Show cars having specific features?

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wrote:


Agreed. But a dangerous maneuvre in a very "safe" car with lots of clever electronics may still result in a crash. On the other hand, cautious driving in a wildly unstable machine isn't so nasty.

Or the other way around. Traction control isn't as effective as proper traction anyway. It's a shortcut and it isn't as effective in 99% of cases.

Conventional traction control systems are just about useless in wintry conditions. A delicate foot and better tyres is much, much better.

It will even if slight. Thanks to the carbon credit regime, 1% makes a material difference.

That's the same with any manufacturer. You could go to the extreme of fitting lightweight semi-slicks, where they have superb grip and very low weight, if a little short in the longevity stakes... :)

It's the other way around with VAG. You (we) get reliability as standard...

Maybe. Alternatively they'll screw up elsewhere and have to cut costs again.
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wrote:

Honda has fantastic reliability, and I love the VTEC engine. I'd much rather have a Honda with a few more of the bells and whistles as standard than have a VW, given its current reliability issues. +-----------------------------------------+ | Charles Lasitter | Mailing/Shipping | | 401/728-1987 | 14 Cooke St | | cl+at+ncdm+dot+com | Pawtucket RI 02860 | +-----------------------------------------+
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Because they don't need to provide a longer warranty?

Because there's a higher chance of them rusting... do you think?
[snip cost stuff because VAGs are unreliable and expensive>

Perhaps in the North American market their handling is consider more in tune to the market. The Passat is far more A4 than A6 though.
But in the UK they are snatchy understeery things with the finness of a hippo in a bathing costume. Indeed, VAG have managed to give the A4 and Passat a firm ride and lacklustre handling. Amazing.
Ford gave the Ka a supple ride and great handling.

Yes. That's a major down side as I'll go on to discuss.

Compared to the following:
Ford Mondeo Vauxhall Vectra Peugeot 406 Citroen Xantia / C5 Renault Laguna Toyota Avensis Honda Accord BMW 3-series Volvo S40
In fact, almost everything else in the same class.

Something you'd use every day?

Something you'd use every day?

There is no such thing as centrifugal force. It's centripetal. And, yes, very familiar heh.
http://www.dervman.com/kd53.htm
That's probably my biggest Ka Diary entry about unsprung mass.

You have to get the right wheels, though. The majority of aftermarket rims are materially heavier than their steel counterparts.
Whilst I agree with your sentiments, the braking difference is minimal when compared to picking the right quality of tyres. Nowhere do you mention good quality tyres let alone those useful in both wet and dry conditions, given the loading.

Well now hold on. If you are looking at the whole market you need to consider the whole market. If you're not looking at the whole market you may miss something.

Consumer reports. Hardly unbiased, though. Some people would feel pretty stupid claiming that their expensive car is not good in some respects, so they inflate the report. Other people like one part of a car so much that it shines through all other aspects.
There's no substitute for you trying it. What I find insulting handling may be fine for somebody else...
> "The GTI is comfortable, well finished,
Erk! European Golfs are sure as hell not well finished. They look pretty and solid and even the plastic is that wretched "we can't stop it rattling so we'll make it soft" stuff, but it's nowhere near as solid as I'd like. The mark one and mark two Golfs had it. The mark three, four and five don't. VW have cheapened the interior.

It can be. Not as spacious really. If you need room in the back then it'll be too small. If you don't need rear seat space it's too big.

Key here is "relatively" of course. On some surfaces it'll feel fine. On others, it feels typically German hot hatch, i.e. knobbly and rough.

It's also wrong wheel drive for that much power. Torque steer?

*cough* Uh-huh. Six seconds. There are *remarkably* few front wheel drive machines that can hit 62 in under 6.5 seconds. Those that get close to 6.0 seconds have over 240 bhp. It's more like 7.0 seconds.
Having trialled a whole bunch of powerful front wheel drive stuff, once the figures start getting below 8 seconds, you need a good, near perfect or perfect launch so as to get close to the quoted time. Front wheel drive machines wheelspin relatively easily. Once they spin, they keep spinning. Traction control systems without a launch control facility typically cannot cope with this much power and it's worse with a turbocharged engine. You either get rampant wheelspin and don't move off or you get the power reduced, lose boost pressure and the engine gets bogged down...
It's an unhappy compromise. It won't take six seconds either.

Yes. After the first few months you'll notice the off creak, squeak and rattle from the interior. You may return it to the dealer. They may be able to find it. Or they may not. Either way it's a trip to the dealer that you so don't need.
Then there's component longevity. Oh and breakdowns. Thing with something like a Golf is that many people love them despite their faults and how they have a nasty habit of breaking down. One single breakdown is enough to cause major aggravation.
Lets suppose the coil pack stops working, something that happened to a whole bunch of VAGs in Europe. The car is off the road because of a relatively cheap component. In some cases, for two months. Anyway, it stops working (typically late at night when it's raining, perhaps the coil packs were linked into the automatic wipers?). You call breakdown. You are recovered. Car goes to dealership. Courtesy vehicle arrives. You collect your car as and when it's done. Unless the courtesy car also breaks down on you too.
My folks' Passat was off the road for a weeks because of a broken brake pedal switch, which stuck on. Off the week for a week because of a cheap microswitch.
Cheap components break. That's the case on all machines, including Honda and Toyota, but has happened a lot more frequently to VAGs than they'd have you believe.
That's the reason to have the longer warranty. You need it.

Right. Got'ya.

You're taking one example. Don't get me wrong, having bags of torque at low engine speeds is handy, but it doesn't necessarily mean that the power band is broad. We need torque and revs. The VAG 2.0T engine has much more go at 4,000 rpm despite having less torque... indeed whilst it doesn't feel gutless at 1,800 rpm, compared to 4,000 rpm, it certainly does.
Actually we need power, but that's something else.

*cough*
*cough*
*cough hack splutter*

Here's where my knowledge of the North American market is far too limiting. European wise, I could certainly help...

The Golf GTI is a good enough car but it's not a good hot hatch. If you like it, it'll depend on your perspective. Personally, it's not for me. It's powerful and quick but it's too powerful for front wheel drive and the chassis finesse just isn't as good as it should. The Ford Focus shows us how...
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wrote:

Pfft, Masistro turbo, Went like crap, looked like it too 9so lessworries about it being pinched) 200hp in a FWD car when 140 was fashionable, and parts were cheap and easy to fix.
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Charles Lasitter wrote:

they ought to offer a 6/60k.

and how much does each model run? i seem to recall the 2dr GTI being damn close to $30k.
and thats for a 2dr hatchback, albeit a nice one.
VW isnt giving their cars away.

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Charles Lasitter wrote:

but then youre stuck with a VW. high maintenance costs, parts costs, electrical probs, oil burning probs. VWoA considers burning a quart of oil every 1000 miles normal.
plus a lot of the dealership techs are audi and porsche mechanics, and they get paid as such.
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