Condensation removal....

It does apply to automotive A/C.

In fact, A/C systems start cycling the compressor at no less than 38 degrees F. SO... when the air coming into the evaporator reaches this low temperature, the compressor is cycled or shut OFF if the air temperature entering the evaporator continues to drop. Otherwise the evaporator would become a block of ice, which would prevent any air from reaching the heater core (in nearly all cases).

Where did *you* read that it's a Federal Regulation about cutting A/C at 40 degrees? And don't give me that "go look it up BS."

About a year ago, I did have to replace one of our toilets. Bought a new Kohler. They play all sorts of timing, level, and displacement tricks to limit the flush volume to 1.6 gallons. But after you "change things" and since the tank size permits more water storage, the flush can easily be increased to just under 3 gallons. Want a used 5 gallon flusher? LOL

And you are COMPLETELY in error about buying a top loader washing machine. They dominate by wide margin. Front loaders are the in the small minority of units sold.

Has nothing to do with the refrigerant. Has solely to do with the temperature water freezes at ... 32 degrees. Since in most cases, all air flows thru the evaporator and then to or past the heater core, were the water on the evaporator be allowed to freeze solid, no air would flow out of any of the plenum chamber outlets.

Just Newspaper on it's own does a fair job, without smears if the windows are only a little grubby on the inside too. And you can dry a slightly damp window with Newspaper and clean it at the same time.

One tip, alcohol based de-icers for the outside of glass can actually cause misting on the inside because they change temperature so quickly the condensation forms from moisture in the car. You'll get less condensation if the glass is scraped without de-icer (unless it is so hard you can't shift it).

they still sell top loaders

Hah hah. I can't see anything but destruction in my future from doing that... either the system overheats cuz there aren't enough holes, or there are too many holes to keep it warm. I could blow a few units trying to get it right! I can live with it.

Now THIS makes perfect sense. (I'd have to look up the temp at which refrigerants go liquid to confirm or deny Steve G's belief.) I'm almost certain that the A/C on my old 85 Pontiac would cycle at any temp, though. I'll check up with the Honda soon.

Anyway, I doubt it would be that difficult (in the original design) to construct an airflow system that would shunt warmer air around the evap unit when the temp dropped in winter, in order to preserve the dehumidifying characteristics of an A/C-based system.

You would also have to direct warm air to the entire low pressure side of the ac system to prevent the condensing of refrigerant gas back into liquid. I live in a climate of 10 months of winter and 2 months poor sledding, have been a licensed mechanic since about '72 and have never seen an ac comp cycle in ambient temps colder than somewhere around that 40 degree mark. and remember from my days in tech school that is the reason. Don't forget when researching boiling point of refrigerant to factor in the pressure. Adding pressure also raises the boiling point. As I'm typing this I'm also recalling that there are cautions that when servicing/charging the system to not allow low side pressure to drop too low for fear of damaging the compressor. Go to K-mart and look at the labeling/cans of 134a they market to the consumers and read the instructions. When charging you override the low side cutout so you can keep the compressor running. In this situation, temp above ambient cut-out and low pressure limit overidden, a drop in low side pressure can take it below it's boiling point and risk liquid refrigerant in the compressor. The warning on the charging kit doesn't get into the explanation, but does give the caution about low side pressure drops and damage to the compressor. Steve

You have to know that MikeHunt is retired 'gentry' ... who knows little beyond what his house servants relay to him on this subject.

Thank you ('perfect sense'). Note that I said "air coming into the evaporator." If air door is set to FRESH and the inducted air from outside is below 38-40°F, all one need do (considering all the heat radiating off the passenger(s), is select RECIRCULATE so that the air inducted to the evaporator stays above 38-40°F. This will keep the A/C running. Remember ... once the evaporator effectively become a solid block of ice, there will be NO dehumidification.

Stop. Evaporator icing prevention has been prevented electrically by cycling the compressor since I can recall (late '50's). Evaporator icing prevention has also been prevented mechanically by the use of expansion valves ... LONG before GM's cheap, clog prone capillary tubes ... by regulating refrigerant based on expansion valve temperature.

Late model. LOL

snip

This is false. Evaporator core surface temperature is the primary concern because the freezing of water condensation on the evaporator/s exterior surfaces will block air flow. There is never solid liquid refrigerant condensed in the compressor inlet line, regardless of ambient temperature. Well... there *could* be if the system were grossly overcharged.

Question for you: Water condensation *on* the evaporator surface freezes at

32°F. At what temperature does low pressure refrigerant gas condense to a solid liquid? Keep in mind that it is common to see frost all over much of the exiting line from the evaporator leading to the compressor inlet while the A/C system is functioning normally. Clue: it's lower than 32°F.

Not entirely accurate. The compressor's inlet side can drop into a slight vacuum when a suction throttling valve is used on the outlet side of the evaporator instead of an expansion valve to regulate refrigerant flow into the evaporator. In any case, the low side pressure safety switch (if/when there is one installed) will prevent such a condition from occurring on systems equipped with only an expansion valve. Excessive high side pressure is FAR more damaging to compressors which is why a high pressure safety switch is present on all but the oldest automotive systems.

Why do you always seem to find it necessary to stoop to personal assaults? Have I ever personally attacked you or anyone in a NG? I would suggest you do some research before you choose to comment on a subject of which you obviously are not fully informed, or at least say in my opinion

One can still buy Freon, as well, but it can not be manufactured. ;)

mike hunt

Philip wrote:

Mike ... you have always hinted around at your wealth on this and several other forums. Don't even try ... to go humble on me. LOL If you interpreted my comment as a negative, send me a check sufficient to remove that discomfort for being "gentry". ;-)

There are plenty of appliance outlets including Sears that sell NEW top loaders today. And so long as the price of a front loader is relatively high, politics (poor people disproportionately affected) will delay your notion ... or there will be a government subsidy. LOL

Why does a glass of Ice water condensate in the Summer? Same reason your windows fog up. Turning on the A/C in conjunction with the heater will help dissipate the fog. The A/C puts out a dryer air than just the heater alone. The heater will eventually dry up the fog, but it takes a while since it depends on the coolant in your engine for heat. It's also a good thing to run the A/C in the winter to stir up the coolant.

Don't have A/C? Then you're SOL, just kidding. Buy Rain-X Anti-Fog or that pink wax stick you see at the home shows, and wipe it on your inside windows. I rub the pink stuff on a terry shop towel and keep it under the seat of all my cars for that purpose. Don't wipe your windows while driving, pull over to a safe place and stop before wiping your windows.

Good Luck and Safe Driving! JW

Can I have a check, too? I could use a new front loader. :)

Aaron