Had some problems with my Trooper with the smoke etc, after much work on the
garages part & a lot of smoke we found the heads knackered (even after a
Isuzu tech told us it was fine) which isn't a big deal as I'm not paying!
But, the garage concerned have given me a Disco TDi auto (Jap import - mint
& no rust) for the week while the new head is fitted. I find the on-road
manners a little more soft & less predictable. The trade off for slightly
softer suspension I suppose. The one thing that hit me right between the
eyes is the build quality of the interior & some of the exterior is
shockingly bad in places. My Trooper is 12 years old & looks like a new
motor in most ways, the interior is solid with no rattles or dropping off
trim items, this is a 'P' reg with similar miles but is in a lot worse
condition. I don't mean it's been abused, far from it, but the things
literally dropping apart!
The drivetrain feels a lot more modern than the trooper, but I only use the
Trooper in 2wd anyway on road & 4wd is off road only really on the Trooper.
I do like how it drives though & I'll see how she performs off road in the
woods later on!
Have I got one that's been a bit abused (it's cleaner than a whistle & not
damaged if you know what I mean) or are they all like this?
Another thing, the Trooper feels HUGE at the side of this!
Still, here's to the Trooper returning with a new head soon!
Right, whatever. I trust you saw my post as an attack on your beloved LR?
Well, it wasn't & really your posts show your unrelenting faith in something
that is flawed in more ways than one.
Still, the next time your LR breaks down you can rest assured I would be
there to pull you out of the shit!
BTW, I wonder how many LR have heads that go astray after 12 years, or even
2 years? QAs for rust, get a grip matey, LR can rot like mild steel in the
rain at the drop of a hat as can any machine made from the same substance
without the correct protection. I used to work on Austin Rover in the early
80's & can tell you the switchgear inside this 6 year old LR is right out of
a Montego & it was crap then!
Your point makes no mention of the fact at any point in time you could,
whatever vehicle you are driving experience a serious mechanical failure,
shit build quality is endemic I'm afraid.
Probably as I cross-posted it!!!! ;~)
It was meant to appeal to both sets of owners anyway, but he seems to have
taken it as a full frontal assault on LR. Not the case at all as my next
purchase will be a brand new rangie in a year or so!
The 3.1 is indeed a great engine & my own view as to the few head
replacements I have heard about on import vehicles is the 'sea' factor in
Japan, you are never more than a few miles form the sea so you can't really
get it up to a good temperature & the traffic is red hot busy & as is the
climate (in most of Japan) Never heard of a UK trooper having the head
replaced at 40k!
I would 't swap my Trooper for a LR of the same age for a start! But I can
confirm, they are both VERY different vehicles as the LR is much better off
road & is slightly more refined on road.
Because he was replying to some fuckwit of a Trooper owner who cross
posted to alt.FAN.landrover....
I'm not sure why the original poster (Nige) posted to a.f.l. explaining
to all the Land Rover fans that he prefers his Isuzu that is currently
out of commission to the loan Land Rover, I guess he's either a troll or
he just doesn't know any better.
Whatever lights his candle I guess !
Oh, FWIW the BMW engines are shite too but we still love our Land Rovers
anyway :-) The Isuzu engines are a good compromise because they are
cheap and in plentiful supply second hand... <nomex>not sure why, maybe
the engine is the only bit left when the rest of the vehicle has fallen
apart ?</nomex> The problem with LR's is they keep outlasting their
engines. Shame they can't get an engine to stay reliable over the 200,
000 miles mark :-(
Well, keep them going strong... then when the rest of the cars written off
us Hybrid builders will pick them up and stick them in a proper car :-)
Just a little hobby site about Landies :-)
We sure will. But, let me give you a piece of advice: if you do ever
take your car off road, make sure to buy a winch, because God knows,
I'm sick and tired of pulling Jeeps and LRs out of shit.
By the way, how is your field car doing? Stuck in a pile of cow crap?
Loving the last of a true ORV--the Isuzu Trooper.
As it goes mandible I use a hand winch to save weight, the two times I got
stuck; one was a winch out with the hand winch, the second sure enough was
helped by troopers ............ very nice blokes but bit scary with the
AK74's. They had clapped out Series II's but kept them going with any old
bits to hand, funny enough they never mentioned having to replace a head
though . bodies yes ... heads no.
LR's are very nice cars but the reliability is much worse than any
LR's are better looking. I would like one with Trooper engine, drive
Anyone knows that any Isuzu, Nissan or Toyota will outperform a Land
Land Rover is a passion for most owners and I can understand the
They go for the feeling and the love for the vehicle much more then the
usefullness, quality or reliability. Let them do so. They will never
exchance their car for anything Japanese. I would trade my car for a
Nissan or Toyota very easy because of the quality and not for the looks.
