Bad Timing Belt?

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sharx333 wrote:


http://hondaswap.com/attachments/general-tech-maintenance/1034d1159641356-my-cracked-timing-belt-treo_093006_001.jpg
before it broke. it's guess the belt was /way/ over-tight.
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sharx333 wrote:

http://hondaswap.com/attachments/general-tech-maintenance/1034d1159641356-my-cracked-timing-belt-treo_093006_001.jpg DO NOT pass Go. DO NOT collect $200. DO NOT drive your car or go directly to jail. That is the worst belt I have seen on a car that is still running! Replace it now or risk it breaking and bending valves, then you'll have to pull the head.
See some of my prior messages about timing belts...
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.autos.honda/msg/7e2a5e7fb18a4a0 http://groups.google.com/group/alt.autos.honda/msg/800ecbf770a26237 http://groups.google.com/group/alt.autos.honda/msg/8ca278c5ecaf39bc
This is the tool you'll want to use to hold the pulley so you can break the pulley bolt loose...
http://www.etoolcart.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdIDx69
From your photo, it looks like you'll also want to replace the upper and lower covers and gaskets especially if they are warped due to oil exposure. As my other posts have stated, replace the water pump, cam and front crank seals, and timing belt tensioner. If this project seems overwhelming, then find a good independent shop that specializes in Hondas to do it for you. An incorrectly installed timing belt can cost you your engine.
Eric
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I was curious about what Ebay currently has to offer. A few like the one pictured at the link above are available, but there is also this, for the price of $19 before shipping and handling:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/PERFORMANCE-TOOL-HONDA-45MM-CRANK-PULLEY-HOLDING-TOOL_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ35625QQihZ007QQitemZ170023050838QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWD1V
Anyone tried this version?
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http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/PERFORMANCE-TOOL-HONDA-45MM-CRANK-PULLEY-HOLDING-TOOL_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ35625QQihZ007QQitemZ170023050838QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWD1V
the stamped handle might not hold up to repeated use.
Mike
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http://hondaswap.com/attachments/general-tech-maintenance/1034d1159641356-my-cracked-timing-belt-treo_093006_001.jpg
Gee, thanks. Now I have the willies! The timing belt on our old (non-interference) Volvo developed some crazing on the back of the belt before I changed it, but I never thought I'd see anything like that and the engine still running.
Mike
Mike
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> The timing belt on my '95 Civic ESi (1.6L SOHC) is about 4 years old,

From reading here and elsewhere, and keeping an eye on my own, 91 Civic's timing belt, I agree this does not seem normal. Do you know who the belt manufacturer was? Who changed it last, anyway, the dealer or an independent shop? Maybe ask them from where they get the belts, or it might be printed on the belt.
OTOH I do not recall reading caveats about belt manufacturers, perhaps because there are so few manufacturers and they generally produce high quality belts.
What sort of driving conditions does this car see? Anything that would qualify as "extreme" per your owner's manual? E.g. a lot of dust, cold starts, Canada-like temperature extremes?
Has oil per chance leaked onto the belt? There are cautions about avoiding this on the net and when changing it.
Jim Yanik's theory sounds plausible, too. On my 91 Civic, I do not think one can see the sort of detail you're describing by looking at the belt from the bottom. The angle is too extreme.
On the "special" pulley bolt: If I (an amateur who has slowly been accumulating more proficiency in the last ten years) can get it off using hand tools, I think just about anyone can. The route that may be most reliable and least expensive may be taking the car to a garage, having them use their super-duper air impact wrench to loosen the bolt, then just snugging it up for the presumably short trip home. That bolt typically requires serious torque to break free, but I think that's mostly due to it being a fine thread subject to heat cycling over a period of years, so the female and male thread metals tend to "meld" together.
A lot of folks here report having just run the car to their local garage and tipping the techs there $10-$15 or so for breaking the bolt free.
Another resource: http://home.earthlink.net/~honda.lioness/id6.html
I trust you are not driving the car at this point. Doing so risks a broken or failed belt, potentially destroying the engine.
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Elle wrote:

Apart from wading into ankle-deep water a few times, it doesn't see very extreme conditions. Weather is mild here, if somewhat hot and humid. No evidence of oil on the belt, at least not now. It did have a slight leak at the head gasket, before I replaced it. It's an easy jump from there to the belt.
As cars this age go, it has relatively low mileage: less than 60K miles.

Thanks for the advice, Elle. Since getting all your responses, I prudently avoided running the engine. This afternoon I sprayed penetrating oil into the bolt, to maybe help it along. What hand tools did you use? I assume you made your own special wrench.
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I was remiss before: Any liquid falling on the timing belt can reduce its life significantly. So shucks yes, a missing lower cover sure could do this, from my reading, especially if you've been driving through some flooded roads.
Confirm that timing belt cover really is missing via the exploded parts drawings at www.slhondaparts.com . Order a new belt and new cover. Replace. Hopefully you'll be good to go. Also, Eric is one of the Kings here; incredibly experienced. Believe whatever he tells you.

Yes, but yours takes a different version. Both are shown at my amateur web site, previously linked in this thread, and there is a link to a description of a home-made one. Or, as Eric said, you can buy the tool. I think if you shop around a bit on the net, you can find a somewhat cheaper one, like for around $25 before shipping/handling. Ebay is definitely worth checking, too.
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It occured to me - I was talking with our fiber optic cable guru just this week about some damage we had up here from a falling tree, and he was concerned whether the Aramid/Kevlar strands were exposed. He said water severely reduces the strength of Kevlar. I bet the same threads are used for strength in the timing belts, in which case water exposure could cause the sort of "chapping" action the picture shows.
I don't see much on the net about it, though.
Mike
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Good anecdote.
I agree that tool I linked earlier looks flimsier. I would hope it would last at least two TB changes, which is pretty good for $25 total or so. Since "Performance Tool" makes it, then IIRC Pep Boys might carry it, and one could ask what the return policy was. It's specifically supposed to work on certain Hondas, per the description, so I would think PB would refund money readily if it broke the first time around.
Note to some others: If you cannot see the detail in the photo the OP linked, do not feel bad. Neither can I.
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