Car safety stats (risk of death vs risk of killing other drivers)

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What is wrong with a gas tax? Registration fees, once paid, don't discourage anyone from driving.
-- Ron
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Ron Peterson wrote:

iirc, they do _two_ such things in europe:
1. heavily tax gas.
2. tax based on engine size or vehicle weight.
such a policy here would have a much the same effect as there you have to suppose - many more smaller more fuel efficient vehicles.
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Ron Peterson wrote:

The gas tax is such a distributed expense that it's of limited value in changing behavior. Also, the chances of getting a gas tax that is high enough to change behavior is highly unlikely at either the federal or state level given the influence of the oil companies. The big 3 automakers have a lot less money to purchase influence these days, and the other automakers might not be against weight or MPG based vehicle license fees.
When you get hit with a $500 extra fee for registration when you purchase the car, with the knowledge that that fee will be assessed every year, it will have more of an effect.
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Families may own two or more vehicles, one of which, needs to be larger for carrying the whole family and towing a boat or trailer. Your solution doesn't match the needs of those families.
-- Ron
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Ron Peterson wrote:

OMG, that's terrible--charging people extra when they need a large car to tow a boat!
For large families, there are ways to offset the cost with tax credits or tax deductions for large families. Similarly, for vehicles used commercially, the increase in fees can be offset with tax deductions.
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On Fri, 3 Apr 2009 21:36:54 -0700 (PDT), Ron Peterson

Big families might just be one of the things we need to discourage most. As for boats, if you want that luxury you are just going to have to pay (a lot) for it.
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Ron Peterson wrote:

yet another giant myth. european vehicles load families, and tow trailers up the pyrenees and the alps. that's why so many euro cars, even little ones like civics and fits, have tow hitches out there.
yes, you read right, small cars tow trailers*. check out the towing specs of vehicles on honda.co.uk and compare them to the same vehicles sold here. notice the difference?
either us or the europeans are being ripped off with this ridiculous b.s. about needing a honking great monster to tow stuff. i don't think it's them.
* - i think one of the reasons, apart from u.s. oilcos, er, "influencing" road safety laws in favor of larger thirstier vehicles, is that /their/ trailers have brakes. for some reason i simply fail to understand - unless you're paranoid and believe the previous statement - ours don't. you /do/ need a bigger vehicle with more braking capability if your trailer doesn't have brakes, so fit brakes and use a smaller vehicle!
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Most states require brakes on trailers over a certain weight.
-- Ron
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Ron Peterson wrote:

maybe, but that weight is freakin' HUGE. ridiculously so. there's no reason, other than a few hundred bucks, why /every/ trailer shouldn't have brakes. and thus almost every car be able to pull one.
http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/the-great-american-anti-towing-conspiracy /
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SMS wrote:

have you ever been to europe? gas taxes have a *dramatic* effect over there!

you're dead right there.

all detroit has to do is import the smaller more economic vehicles they already make and sell very profitably in europe. the only reason they haven't done it so far is because mercenary jerks like wagoner were trying to get taxpayers to /pay/ him to do it! incredible chutzpah.

only if it's loaded on the heavy thirsty vehicles.
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I'm beginning to think that lowered heavy but unibody SUV would be the safest vehicle of all. What's the heaviest car-based SUV, by the way?
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snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

forget the suv - minivans are the way to go if you want capacity in a safe vehicle.
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wrote:

SUV's original purpose was mainly off-road. Like the old Army Jeep and Land Rovers.Few people use them for that stuff these days.
and the old Land Rovers were only 4 cylinder! they still hauled a lot.
(just saw a neat PBS "Great Cars" show last week about Land Rovers! Today's was about BMW.)
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Most SUV's are incapable of off-road travel these days. The suspension cannot handle it. Many dealers require you to sign a waiver saying that you will not take the SUV off-road, and if you do, damage will not be covered by warranty.

Most Jeep Wranglers are 4's and 6's, and are quite capable towers.

I always found the Land Rover to be ugly as hell and overpriced. If I wanted something for off-road, I'd probably pick up a used Jeep... I only say used because who knows if the new company will maintain quality (which has already deteriorated some)...
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Not surprising. The old Jeeps, from before Chrysler took over, were great vehicles.
Chrysler amazes me. They are all about style over substance. IMO, Chrysler makes some of the best looking cars on the road. It's a shame that they are unreliable pieces of shit...
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On Tue, 07 Apr 2009 22:42:20 -0500, Joe

According to Consumer Reports reliability survey, Land Rovers are the most unreliable vehicle on American roads. Chrysler is second.

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Most probably, Land Rovers are crap over here too, and they've more service stations than do the Jeep network.
--
Clive

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In my experience, the collision insurance for small cars is higher, but the liability is higher for the beasts.
I went from a used Chrysler minivan to a Civic Si. The liability is about 30% lower on the brand new car than it was on the minivan. With full coverage, my Si only costs a couple hundred a year more to insure than the minivan did with liability alone.
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On Mon, 06 Apr 2009 23:35:15 -0500, Joe

This varies state-to-state. I live in Illinois. I once got a cold call from a car insurance agent. I told him I might consider a policy from him if his company charged significantly less for liability on my Integra than what they would charge me for a Suburban. He assured me that the Integra would be much cheaper. I told him to run the numbers and call me back. To his credit, he called me back and said he couldn't believe it, but I was right. The charge for liability coverage was exactly the same no matter which vehicle I had.

What state do you live in?
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NY.
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