Made in China ... I'm pissed !

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On 10/08/2010 04:41 PM, Brian Smith wrote:


<sarcasm> yeah, north america is such a high cost location, american companies can't afford to operate here... </sarcasm>
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Forrest wrote:

Look before you leap?
The tires you bought were made in China long before your bought them. Somewhere on the tire it says where they are made? China makes things for American suppliers. So it goes in the real world.
Come back in a few years (or earlier if they fail you) and let us know if the China tires met your expectations.
Some of the things I buy at my local Mart of the Waltons are made in China. When I purchase, I have the choice to not buy the item because I don't like it's point of manufacture. So it goes in the real world.
No need to write anyone. Just don't buy products made in China if it bothers you. Buyer Beware! Check the label. 8-)
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On 10/08/2010 07:10 PM, JD wrote:

the point about writing your representatives is so that they /don't/ think it's ok to just keep selling you out. "don't buy" is no damned good when you have no options available.
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jim beam wrote:

How many "representatives" have you written regarding this issue?
What do you have, two Senators, multiple people in the House of Representatives? Or did your write other "representatives"?
Can you provide dates you wrote them and who your wrote?
And did you get a response?
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On 10/08/2010 08:37 PM, JD wrote:

er, don't you know? did you stay awake in civics classes at school? or are you just so apathetic you neither know nor care?

i've written to my congressional representative and both u.s. and state senators, multiple times. and i've never failed to get a response.
some responses are form letters, others are more pertinent to the specific points i've raised, but no response has failed to acknowledge the topics on which i've written, so they are being read, at least by someone who has bothered to makes notes sufficiently to be able to cut and paste.
now, get off your ass and do something. you're sitting in a mighty glassy house for someone trying to throw stones about the dates of my personal correspondence which you know i'll never tell you.
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On 10/08/10 23:37, JD wrote:

No one has multiple people in the US House of Representatives. We all live in a Congressional District and that person is our Representative. Other CDs in the same state have Representatives as well, but they don't represent us. You're free to contact anyone in Congress (I've contacted multiple people on various issues to try to be heard), but you're a constituent only of the Representative from your CD.
Every state has 2 US Senators, both of whom represent the entire state.
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How right you are. I should have been more aggressive in my inquiring about the country of manufacture. It is, without a doubt, my fault for getting stuck with these Chinese tires. I only posted to let others know what's up with the "made by Cooper for Pep Boys" tires. The choice is yours.
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Forrest wrote:

I don't fault you. So you got Chinese tires. What if they work for you? I appreciate your concerns. Check your next tires before you buy.
Like I said, let us know how they work out for you. My preference is to buy American but if that option isn't available then what can you do?
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On 10/08/2010 08:29 PM, JD wrote:

that option is still available - for the moment. people need to make their voice heard on this. don't lose your options through neglect or apathy.
case in point: sears still sell american tools because they listened to their customers. they considered selling out like everyone else, but they did customer surveys and learned that if they /didn't/ sell american, there would be no reason for anyone to buy tools there any more. and sears management had the balls to put their customers first, not wall st.
same for snap-on. same for mac, etc. fact is, people /do/ buy american if they're not being jerked off over the price, and/or are getting value for money.
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On 10/08/10 23:46, jim beam wrote:

Still professional quality tools, but not cheap. Doesn't mean they're not worth it; however, good tools are an investment I'll pass along to my grandchildren.
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I bought a set of "Made in USA" Craftsman because of their lifetime warranty (I've broken some tools in the past when I abused them, no sweat, guy just gave me a new one). When they went to "Made in USA" only tools I asked about it and guy said that there's a mark on the new tools, but the old ones are still "warranted for life".
My wife really abuses them (if you have weeds ...) so I also bought a new chest set and some locks.
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- dillon I am not invalid