With my 'Japanese crap' I drive from Amsterdam to Rome and back not even
taking a tool kit with me........
On or around Thu, 20 May 2004 03:25:33 +0200, Erik-Jan Geniets
hmmm... Isuzu engines, I grant you, seem pretty bomb-proof.
that's such a sweeping an general statement as to be meaningless. what are
your criteria? on-road? off-road? speed? economy? towing? ease of
maintenance? cost of parts?
in some areas, some of the above will outperform some Land Rover models. in
other areas, they're not so good.
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.fsnet.co.uk my opinions are just that
"You praise the firm restraint with which they write -_
Bong! Wrong answer. I grant you economy. But Defenders and Discoverys are
regarded as superlative towing vehicles. That's why you see so many of
Ease of maintenance is more of a point of discussion. I've not had any
direct experience of japanese cars in this situation but I think you'll find
the modularity of the various LR models (not necessarily the more recent
models like P38a) means they're pretty much like big Meccano sets.
And you lose also on cost of parts. We've seen several times in this NG
that LR parts are in most cases far cheaper, and also easier to get hold of,
than other 4x4s'. This probably isn't the case in some parts of the world,
like Africa, where Toyota in particular really got their act together, but
it is in most parts of Europe, where most of them are used.
Now, reliability... I think many people here would admit that compared to
something like Toyotas, LRs are not necessarily as reliable as they could
be. But I can drive around on any given day and see dozens of Land Rovers
dating from the 70s, 60s and 50s. On the other hand, I don't see huge
numbers of any other vehicle from that era knocking around. This has to say
something at least for their general longevity.
Finally to performance. Off-road, which is where LR aim to perform very
well, LRs score very highly among the regular 4x4 brigade (to distinguish
from Unimogs, tractors etc). All of us have seen stuff on TV, off-road even
ts etc where LRs have, time and time again, pulled other 4x4s out of the
brown stuff. Now, you may occasionally have seen a Land Cruiser pull a
Discovery or something out of a big hole, but the statistics are loaded in
favour of the Land Rover I'm afraid. They're not totally unbeatable, but
they have a pretty good winning formula.
On-road, the more modern LRs are actually not bad, but if you want a good
on-road 4x4 you're really looking at something like an X5, although of
course the Range Rover actually scores very highly in both areas, if you can
afford one. I do high motorway miles in my Disco II and the on-road
handling is good, the only complaint I'd have is that it's a bit noisier
than something like my Volvo V70 was.
I'd leave you with the thought that, as per a different thread, the UK and
US military use Land Rovers widely when we go round invading other less
fortunate countries for nonsensical political reasons. The US have a good
choice here - they could easily use Toyotas if they wanted. But they don't.
Do you think the US Army would use Land Rovers if they thought they were
unreliable, difficult to maintain and not very good off-road? Of course
Sorry Erik-Jan, I give you 1.5/6, or 25%.
Bro-in-Law visited a year or two back in his Trooper Citation. Alternator
failed during visit. Nearest one located in Birmingham (we were in West
Wales). Seven days to get it shipped here and - wait for it - 700GBP.
Fitted, obviously ;-)
Here in the Netherlands, a town (17.000 inhabitants) where I live I can
get one within two miles from my home.
After market indeed. But why go to the dealer for just an alternator.
Costs...125 Euro's (around 110 USD, don't know in GBP)
Fair enough. There were Isuzu dealers much nearer than Birmingham when my
B-in-L needed his, but none had any in stock, and the one that did took a
week to ship it. I don't know what this tells us, but it aint very good.
Erm... my point was that this was an Isuzu part, following the thread that
said Jap parts were expensive. QED, I think. We all know that aftermarket
parts are cheaper, but that's true of any car. He wanted an Isuzu part for
an Isuzu vehicle - not an unreasonable request.
Car manufactures do not make alternators, starters, exhaust systems,
brake parts, spark plugs, light bulbs, shock aborbers, wipers, tow
or whatever. So after market is as good as original.
The Meeting Place for Photography
On or around Sun, 23 May 2004 23:46:13 +0200, Erik-Jan Geniets
that depends. some aftermarket "recon" units are no such thing, or are
worked on to a lower standard.
aftermarket new stuff may or may not be as good as OEM depending on who made
it. most aftermarket electrical bits like alternators is reconditioned,
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.fsnet.co.uk my opinions are just that
Appearances: You don't really need make-up. Celebrate your authentic
Motorsforum.com is a website by car enthusiasts for car enthusiasts. It is not affiliated with any of the car or spare part manufacturers or car dealers discussed here.
All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.