Alternator Brush Assembly Guidance?

"Elle" wrote in news:NCTKf.2701$ snipped-for-privacy@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net:

Yes.

It's a soft silicone rubber. Mine was orange. It's very easily torn, I discovered (oops), so you have to be very careful pulling it out of its recess.

And I actually removed all the nuts from the underside of the car. Access was too hard from up top in my car.

Two important notes when reassembling: Sand ALL electrical connections bright before rejoining, and DO NOT overtighten! You will break something!

It is. If the screws are rusty, it will be a struggle. The best thing to use is a brand-new (stubby) Phillips screwdriver. I say "new" because that way you're assured of the best fit possible and the least chance of stripping.

Here's my short writeup after fixing mine in 2002:

My brush fix lasted until last summer, when the stator and commutators corroded together, requiring replacement of the original alternator.

This looks just like the alternator on an 88 accord I recently swapped out. Yes, you have brush holder/insulator correctly identified. If you got this far, getting the brushes out pas this point is very easy. Two screws and the whole assembly comes out.

------------- Alex

Yes, you have.

In my opinion, no. But, mine is a civic hatchback with zero wiggle room. I had to remove my alternator and that was hard enough. Also, putting the new brushes assy back on can be tricky. You must slide the spring loaded brushes back over the slip rings and the smaller diameter between the two rings allows the innermost brush to push down into the recess. Forcing the inner brush against the now larger diameter of the inner slip ring may chip or break the brush. I used a very small diameter spring steel rod (a very small dia drill bit would also work nicely) layed over the slip rings to hold the brushes up in the holder while sliding the brush assy back in place over the slip rings. I then pulled the rod out which let the two brushes drop down on the slip rings undamaged. This may be all but impossible to do with the alternator still mounted. Also, you may have great difficulty replacing the screws. One of the two screws holding the brush assy is recessed and will be almost impossible to replace without a phillips screw holder/driver. A magnetic screwdriver would also work for this.

When you get your new brushes, get the whole brush holder assy. It comes with a new brush holder insulator and makes the whole job so much easier and quicker.

nb

Tegger, how many miles were on your 91 Integra when the stator and commutator gave up?

Also, may I incorporate some of your remarks at the site I threw together? I'll put them down as something like "specific anecdotal experience" with this job.

Alex and Bob, I'd also like to incorporate some of your remarks at the site, too. Okay?

"TeGGeR®" wrote snip but comments noted

Fine by me. Thanks for the great site.

nb

"Elle" wrote in news:J33Lf.4360$ snipped-for-privacy@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net:

About 240,000. Keep in mind the failure was was due only to corrosion. If I lived in a place with better weather, I'd probably still be driving on that alternator. It was charging fine right up to the end. The car sat for two weeks while we were on vacation, which gave corrosion lots of time to close the small gap that remained. If I hadn't let it sit, it may have taken several more months to seize.

Also, I made a small error in my reply: It was the *sealing gasket* that was orange silicone and fragile, not the brush holder. You have to carefully remove the *sealing gasket* before the brush holder can be removed. (It appears to have been removed in your photos).

Go ahead.

At the time, I was going to take photos of the job, but the driveway was wet and cold, and it was night-time and snowing. I just wanted to get it over with.

notbob wrote in news:27idndfQcsCQJ2HeRVn- snipped-for-privacy@comcast.com:

I had no trouble with that. As I recall, I just used a tiny flat-blade screwdriver to help the brushes over the edge of the slip rings.

Again, I had no trouble, even doing it one-handed. using a new, well- fitting stubby screwdriver is a big help. I just held the screw on to the screwdriver with my fingers while guiding them into place.

Sure does. The brush holder is a great big heat sink. In retrospect, I should have used a small butane torch when replacing my brushes instead of an iron.

Ah, but you used something, didn't you! Same problem, different solution. ;)

Yeah, but I'm a big ol' sausage fingered klutz.

Plus, I wasn't in the mood to play "chase the spring". But, if one is feeling all handyman-ish or on a really tight budget, $20 can be saved by replacing just the brushes. The brushes alone are about $4-5 per pair and the whole assy with new insulator is about $25.

My biggest problem was getting the damn alternator out. It was a seriously tight press fit in the alternator bracket. After removing the alternator bolt, the alternator had to be very forcefully pried free from the bracket with a 18" pry bar. To remount it, I had to grind about .020" material off the alternator.

nb

notbob wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@comcast.com:

In my case I didn't know about the brush holder replacement at the time and never thought to phone the dealer to ask.

I just picked up a set of replacement brushes for five bucks at a local rebuilders that was nice enough to sell them to me.

"TeGGeR®" wrote

Okay.

I don't know. At the time, I hadn't even figured out where the two screws were for the brush assembly. I didn't take anything from the center area off. I don't see this gasket listed at Majestic's site, so I suppose it comes with the brush holder insulator. Maybe mine was too grimy to be obvious. All the photos at the site were taken after I cleaned the parts up a little.

I added some comments from the newsgroup to the site. Thanks for the input, bob, alex, and tegger, as well as the several others of you who have commented on this job in the past year.

Sure.

---------- Alex

"Elle" wrote in news:cVnLf.4611$ snipped-for-privacy@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net:

The two screws are under that gasket, as I recall. My brush holder was original, and from 1991. Maybe replacement gaskets (or aftermarket ones) are a different color.

You'd hope so. They're pretty fragile.

"TeGGeR®" wrote

You must be right. Because of the Majestic or manual drawing of the alternator, I was looking for two horizontally oriented screws, but all I came up with were the ones for what turned out to be the voltage regulator, near the circumference, not the center.

"Elle" wrote in news:ngrLf.247$ snipped-for-privacy@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net:

They are on either side of the alternator's shaft. This is good, really, because being covered by the gasket means most corrosion is kept away from them.

I cannot stress how important it is that your *stubby* Phillips screwdriver be a *perfect* fit in the screws. You need to make sure that you hold the driver straight in line with the screws, and push really hard while turning, to make sure the head doesn't ride up out of the Phillips cross. If it rides out, you may round off the cross enough that removal of the alternator may be the only way to remove the screws.

If the only Phillips driver you have is one size too small, DON'T USE IT! Go buy the proper one.

"TeGGeR®" wrote re the Phillips head screws holding the alternator brush assembly in place:

I have found that slot-end screwdrivers often work better for freeing Phillips head screws. Do you object to such an approach? If so, why?

Not so. Look at the brush assy in this part picture:

You can clearly see the two assy mounting tabs (the little thingies with holes in them) sticking out beyond the "brush holder insulator", that keyhole shaped orange thingie. The reason you can't easily see the screws when the brush assy is mounted on the alternator is because they're both sunken down in between cooling fins and other surrounding junk like the voltage regulator and diode assy. One sits a little further out than the other, but they're both recessed. The screw mounting holes are not holes in the plastic assy housing that run the full length of the assy and put the screw heads out at the outside edge of the brush assy. They are metal tabs, brush contact points, that screw into the rear housing assy and are located at the innermost edge of the brush assy. How wide is the assy housing? About 1 to

1-1/4 inches. Well, that's how deep those tabs sit in from the outside edges of the brush assy.

nb

Hey, nice site and citation!

I got to an enlarged view of the actual assembly via

http://69.0.158.19/live/F402040927OES.JPG or

"Elle" wrote in news:0NtLf.269$ snipped-for-privacy@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net:

You'll see once you get the screws exposed. They are pretty tight, and will release with a snap.

"Elle" wrote in news:LwuLf.3161$ snipped-for-privacy@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net:

Eh, so my memory of them being *under* the gasket was wrong. Four years will do that.