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It was available, and that's what I thought I was doing. As I said in a previous post, the same tire brand was made in U.S.A. and that's what I thought I was getting. Anywhooooo .... enough said by me ... did what I wanted to .... let people know that Pep Boys tires, "made by Cooper", an American company, aren't made in the good old U.S.A .... Bye
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On 10/08/2010 09:15 PM, Forrest wrote:

i'll bet you got charged the same as for your previous set of american-made tires too.
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I don't know off hand, what I paid for the American made "Definity" tires that I put on my 87 Ford van. The Two rear tires for our 92 Caddy,"Definity" made in the U.S., were P225/60TR16 (75,000 mile tire) and were $85.99 each. The tires, same brand, that I was "whining" about (Made in China) were Definity HX700 ... P195/60HR14 (55,000 mile tire) and cost $74.99 each. By the time they have torn every extra chunk of flesh that they can get from you, and you have made it out the door, the wallet is lighter by $407.15.
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On 10/15/2010 05:44 PM, Forrest wrote:

so, after you've allowed for size, you're getting charged the same for chinese crap as you were for domestic. i call that a rip-off.
thing that gets me is the deceptiveness of it. the sales guys /know/ consumers hate being ripped off paying the same for chinese crap as they paid for domestic, so they wriggle and squirm. but management doesn't get it because they're out of touch. if they were in touch, they'd know that they can rip off a consumer once, but not twice.
is it /really/ worth losing a customer forever, just the sake of one sale with a slightly higher profit margin? [rhetorical] i can hear the 24yo mba hotshot working on his spreadsheet: "yeah, i can make a 23% margin delta if i sell this goose that keeps laying those funny yellow eggs." brainless idiots.

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As you said, after taking the size difference into consideration, they cost at least as much as the domestic. Also, these tires are only rated for 55,000 miles, as opposed to the 75,000 miles of the others.
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Problem is, it'll take several years to find out if they are decent or just crap.
Remember back when Lee Iocca tried to convince buyers that the Chrysler/Dodge transmissions of the early 80's were not the problem Consumer Reports predicted?
Did many of them pass 100k miles before needing significant repair? (Hint - they were crap, as CR predicted.)
If you want really cheap crap - but Haier. Their products are about as crappy as one can purchase.
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Although most of the retail store crap people buy happens to be made in China,
"The United States remains by far the world's leading manufacturer by value of goods produced. It hit a record $1.6 trillion in 2007 - nearly double the $811 billion of 1987. For every $1 of value produced in China factories, the United States generates $2.50.
So what is made in the U.S.A. these days?
The United States sold more than $200 billion worth of aircraft, missiles and space-related equipment in 2007, and $80 billion worth of autos and auto parts. Deere, best known for its bright green and yellow tractors, sold $16.5 billion worth of farming equipment last year, much of it to the rest of the world.
Then there are energy products like gas turbines for power plants made by General Electric, computer chips from Intel and fighter jets from Lockheed Martin. Household names like GE, General Motors, International Business Machines, Boeing and Hewlett-Packard are among the largest manufacturers by revenue.
Several trends have emerged over the decades:
The United States makes things that other countries cannot. Today, "Made in U.S.A." is more likely to be stamped on heavy equipment or the circuits that go inside other products than the televisions, toys, clothes and other items found on store shelves.
U.S. factories still provide much of the processed food that U.S. households consume, everything from frozen fish sticks to cans of beer. And U.S. companies make a considerable share of the personal hygiene products like soap and shampoo, cleaning supplies and prescription drugs that are sold in pharmacies. "
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On 10/09/2010 04:15 AM, clams wrote:

