Re: Oil pressure relief plunger access -- 2004 Santa Fe 3.5L

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KWW wrote:

Yes, that may be what they meant -- the 10-year 100,000 mile warranty only on their Hyundai certified pre-owned vehicles.

True.
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What is the car worth if it was running OK? What is the cost of engine rebuild/replacement?
I was in a similar situation about 20+ years ago with an Old Cutlass. It was about $1000 for a rebuild at the time, but the car was worth $50 scrap with no engine, $3000 with a good engine. It was worth fixing and it lasted me another 50,000 miles.
You may want to check a couple of local shops and see what they would charge you to do the work.
Do a Google search. http://www.promarengine.com / http://www.jasperengines.com/products.php http://www.unitedengine.com /

I'm curious, how often (if ever) did you change the oil? I shoot for 5,000 miles but could easily go 7500 with my driving. That is by the book.
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Ed Pawlowski wrote:

Over the phone, the sales manager said that my year, make, and model running and in good condition would have a wholesale value of around $4,500 - $5,000. I think he meant that's what they would get if they wholesaled it.
He said if it is running, but in its present condition (meaning significant engine problems or whatever), and as long as it could "drive in the lane" it might wholesale for about $1,000 - $2,000. He said "drive in the lane" means they can drive it up onto the car carrier truck that takes it away and drive it into the lane where they sell them wholesale at auction.
He said if it is not drivable, the wholesale value is basically just the junk metal value -- my guess being maybe up to $500.
The vehicle is a 2004 Hyundai Santa Fe GLS Utility 3.5L Auto 4WD 6 Cyl 4 doors with 93,500 miles.
I don't know the retail value, but when I looked it up online Kelly Blue Book said the trade-in value in fair condition would be about $5,300 and in good condition would be about $6,100. The retail value if sold privately would be about $7,450 in fair condition, and $8,340 in good condition.
Consumer Reports said the average trade-in value would be about $7,500 and the average price to buy it from a dealer would be about $9,700.
The KBB and Consumer Reports values seem too high to me, but I don't know if they are high or not.

The service manager at the dealership said he could get a used 3.5L engine with 71,000 miles on it and the installed cost would be about $4,200. And, I think he said he could get a used 3.5L engine with about 118,000 miles on it and the installed cost would be more like $2,400(?).

I hadn't thought about the possibility of having this engine rebuilt, especially since I don't know what may be wrong with it. I don't know what may have been damaged so far, if anything, due to the oil crud issue.

That's a good idea, both for the rebuild idea or the idea of having a used engine put in by a local shop.

I'll definitely do the searches and see what I can find out.

Unfortunately, I almost never did an oil change. The service manager at the dealership said that some people just add oil when it gets a little low and don't do the oil changes. That's me, although not any more now that I know better. I had work done on the vehicle at 77,000 miles and they did an oil change then, but nothing since then. I bought the vehicle with about 24,000 miles on it and I don't remember ever doing an oil change on it before the one that was done at 77,000 miles. Sad, but true.
I have also been reading and hearing (for the first time) that synthetic oil doesn't break down like regular oil and doesn't create the kind of crud in the that I created through neglect. And, I didn't know until now that people can just switch any vehicle over to synthetic oil if they want. I thought that only certain engines take synthetic oil and other engines take regular oil.
Thanks for all of your suggestions and feedback.
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I see three choices.
Run it until it stops and junk it. You get pennies on the dollar
Take it to another car dealer while still running and see what you can get for a trade-in. Take anything they offer and then run away fast.
Rebuild the engine or buy a rebuilt. It has been years since I've done that so I'm not up on prices, but given the retail value, it would be a $mart move. For a few thousand dollars, you end up with a car that has a value of $7500 or more.
I've heard of people getting good deals from junk yards. My grandson recently bought an engine for a Mitsubishi for $500 with a 30 day guarantee. About four years ago, someone in work had a used engine installed for that much into an old Grand Prix.
I found this. 3.5 engines for less that 2k http://www.automotix.net/usedengines/2004-hyundai-santa_fe-inventory.html?fit_notes (dba1804ef5450bd9c69fe2c08473a2&seq_num=3
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Ed Pawlowski wrote:

