Why is Everyone Diss'n GM?

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snipped-for-privacy@mailcity.com wrote:


WHEN THEY MAKE A PROFIT, that is. Even then, it goes to our government, which contributes almost notihng of that money into the local economy.
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You must have missed your economics 101 class. Even if that were true, the fact that American corporations pay taxes keeps your taxes down and the shareholders pay taxes on dividends as well. Buying a Toyota only benefits Japan, takes capital our of the country, worsens the trade deficit, helps to devalue the dollar, lowers the wage base in the US and hurts SS, for starters.
mike hunt
Joseph Oberlander wrote:

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snipped-for-privacy@mailcity.com wrote:

Looks good on paper, but fails in practice as those who get dividends are almost always able to find a way to not have to pay much if any tax on them. And lately, GM isn't making any profit.
But the most important fact is that economic aside, the waste and corruption of our government means that little or nothing really gets into the economy from GM's taxes. Wel, not unless you count missile defense systems that don't work, two concurrent wars with no end in sight, paying for people to write and produce fake propaganda as news...
I consider every dime that I give to them to be gone. The money I pay locally, otoh, it makes a real difference.

Very slightly by comparison, since GM seems hell-bent on taking the capital it has overseas or across the border anyways. Toyota wants to make more vehicles here.
The end result is that where it's made is really 90% of the equation. Sure, the other 10% matters, but it's not nearly as critical.
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Like I said you must have missed your economics 101 class if that is what you believe It is difficult to enlighten one who does not yet understand the basics, bye LOL
mike hunt
Joseph Oberlander wrote:

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snipped-for-privacy@mailcity.com wrote:

I see that "economics 101" seems to be doing our nation well. Massive debts, no accountability, and nothing to fall back on if it all comes apart.
I wonder what other nonsense they teach at most universities these days? That they have to teach ethics classes to business majors should be some hint.
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You are entitled to your own opinion, no matter how misinformed or convoluted it may be. ;)
mike hunt
Joseph Oberlander wrote:

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Unless the dividend is paid into a IRA account, one certainly DOES pay taxes on dividends received. At least everyone I know does. The interesting thing is that if one receives dividends from a foreign country (say Nokia), you get a tax credit to offset the foreign tax you paid to the host country. It's interesting that the Feds give you a credit for the portion of your dividend that was already taxed in a foreign country but doesn't give you credit for US taxes already paid in the dividend from a US company.
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James C. Reeves wrote:

But huge corporations aren't you or I and can find dozens of ways to dodge most of their taxes, especially when they are not doing well, like GM is right now.
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The only way one can 'dodge paying taxes' as you seem to believe is to show a loss, rather than a profit. However the fact is GM is still paying a dividend for the first quarter, on which the shareholders will pay taxes. The loss in the first quarter does not mean GM will not show a profit for the year. GM will pay taxes on all of the profits earned in the US at that time. That is something the Japanese manufactures, like Toyota, that earns profit in the US will not do. That is the point of this discussion, in case your forgot.
I would be to your advantage to not keep commenting on this subject of which you obviously have little or no knowledge
mike hunt
Joseph Oberlander wrote:

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wrote:

If the government doesn't put the money back to the US economy, the where does the money go?
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wrote:

dollars worth of Treasury bonds held by the Japanese and other countries. Bonds they bought with dollars they got from Americans for their products. Dollars they don't want to spend on American products.
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wrote:

That accounts for a fraction of it. What about the rest?
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wrote:

I am only saying that is where part of it might go. The interest on $2 Trillion is about $100 Billion. Not a minor "fraction". That is approximately 1/4 of the Deficit.
Of course much will go for other "legitimate expenses" such as maintaining our "occupation troops" in Germany, Japan and Korea as well as Iraq. All of course countries that will rise up again and become a world menace if we don't control them.
Someday the trade deficit has to come home. Those dollars are supposed to be used to purchase American products. Not to support out debt. With the dollar falling most countries are losing interest in supporting our debt. What happens next?
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Rich256 wrote:

This, unfortunately, is quite easy to predict.
- Bush keeps the economy afloat by any means necessarry during his next three years, - Greenspan passes away about that time. The combined effect is that the wizard who kept everything running isn't there when the next big problem happens. - The problem looming, of course, is a change from U.S. dollars to the Euro in world monetary funds and oil trading. 5 years at most.
That's 40% of our money's value, folks. All based upon stock-market type inflation and speculation. Once this change happens and we loose our image and leverage, we're sunk if we are trillions in debt, because everyone will start calling in their loans. Our credit rating drops, raising rates in a vicious cycle.
And Greenspan isn't there to save us. Downward spiral into a depression. China and other countries owns half of our economy in its grip by then. We make hardly anything domestically anymore, leading to a situation where we either pay high prices locally or import everything(see Japan for an example of this). Now, this is surviveable IF we don't have a huge debt. California is a good example of this - we borrowed our way out of bankruptcy, which will likely mean a repeat in a few years since nobody seems to be repaying it OR reducing what we are overspending.
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The American consumer can turn the trade deficit around in no time. Do what the Japanese consumers do to support their own economy and protect their own jobs. Buy those products made by their own corporations, in their own factories and avoid imported products whenever possible.
mike hunt
Joseph Oberlander wrote:

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The US consumer is to short sighted and focused on themselves to do for the "common good".

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snipped-for-privacy@mailcity.com wrote:

And the problem with that is... Exactly. We don't make most consumer goods in the U.S. anymore, unlike Japan. There's nothing to fall back on compared to even twenty years ago.
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The may be true if you only shop K Mart. There are plenty of American products of all types on the market, one need only look at labels. I make it a point to do just that, although it is problem to find some things that are still American made.
When it comes to motor vehicles I buy only those made by an American corporations in and American factory with mostly American parts that have a '1' as the first number of the VIN.. No Toyotas, Subarus, or BMWs that are only assembled in the US, or Crown Vics or Chrysler from Canada or Silverado or Tacomas from Mexico, and etc. for me.
mike hunt
Joseph Oberlander wrote:

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James C. Reeves wrote:

I hear a lot of it is going to fund two wars overseas. Oh, and to bail out Social Security, which is hopelessly broken.
Certainly not going to help rebuild the streets and keep the schools nearby running. That's all state-level money.
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GM never lost anything, you can't lose what you never had. They didn't post porfits as high as predicted would be the correct statement.
The Camry may be assembled here in the states BUT with all asian parts. NO US content.
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