Diesel Engines

Dear All

I'm looking for my first (diesel) landrover (defender) and am trying to get a handle on what the different names mean.

What are the differences between a 200TDi, 300TDi and TD5? From another question I asked I believe the TD5 is the latest and is more complicated (possibly with an ECU).

Any thoughts on what is the better engine? or indeed what are the +ves & -ves for them.

This one's probably been done to death - if so my apologies. Perhaps there's a page somewhere that explains it all? If so perhaps someone can point me in the right direction.

Many thanks in advance

Paul

Reply to
paul.rogers6
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'200TDi' and '300TDi' are both turbo diesel 2.5 litre units.

The TD5 is a five cylinder engine of about the same capacity with a complex computer system controlling it.

The 300 seems to be considered the best and most reliable, with some units managing a quarter of a million miles.

Reply to
William Black

William

Many thanks for the prompt reply.

Is the 300 just a later model engine?

In your opinion is the 200 much worse than the 300 or still worth considering?

Many thanks again.

Paul

Reply to
paul.rogers6

I consider the 200 the best but I am slightly biased as mine has done almost

300k miles. But in reality the 200 and 300s are pretty much the same. If it's looked after with proper servicing etc. then any of the engines will perform well for a long time. I like the TD5 and most on here will probably give them excellent reports. Regular oil and filter changes are the most important thing.
Reply to
Oily

In about 1991 the 200tdi engine was fitted to the 90 & 110 landrovers and they introduced the name "Defender".

The 300tdi engine came in about 1994, to meet more stringent emission regulations I think. The new R380 gearbox and disc brakes all round arrived about the same time.

The TD5 engine arrived in about 1999 - in most cases I think the engines were introduced in the Discovery before the Defender.

I had a 300tdi D90 Pick-up and loved it - me & the village blacksmith could always fix it - I never wanted a TD5. But now I have one (another D90 PU), and it's won me over (but it hasn't gone wrong yet!). Mine has the reprogrammed ECU, which happened in about

2002, I think. (The early TD5s were prone to stalling, but may be they could be re-programmed too.)

I used to get 31mpg from the 300tdi but I only get 29mpg from the TD5. Performance wise, there's not a massive difference, but the TD5 engine seems slightly more refined.

That's the end of my 2p

Joskin

Reply to
Joskin

Yes.

People say the main difference is that the 300 is longer lived, but I have no proof of it.

Anything with a 200 engine in it will now be about 15 years old...

Reply to
William Black

Yes, the 300 superseded the 200.

The front cover area on the 300 was revamped making it potentially easier to deal with the bits behind the water pump than on the 200 - anyone care to comment further?

The 200 has multiple V belts for the external accessories, the 300 a serpentine toothed belt.

The worst feature to my mind about the 2.5l engines (other than the TD5) is that they have a rubber timing belt that requires periodic attention. That's something that we'd be better without.

Reply to
Dougal

attention.

Is there a realistic alternative alternative that has similar costs?

A proper cam shaft with cogs on the end of it driving the various services run by the belt would be nice, but it wouldn't be cheap.

Reply to
William Black

Rubber timing belts are the problem, they break. How much of a problem depends on how much clearance there is between an open valve and top of piston... The TD5 timing drive is a chain, though the auxiliary pumps and things are a flat serpentine belt but that breaking doesn't run the risk of writing off the engine.

Reply to
Dave Liquorice

The "zeus" timing gears I believe, how much they cost I don't know. The pinzgauer has gears as standard, shame the engine's so weedy ;-)

Reply to
Ian Rawlings

Dear All

Again many thanks for taking the time to reply.

This will help me no end.

Regards

Paul

Reply to
paul.rogers6

The 300Tdi is basically the same unit as the 200, (2.5litres, 4 cylinder) but there are subtle differences. The 300 is slightly more powerfull than the 200, as it runs the turbo at a slightly higher boost. To cope with this the crankshaft bearings are bigger, the

200tdi crankshaft being the same one as fitted to the original 2.5 non-turbo, it was reckoned that the crank bearings were at the limit on the 200. The 300tdi also has a different timing case and front layout, the waterpump is seperate from the block, there are differences in the layout of the ancilleries and the drivebelt is a mulit-ribbed serpentine belt rather than the earlier multiple v-belts. The final difference is that the 300tdi was commonly fitted with an EGR system to improve emissions, and a simple electronic unit is present to control this. A slight increase in power is available to the 300Tdi by removing the EGR valve and blanking off the inlet/exhaust where it was fitted.

The engines are largely the same in terms of reliability and strength, people tend to prefer the 300tdi as it is a little more powerfull and refined, and one or two of the niggles with the 200 had been ironed out. Both are long lived units if looked after with regular oil/filter changes and cam belt changes at the recommended intervals.

Also the gearbox is different, 200Tdi's are fitted with LT77 5-speed and the 300Tdi has the R380 5-speed. Both are good boxes, although 5th gear wear on LT77 is a problem, and both suffer from weak clutch forks which break on the pivot point and result in no clutch disengagement.

Alex

Reply to
Alex

They're nice but very, very expensive - circa 800UKP IIRC.

It was a while ago (and time blurs painful memories), but I looked, almost fainted and closed the browser.

Reply to
SpamTrapSeeSig

Zeus demonstrated an engine running with their gear set at Langley farm in Scisset a few years ago with a clear perspex timing cover and I was very impressed and thought to myself 'must have', but then later I was reading reports from Australia ( on this n.g. I think) about them only lasting on average 45k miles which made me stick to the belts. I think it was an issue with tooth hardness which they may have sorted now BICBW. It would be interesting to find out.

Reply to
Oily

In article , Oily writes

Yes. I Googled last night to try to find the current price (couldn't), and discovered that Zeus have gone a bit coy on their web site - I'm sure there was more detail available last time I looked.

The Oz stuff seems to be quite recent. I saw comments about lubrication and that Zeus have a new casing available that allows engine oil to the gears. I've a feeling this wasn't available originally, but ICBW.

It's still way too expensive for me, although a good idea in principle.

Reply to
SpamTrapSeeSig

200-tdi :: 4 Cylinder, Injector Pump Turbo Diesel, 107bhp in a defender, 111bhp in a discovery. Rubber Band Timing Belt.

300-tdi :: 4 Cylinder, Injector Pump Turbo Diesel (Later models had an ECU system), 111bhp in all forms. Rubber Band Timing Belt.

td5 :: 5 Cylinder, ECU Driven Common Rail Turbo Diesel, 139BHP in the Discovery form. Chain Timing Belt.

The 300-tdi is a very solid engine, and a vast improvement over the 200- tdi. The td5 is a step in a different direction, but gives much more power and an extra cylinder to the vehicle, also the chain timing belt is more reliable. Owned both, driven all 3. TD5 every time :)

Reply to
Alex Threlfall

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