'93 civic, engine cuts out while driving on highway ?

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And they said I was nuts... :)
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Tegger

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E wrote

Who said this? :-) I just checked my personal "Honda Maintenance" spreadsheet with the OEM maintenance schedule and the ones others recommend, and what you do is not far from what is OEM recommended: 60k/4 years for wires, rotor and cap. I am going with yours for the immediate future, though. Or I will go to four years, since as of a few months ago, I am now living in an even hotter climate out West, and I think the heat takes more of a toll on the electronics and electrical (read: battery especially!) parts.
Jim, understood about the transients. Bad wording on my part. I was trying to give the practical, "for-the-amateur," candidate solution to the transients.
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wrote

A very important additional point to be made is that coil/wire arcing and leakage to ground will result in a steady flow of tiny misfires, much too small to be felt by you, and possibly even the OBD-II system.
These misfires are by far and away the #1 cause of catalytic converter failure. The constant trickle of unburnt fuel "sinters" the surface of the cat, reducing its surface area, and thus reducing its effectiveness.
The OBD-II system makes a very big deal of monitoring closely for misfires for this very reason.
Replacement of the entire HT side with new OEM every four or five years (plugs more often than that) will do much to help your horrendously expensive OEM cat last the lifetime of the vehicle.
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Tegger

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controls its own

igniter has

failure.
igniter.
Tegger, i took my igniter apart to see what was inside. (it is labeled OKI.)
i popped the plastic panel off the back there was sticky (but not strong) transparent gel around the electronics. I could see smallish silver wires welded to each outer ternminal and then connected to contact points/pads on the circuit board.. while removing the gel *carefully* with Q-tip, one of the silver wires easily came away from it's pad/tower. then one of the pads/towers (that the wires connected to) just lifted off the circuit board ( no force ) this was not good as i could not budge any of the remaining contact pads by jamming with a Q-tip. when i inspected the pad and circuit board with a magnifyng glass there appeaared to be corrosion or oxidation where the loose pads were mounted
so i tested switching electronics by using sharp probes and making the test contacts directly onto circuit board pads or pad mount points... to my surprise the ignitor ****works and switches ****
So in my case it seems to be a mechanical failure with the circuit connections... inside the ignitor
rob
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Tegger has/had a picture of an igniter on his website,and that one had a ceramic substrate for a circuit board.It has the resistors printed directly on the ceramic,"thick-film" resistors.It makes a very durable,reliable component.
Was yours an epoxy-glass (or worse,phenolic) PCB with soldered-on (discrete)resistors? If so,I wonder if it were a non-OEM igniter? Maybe you could post a pix or 2 somewhere?
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Jim Yanik
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Still do, as a link to Grahame Wood's page in the UK: http://www.gcw.org.uk/rover/igniter.htm .

Send 'em to me. I'll put them up.
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Very interesting. I'd love to see pictures, if you can get them. Especially of the wire having come loose from its pad.
Grahame Wood has similar pics on his Web site, here: http://www.gcw.org.uk/rover/igniter.htm
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labeled
them. Especially

sure i can do that but i do not have a convenient web site to post pics, i will need to put them on one of the file share sites or post to some binary usenet group e.g. alt.binaries.???
all the terminal wires have broken off while finishing the cleaning and performing the test with the probes. those silver connector wires were quite fragile... one bend and a return bend and they popped right off the pads that the wires connected to on the actuall circuit board might be more interesting as they should be welded to the circuit board and not pop off at all.
then the one pad that did dis-connect had corrosion on the weld where it was suppose to be conected to circuit board. looked like lead that is oxidized, dark gray and when you scratch it you get shiny silver
i'll find a place to post the pics and post links here later, rob
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Email them to me. I'll make them part of the igniter pages.
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robb wrote:

interesting! can't see how it would be possible to prevent this, or fix it, but interesting nevertheless!
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Without seeing a pic,I'd say it was a cheaply made igniter. It sounds like the wire broke from vibration or thermal stress.The pad lifting seems like it's a cheapo circuit board,not a ceramic substrate. I'd like to see a pic.
On http://www.gcw.org.uk/rover/igniter.htm that black goo may be a grease to keep out water. If it were accumulated engine/road crud,it would have a gritty feel to it.
Robb's tranlucent goo may be a different grease,perhaps a silicone grease.
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Jim Yanik
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I'd agree with that.

See a whole page, with more details, here: http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/igniter-failure/index.html
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Tegger

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well,it IS a ceramic substrate. It looks like there was a bond failure on that one pad. that should not be a very common problem. My own experience is that you cannot resolder them once they break,but others have said if you use "special solder",you can.I can't say how reliable that would be,but I'd not risk it.
It also looks like the switcher transistor is a bare chip die bonded to the aluminum backing,interesting. I'd say that this igniter is a lower quality one than the one depicted on Graham's Rover page. That one uses eyelets to connect to the ceramic substrate's pads,much sturdier mechanically.
Nice page,BTW,Tegger.
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Jim Yanik
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Thanks.
I seem to remember that Honda once had a TSB or HSN article on igniter failure where the OKI igniter was bad and the NEC one was good. I can't find it just now, though...
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An exception would be the most expensive part, the igniter. You should be able to retrieve a decent used OEM igniter from a local wreckers for about five or ten bucks.
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Tegger

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Thanks for all help Tegger and jim beam,
Problem was definately the ignitor.
Went with your advices and purchsased Honda parts, the ignitor/ICM was ($126).
installed ICM and car fired right up.
the bent dist. cap contact spring must have come from some lazy azz who did not want to pull spark plug wires to put distributor cap back on (dealer replaced the distributor about 3 years ago) but that seems to just mean the shell/housing as they transfered all the old internal parts {ICM,coil, rotor, dist cap} to the new distributor housing
I went ahead and checked the Mains Relay (for solder problems)... i must have the new design as there was lots of solder on the connections with very large traces between the connections, looked good to me.
thanks again for the help. robb
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robb wrote:

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Look inside the valve cover (oil filler cap) while cranking. If nothing is moving, it's the Timing Belt. Removing the distributor cap will confirm the same, while cranking for a second.
'Curly'
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