that article, wherever you got it, is a disappointing blend of woefully over-optimistic ignorance and carefully chosen weasel words.
to go through the list; yes, we "make" aircraft and missiles, but these days, that word should be accurately chosen as "assemble". as you may know from reading about the boeing 787 dreamliner debacle, boeing decided from the start that production was to be outsourced. parts are made in brazil, japan, india, germany, italy, canada, [etc.] and yes, china. and the discontinuity has caused so many problems, without direct manufacturing control, boeing have had major problems. some of which they have only been able to address by taking production back in house. duh.
john deere, yes, they make agricultural equipment here, and mostly american component sourced, but they still end up using parts from china.
aircraft engines? sure, we still make some. but it's crazy - for things like the predator, you know, the cutting edge military pilotless drone making news in afghanistan, it's powered by the rotax engine from austria. the global hawk engine? rolls royce. not that i have a problem with austria or the uk, but wtf are we doing relying on foreigners for our military spy planes for??? unbelievable.
computer? well, i don't own an all american made computer, and unless you're using something like an old ibm at, neither are you. intel may make a few prototypes here, but the bulk of their production is offshore in places like malaysia. dell, hp? not a chance.
textiles? just kidding! sorry.
processed food? well, here's a good one for you. we may grow pistachios here, but they're processed in china. seriously - if anyone can explain the sense in shipping nuts thousands of miles to china, then shipping them thousands of miles back again, i'd love to hear it.
chemicals and pharmaceuticals? well, chemicals is something we do well, and do right. and do here. [anyone saying that we offshore for environmental reasons needs to think about this - we /don't/ offshore the high tech production that goes into our chemical industry, even though a lot of it is highly toxic and environmentally challenging. this is so it doesn't get ripped off.] even the bulk low value stuff. but even so, we're increasingly using precursor chemicals from china. the p.e.t. polymer for soda bottles for instance. [nasty stuff.]
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It appears you don't believe assembly is part of the manufacturing process.
Granted, very few items are probably 100% made from 100% USA made components, but that doesn't mean nothing is made in the US.
Have Breakfast this morning? The toast most likely came from a local / regional bakery, the coffee beans came from Columbia, they were probably ground & roasted within the US and the cereal was made in a Kellogg's, Nabisco or General Foods plant. The packaging (plastic & glass containers plus cardboard boxes) likely were made in the US from US pulp & chemicals. The furniture you sat in / ate off of could very well have come out of North Carolina. The Bosch stove top could very well have been made in New Bern NC as well as the washer & dryer used to clean your clothing. If you stopped by the self laundry, the Speed Queen washers & dryers were made in Ripon, WI. Whirlpool still makes many items in Findley, OH (dishwashers), Refrigerators (AR) and ranges (MS).
Granted, most textile products are imported, but the Polartec in your coat was made in Malden, MA, the carpeting in your house likely came from Dalton GA and the denim in your jeans could very well have been made at one of the Cone Mills plants in NC. Springs Mills is another large manufacturer with dozens of plants through the Carolinas, as well as Milliken. American Apparel in Los Angeles is a large vertical manufacturer of jersey T shirts. about 25% of New Balance shoes are made in the US. Snapper is 90% made-in-US lawn mowers (Toro 85%).
Granted, many components of cars come from overseas, but Goodyear still makes 90% of their tires in the US, Glode Union in WI makes batteries for Interstate and Johnson Controls makes a slew of products in the US for automotive assembly. Tell the employees at Pratt & Whitney & GE that they are not manufacturing anything in the US.
Take a shower today? Your hot water heater could very likely have been made by A O Smith in SC (and shipped in a corrugated box also made from corrugated kraftboard also manufacture in the US.
Channel Lock still makes 100% of its tools in the US, just as Wright Tool in Barberton, OH (wrenches, sockets, pliers, chisels, tool boxes, etc). Pylon windshield wipers are made in the US (Anco & Tricor are made in Mexico). All Toyota engines for Tundra & Tocoma are made in Huntsville, AL.
Martin makes 95% of its guitars in the US, both Selmer and Gibson make 100% of its instruments in the US
As was pointed out, much of the every day crap sold in retail stores likely comes from China, but there's still a lot being made in the US.
As for PET, I can't think of a safer way to make a container. It's essentially inert and a lot safer than cleaning out glass bottles for recycling and a lot more environmentally friendly than the high energy requirements for making & transporting glass. Yes, more and more PET is being imported, but most is still US made plus most all the bottles are made in the US.
and the list can go on and on .............
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