http://www.automotix.net/usedengines/2004-hyundai-santa_fe-inventory.html?fit_notes (dba1804ef5450bd9c69fe2c08473a2&seq_num=3 I numbered the choices that you mentioned.
I definitely don't want to do option 1. But, even if the engine did die, I could always still do Options 3 or 4 -- meaning have another engine put in.
Option 2 may be a possibility, but it depends on what I find out regarding Options 3 and 4.
Options 3 and 4 are both good possibilities, depending on what I find in terms of the price of engines (rebuilt or just used) and the labor costs involved. If some of the numbers that I am seeing are correct, it may end up making sense to do one of these two options.
Another option that I plan on trying first is for me to try taking off the valve covers and cleaning out all of the crud that I can to the best of my ability and see what happens. And, maybe do some cleanout of the lower oil pan etc.
I found two YouTube videos that describe what I have in mind, except that I don't think that I will be making any attempt to remove the camshaft etc. That would involve the timing belt and is something that I think would be too complicated for me and could easily cause me to destroy the engine by messing up the timing.
If I do the cleanout process, I know it may not fix the problem, but it looks like something that I can do on my own time without too much trouble. It just looks like it would be time consuming and messy, but not too hard to do. And, I guess the worst that would happen is that it doesn't work and I am in the same position that I am in now.
Here are the two YouTube videos that I found:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KC-SxrsgEwo&feature=related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oIkxlWpJ6bk
.
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You mentioned that "people can just switch any vehicle over to synthetic oil if they want". Well, actually people can drive off a cliff if they want to also. ;) Actually if you have run conventional oil and switch to a synthetic you need to plan to change the oil VERY FREQUENTLY the first time or two. Some other folks may provide experiential testimonials as to whether or not you can get away with just changing the OIL FILTER frequently instead. The issue is that synthetic oil will break loose the gunk and stuff that has collected over the years and so at first, while this is happening, you run the risk of getting clogs. I would worry that if you have some crucial passages which are partially blocked too much loose debris might close off a passage. (The cure being worse than the sickness.) That said, way back when we had a used Ford we'd purchased and it was having issues for a few years. Finally an old mechanic friend checked some things out and discovered that it had lots of crud built up in the engine. He put transmission fluid into the engine instead of motor oil, started it up for a minute or two and then stopped and drained it. It was probably like putting 0W-30 in it. I was a bit freaked but he said that it would not hurt for a short run like that (granted it was a cast iron block). Given the condition of the engine it was sort of a no lose situation.
On 6/1/2012 9:47 AM, TomR wrote:

--- Posted via
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KWW wrote:

I think that when I try the cleanout process that I described in another post, even if it seems to work, there could still be the possibility of something later breaking loose and plugging up a port and wrecking the engine.
I did read about the transmission fluid idea, but I think my situation is too far gone to hope for just a flush-out being able to resolve the problem. Nevertheless, I am doing a brief Motor Flush process now while the car is sitting next to my house before I start the under-the-valve-cover cleanout project. I added Motor Flush and I have been running in for 2 or 3 minutes a couple of times a day to see if that will circulate the Motor Flush and help pre-soften the crud that I will be attacking in the next phase of my cleanout effort. I probably shouldn't do this, but I added 2 cans of Motor Flush instead of the 1 can that is recommended. I am only running it at idle speed for 2 or 3 minutes at a time so it won't get too hot and I hopefully won't be pushing the limits on the bearing lubrication etc.
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In case anyone is curious, here are a few photos of the crud in the engine.
The first one is actually a photo of the photo that the dealership took when they had the valve cover off. I haven't taken the valve cover off myself yet.
The next two photos are from below when I had the upper and lower oil pans off, and with the oil pressure relief valve plug removed.
http://i50.tinypic.com/3021cgy.jpg
http://i48.tinypic.com/25519wx.jpg
http://i47.tinypic.com/24vlcli.jpg
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On 6/2/2012 7:55 PM, TomR wrote:

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Looks nasty. I have to wonder though, how much the engine is worn so far. If you were to have the engine disassembled, cleaned (soaked in solvent?), reassembled, what kind of condition it would be in.
That kind of work is beyond my capability, but perhaps some more experienced mechanic would know if it is feasible at all.
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Partner wrote:

Oil changes? What's an oil change? :-)
The truth is that I didn't really do them. I bought the vehicle with about 24,500 miles on it and it now has about 93,500 miles. I am guessing that it had about 2 or maybe 3 oil changes in between -- all when it was being worked on for some other reason. So, 2 or maybe 3 oil changes in almost 70,000 miles. All I really did is add oil if it got a little low. Not a smart thing to do, and now I know why.
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