Synthetic Oil

I have a 2003 Accent that I would like to keep as long as possible. I have had all the scheduled maintainence done on time. It has 45000 miles on it. I have been changing the oil every 3000 miles with
conventional oil. I was wondering what the group's members thought of using synthetic oil? Will it offer me an advantage over conventional oil as far as longevity of the engine??? Thanks
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On Sun, 20 Apr 2008 10:49:04 -0700 (PDT), Steve and Janet

Keep doing what you are doing with the conventional oil and drive the car like you want to keep it as long as possible.
Using synthetic will make no significant difference to the longevity of the Accent, especially one that is driven carefully. You'd just be throwing your money away.
Regards, Wayne Moses, 2008 Hyundai Santa Fe Limited
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Wayne Moses wrote:

If longevity is your only metric, I agree with you. However, synthetic offers several other advantages over dino oil that change the "throwing your money away" equation.
Matt
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Synthetic oils are superior to dino oils, but aside from very severe conditions, they are not needed and won't make the engine last appreciably longer. Changing every 3000 mile is more than needed also unless you have severe conditions. The 3000 mile change was normal years ago and is still propagated by places that sell oil, but most manufacturers recommend 7500 miles under normal conditions. Your money so do as you see fit.
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Edwin Pawlowski wrote:

What's interesting is that todays oils are very very good, and thus oil changes that are necessary at intervals below 5000 miles are more related to filtration quality than oil. Even synthetics are susceptible to dirt!
I personally run dual filtration on my car, change filters every 5000, and 10000 plus on my oils. I use synthetics.
I am a mechanical engineer, and have been a industrial hydraulic specialist for 10 years.
Clay
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You are also probably using a better filter than the typical $3 Fram off the Wal-Mart shelf too. Will the typical consumer be willing to pay for a premium filter (such as used on hydraulic systems) no matter how much they are saving in the long run?
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Edwin Pawlowski wrote:

Filters on hydraulic systems are made exactly the same way as Auto filters, and in the same factories, on the same assembly lines. There can be differences in filter media and micron rating, but you can, and most companies do, buy the cheapest hydraulic filters.
Keep in mind, a filter does it's worst job of filtration when it's new! It filters better as it get dirty. Where the problem comes in is when the pressure relief in the filtration system starts to crack open and bypasses dirty oil into the engine/hydraulics. The bypass opens more than most people realize.In a car at speed, it's open a little most of the time. I run a bypass filter, so my oil is always filtered.
My point was and is, that you can NOT run synthetics longer without keeping it clean. And, that dino oil works just as well, but does break down faster than synthetics. It still lasts much longer than oil sellers recommend!
Clay
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I've said that a few times and gotten roundly flamed for it. Good to finally hear someone else say it!
A good way to improve filter longevity is to find the largest filter your car will accept. Knowing all the filter specs, including the thread diameter and pitch and gasket diameter, one can often find an exact match in a larger filter. For example, certain F150 Ford filters fit Toyota Tacoma's, and are significantly larger. That of course means the filter will last longer before bypassing. I guess the cartridge filters on the Lambda engines are already maxxed out, unfortunately. -
Bob
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Bob Adkins wrote:

Well you speak the truth about filters filtering better as they get dirty. This is true of air filters as well. Keeping in mind FLOW is reduced as the filter gets dirty.
On the filter interchange, as long as the micron rating is the same or better, AND there is no internal bypass, the bigger the filter the more dirt holding capacity, the longer you can use it. This is because the flow rate stays high for longer. I don't use auto filters on my car, because industrial filters are bigger, and I can specify the micron rating.
Clay
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I have been told that there are other factors to consider than just mileage between changes.
For example a vehcile that is used primarily for city driving with many short trips is considered by some to require more frequent oil changes.
Also the time spam between changes. I have a truck that I drive kess than 3000 miles in six months and that is all city driving.
Old_Timer
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I had a Toyota before it was destroyed by a fast driving, cell ph. talking woman. It had 180,000 at the time and never had any trouble with it. I had changed the oil every 3000 miles and used Fram filters from Wally World. I think the key is not running the filters too long, any filter. I now have a new Elantra, love it.
On 4/20/08 10:51 PM, in article snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com, "Old_Timer" <Old_Timer> wrote:

