fingers on your hand pointing right back at yourself! You seem to be a very bitter man Ken. Has life dealt you a bitter hand Ken? Or were you the dealer?
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Hi Chris! Great response! Ken has been trolling this NewsGroup for several months now pestering everyone he can. We have found that he generally backs down when faced with a reasoned response such as yours because his proverbial bullshit doesn't seem to baffle brains. When confronted with facts, he seems to get confused! *lol*
Chris, on a personal note, I noticed your comment about working for a steel company. It's probably Stelco, but possibly Dofasco and I've toured through both in years past. I've also been in the old Westinghouse plant a number of years ago. Are things as bleak at Stelco as I read in the Star? I hope that everything works out for you and your fellow workers. That pension underfunding has to be a real concern. I understand that things aren't too rosy at Dofasco either, although they're still making money. By the way, both of my kids live down your way.
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And I still feel left out..... Chris, keep beating him, and eventually he will ignore you. He ignores both me and Stingray!!

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