Off Topic Request

dunno. Google isn't helping me find an answer either.

For a 2003 I'd invest in a decent scantool. They aren't that expensive and they can give you a lot more information than simple blinkylights.

I believe PepBoys and AutoZone scan codes for free.

"DougW" wrote .

I believe PepBoys and AutoZone scan codes for free.

She took ot to the dealership. $88 to read the codes, they want an additional $300 for oxygen sensors, and $765 for a catalytic converter.

On another note, why does your mower need new rings already? You haven't been letting the red headed kar killer near it have you?

First thought is RUN AWAY! The real question is why she is having problems with both sensors and the cat. Highly unlikely. It's more likely spark/mix or the first sensor (primary) that sets the mix. The downstream only detects if the cat is working properly.

If the downstream is yelling then it could be the cat or it could be just the upstream is making the mix too rich and the cat is not able to handle it. Thus tipping the downstream.

For 88$ you could have bought a decent low-end scantool and still had change left for dinner or put another $10 on it and got a good mid-range one that can make settings changes.

A decent local mechanic can put a new cat in for about $150 and the O2 sensors run (YIKES!) that's more pricy than mine. Upstream is

139 and downstream is 139 for OEM. Odd lookign sensor too, I'd go to a reputable local mechanic.

I'm not sure how hard it is to put those in but in the ZJ it's just bolted into the exhaust pipe and takes a few minutes of time.

At any rate, first make sure that the emissions system isn't still covered by warranty. In some states it's 80,000 miles for the CAT.

Silly boy... should have taken it to Vato Zone for a free diagnosis.

On the mower, the car killer is in Oregon now. No chance she could have done it. Looks like dirt got in the rings, I dunno. Poor design on the air intake and filtering system to be sure. OBM it the person in charge of mowing. Nawt my yob man!

She took ot to the dealership. $88 to read the codes, they want an additional $300 for oxygen sensors, and $765 for a catalytic converter.

On another note, why does your mower need new rings already? You haven't been letting the red headed kar killer near it have you?

"DougW" wrote

At any rate, first make sure that the emissions system isn't still covered by warranty. In some states it's 80,000 miles for the CAT.

Now, my first thought is that the first O2 sensor is bad, since both are (usually, not sure on this car) the same basic sensor, I'd pop for one sensor (the one with the longer wire, so it will fit both places) and replace it first. Then clear codes (with the scan tool you'll also buy) and watch codes and see what pops up next.

It is definately possible that both sensors are bad (contamiation for example) but that's down the road.

This is all I know, she sent me a message on Facebook.

"I took my Vibe up to the dealer yesterday...the code was P0420 (Catalytic Converter Low Efficiency). And that cost was $88.00! They want another $765.00 + Tax to put the converter on. I have been calling around getting prices. And there are 2 oxygen sensors also...they are very expensive $304.00 (Firestones price). So far I have Midas battling for my business and my buddies that own Mt Healthy Auto going to call me with a price. I used to go there all the time when I lived closer. My folks went there. What is nice now they have free loaners! That's surprised me. So I'm waiting to hear from them. One more thing about firestone is I have a credit card with them and now they changed it to six months free of interest to pay it off, use to be last year 3 months. I like that and can handle that easier. It's only money!!!! And I getting less of it! Tires last fall, Callies 2 operations, a new pool liner"

There is absolutely no reason to replace O2 sensors just because it has the P0420 code. On the other hand, if they found an O2 causing the problem, they have no business replacing the cat converter. Sounds like they're just trying to shotgun it to cover all the bases.

It would be very rare, and I have never seen an O2 sensor cause this fault, but a new downstream sensor in addition to an aging(slowing) upstream sensor *could* cause it. Generally the engine controller would give you a fault for a slow responding upstream sensor long before this happened.

I have seen exhaust leaks cause this, and once found a downstream O2 sensor signal wire that was chafing against the lip of the trans pan that would mimic a downstream sensor switching faster than it should.

Somebody needs to diagnose it rather than pulling codes & throwing parts at it.