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Should TD5 fuel pump, pump out if the filter is removed and key to II?

Hi,

I've gone through I think all the posts but cannot find the answer to these questions.

  1. Should TD5 fuel pump, pump out if the filter is removed and key to II on a Discovery TD5 (December 2002)?

  1. Where do I find the best access to the electrical feed to the pump?

  2. It is not obvious to me how I access the fuel pump. Do I need to drop the tank? I read a post suggesting that it should be possible to do it through the floor but it is a 7 seater late 2002 model and the interior seams like it will be more work to remove than dropping the tank!

  1. Can the tank be dropped enough to gain access to terminals or connector for the pump to check for a voltage without disconnecting all the pipe work?

The reason I ask is:

I have what appears to be a common issue with my TD5 Discovery. It has developed a stutter as if suffering from fuel starvation and got worse over a week of short runs.

Got a new fuel filter and thought I'd check to see if the fuel pumped out was clean whilst the old filter was off. To my surprise no fuel was pumped out when the key is at II. I thought to prime these things we turn the key to II for ~30sec then off for ~15, six times.

Fitted the new filter and hope there is a pressure / safety check to stop fuel being pumped out.

I went through the motions - turn key to II for ~30sec then off for ~15, six times and it starts, however, then it stops after 5mins of tick-over and a run up and down a 20m driveway.

Now it will not start.

There is some fuel in the filter now, but could the engine have drawn this through? Perhaps this is how it has been just about running this week until now.

Tried starting as if run out off fuel and the engine check lamp comes on after 4/5 seconds and sometimes the rear suspension lamp, accompanied with chimes!

What I have done so far:

Checked ECU looms for oil. No oil, assuming okay!

Checked waste-gate - not seized assuming okay!

Checked for pump sound in tank - no sound - probably not a good sign as I've read you should be able to hear it.

Checked the pump fuse OK

Checked inertia switch OK

Checked the relay OK

Checked feed to relay coil OK

Feed to relay switch = 12v wrt gnd

When switching the ignition key the relay operates as I would expect.

Swapped relay to wiper circuit and wipers still work

Feed to the pump is open circuit at the relay switch.

This to my mind suggests

The wire is broken to the pump, or a connector failure, or the pump has had it, or there is another electrical component between the pump and the relay that I am unaware of.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Rend

Reply to
Rend
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Reply to
Dave Liquorice

Rather a lot of detailed information asked for, too much for a newsgroup post I feel. Wander over to eBay and get yourself a workshop manual for your model for a few quid. Search for without the angle brackets.

You should be able to hear the pump running at switch on before starting, provided it's been switched off for a while, presumably at least the 15s mentioned before.

Reply to
Dave Liquorice

If you've checked the pump relay, and it's OK, AND you haven't done any work which could have disturbed the wiring to the pump, then there is no particular reason to think that the wiring itself is faulty.

It is most likely, to my mind, that the pump itself is duff, particularly if the poor running has been developing for some time.

The fact that you cannot hear any noise from the pump is pretty conclusive - just be sure that you have done nothing to possibly affect the integrity of the pump wiring.

Cheers,

Graeme.

Rend wrote:

ETC.

Reply to
Graeme Evans

Hi, my fuel pump went so I got a new one and its fine now. Access the pump by lifting the carpet in the boot. Take off the plastic trim running across the floor at the tailgate end. Lift out the carpet and you will find a circular plate in the middle of the floor. Remove the plate and you have access to the pump. Disconnect the pipes and connectors carefully and withdraw the complete pump. Replace with new one and put everthing back. Once you have done this, start her up. Be ready for a mass of black smoke as she catches on. Once running (she might take a bit of cranking until the fuel comes through), she will sort herself out. Shouldn't throw up any faults on T4.

The reason she ran lumpy is because if the pump is shot, she will be pulling through fuel on vacuum and so the fuel injection will be suffering.

Good luck.

Reply to
b.baskerville

Thanks all. To close the post, it was the pump.

If anyone else new to Discovery TD5 has a similar problem, here is my experience

In the workshop manual it tells you to access the pump though the floor, but it also tells you to remove the RHD 6th/7th seat and this requires a special tool to be fabricated to keep the springs in place, and to remove the interior side panels.

To avoid the interior requirements I tried to drop the tank to access the pump but the pump pipes did not have any slack, so I had to go back to the floor method. I tried removing the carpet at the tie down point and it turned out that on my model (Dec 02) the carpet/sound insulation can be removed without removing the 6th/7th seat and interior side panels.

It's a shame I didn't try this first but it's my first expensive Land Rover (just out of the Land Rover dealer warranty) and I didn't want to risk messing up the interior.

I was surprised that the td5 would run at all with no pressure in the system. I assume the injectors electronically switch open without the need for pressure and hence the engine draws the fuel though while open.

Reply to
Rend

Hi the engine will not "Draw" the fuel in but the injectors are pumps themselves (powered by the cam shaft) and so will allow the engine to run at a much reduced performance.

Reply to
Marc Draper

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