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On Sun, 20 Apr 2008 13:44:36 -0500, Wayne Moses

Seconded.
Synthetic has its uses, but longevity and economy aren't among them. -
Bob
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Steve and Janet wrote:

I can't say it will offer greater longevity, but it certainly will cut down on the number of oil changes you do. I conservatively use 5K mile changes with my vehicles that are still in warranty and 10K for those out of warranty. I took a Chrysler minivan to nearly 180K miles with 10K change intervals prior to it being totaled by a drunk. It was running fine at that mileage using Mobil 1 with a 10K oil and filter changes interval.
Synthetic will also help with cold starting and gives you more margin in hot weather as well. However, if you keep up the 3K changes with dino oil, it is unlikely you will see any significant longevity gain with synthetic.
Matt
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I always have to laugh at the ignorance of most people when it comes to Synthetics verses dino.Do you guys have a clue about all the different things oil has to do???? Before you make ignrant statements like it won't have any effect on longevity READ SAE reports, READ FORD motors reports from 1976 on Mobil 1 READ about the difference in shear rating and ability to hold viscosity and the difference in detergence. Clay seems to be one of the few who isn't talking out of his ass or just giving opinion. I have used synthetics since 76 Mobil 1 Redline synthetic gear oils and tranny oil.I use Shell Rotella Diesel synthetic now (cheaper than Mobil 1 But I do use the synthetic filter from Mobil1. My gas milage on my vehicles has alway increased with the change to synthetis and I always get better than EPA estimates. I have my oils tested on each vehicle when new to provide info for warrantee protection.I use synthetic in all my bikes (22) my Accent and my Nissan Harbody. All have Redline synthetic inn the tranny AND rear ends. I'm sure my post will offend some of you but I'm sick of hearing ridiculous statements with no basis in fact.Don't take my word for it READ THE FACTS. Besides what do I know,I retired at 45
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It would pay for you to read some of the many threads that have appeared in this forum on this topic. You'll find both a fair amount of genuine opinion, and a great deal of referenceable fact. Yes - there is a great deal of "clue" here when it comes to this topic.

And you should read some of the more updated tests on the comparisons between dino and synthetic oils. No one here contests the differences between the two, but realizing any significant difference between the use of the two has been largely dispelled over the years.

How much has your gas mileage increased? Did you begin adding synthetics immediately after purchasing a new vehicle? More factors than just oil affect gas mileage in new vehicles. All new vehicles will increase in gas mileage over the first 10,000 miles. Those who use dino oils also find themselves very capable of getting mileage above the EPA ratings.

I'm glad you retired at 45, but that has nothing to do with the topic. Your post isn't offensive, but it is rather subjective and that's a bit inconsistent with your opening statements.
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snipped-for-privacy@webtv.net wrote:

Which reports, where are they and what is the report or reference number? What is detergence? Is that anything like detergents?
And shear resistance, viscosity stability and detergent capability doesn't necessarily affect longevity of the engine. Only if you run for very extended oil changes such that dino oil has pooped out will this make a difference. And with modern dino oils, that is a long time and many miles.
I'm a big fan of synthetics and they have many advantages, and I believe an engine will last longer using them, but I have to agree with the dino folks that given frequent changes (5-7.5K) modern dino oil will take you to probably 200K miles. If you plan to drive your car for 500K miles or run 10,000+ change intervals, then synthetic might begin to some some good advantage.

And you aren't one of the few.

Good idea. I've used synthetics since about that time frame also, but I'm aware of what they add and don't add. They add greatly to cold start capability (especially at temps below -20 or so). They are better in extreme heat, but that isn't a problem where I live.

Changes in fuel mileage are not enough to measure in normal driving and conditions. You'd need very controlled conditions and very good instrumentation to even notice a 2-4% advantage. This is the placebo affect at its best.

You have provided no facts nor any references to facts.

Given your demonstrated literacy, all I can say is isn't inheritance a wonderful thing.
Matt
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Matt Whiting wrote:

You guys are funny. I'm glad I don't get emotional about this stuff. :)
Clay
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Crabman wrote:

Not as funny as you with your reference to facts that you won't or can't provide. THAT is funny!
Matt
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