repair costs on lexus vs. mercedes

I wish I could cross-post too. The lousy AOL newsreader doesn't support cross-posting.

FWIW, you might be interested to know that the 2000 ES 300 Platinum Edition I bought a little over a month ago was traded-in by someone who decided to buy a pre-owned MB S-class.

IMO, the age deteriorates a car more than mileage for the better built vehicles. I believe there were significant changes in 1997, so if you looking at something older, a V6 Camry (with VIN beginning with "JT") of the same vintage would be better value for the money in my opinion.

You say the V6 Camry is 192HP. But

says all V6 Camrys are 210HP.

If I recall correctly, many years ago, there was a Class Action suit that alleged that 90% of the Lexus ES 250 and the Toyota V6 Camry were identical: parts, etc. But the Lexus cost significantly more.

Why was there a suit about that?

I think a valid reason to file a suit has diminished over time. But one school of thought suggests that if you paid significantly more for an identical product that was merely marketed as a superior product (thereby deceiving you that it was a superior product), you have been ripped off. But that's just my opinion as a non-lawyer.

Not sure about the GM or Ford vehicles, but do they

1. use identical parts (maybe 90+% similar), and
2. market one as being better/superior to the other, and
3. sell one at a much higher price than the other?

1. Yes
2. Yes
3. Yes

If you are posting from the US have you been living under a rock? Or, are you a 12 year old?

Sales people of expensive stuff can be remarkably candid if the mood strikes them. I recall a salesman/audiophile in a high end store I was in who bemoaned the death of high-end audio and the fact that the only really profitable part of their business was selling big bucks home theater installations to doctors and other professionals who were building expensive new houses and who only really cared that the audio system blended into the decor and was assembled from pricey brand components, but cared little about how the system actually sounded. I think this description captures the sentiments of the typical (not all) BMW/MB customer in this country quite well.

It is your prerogative to pay more to purchase an identical product. But I (and a lot of other people) wouldn't, and if I was deceived into believing that it was a better product worth paying more for when it wasn't, I'd rather see my money go to a Class Action attorney than a Auto maker.

Grl,

If I were you, I would ride on a MB before you make a comment. It's something not pen + words can tell how safe and proud you feel when you are riding on MB. You will find that Japanese cars are just the toys comparing to a real solid car.

Casper

GRL wrote:

reliability is

I agree. As I said before, if you can't tell the difference between the ride of an eclass and a low end lexus, you should buy a lexus, and you should probably be on a different board.

The Lexus LS cars are no doubt comparable, but at least give me at least some styling if you want me to plunk down that much cash....

Some of us like cars for the way they ride/handle AND the way they look. We appreciate the classic design, and I don't think there's anything timless about a Lexus........

Of course some might disagree....

reliability is

The price for the 124.133 is about $8000 pending condition. It is the most reliable 124 one could own. No tune ups, wires, plugs, etc. and great mileage. It is also a tank which would save your life even if you were hit broadside by a car going 50mph! It will go 400,000 miles before major expense (replacing the head).Parts are not expensive (from Rusty Cullen at

800-741-5252) and the car is easy to work on unless you deal with mechanics who only fix American cars. It can be kept almost new in terms of ride if o.e. shocks are replaced with new Bilsteins. It rides better and shifts better if the "H" fitting at the end of the hose coming off the vacuum pump (front of engine) is replaced with an "F" fitting (part#601-078-06-45) and the two left vacuum tube are deleted. This will increase the vacuum substantially. Both cars require minimal maintenance but the turbo gets better mileage is more durable. I would keep the Mercedes. Why buy acopy when you own an original? P.

I think they're comparing Lexus to modern gasoline Mercedes cars.

You can't compare ANYTHING to the older diesel cars.

The problem is that, OK, maybe SOME Mercedes engines are still bulletproof....but all of the electronics are still temperamental and costly to maintain/repair while that engines supposedly goes 400,000 miles.

At 65,000 miles, that was what was happening on my 99 S420. The engine and drive train were bulletproof, but the heater/air conditioning had to be replaced, the hydraulic vacuums for the doors had to be replaced, and the trunk had stopped functioning again, the S.R.S. light had come on and the quote was $140 to diagnose, and repairs possibly in the thousands.

All stuff that could be fixed, but if you have to pay a mechanic (as I do) then it is thousands of dollars. I turned mine into an Audi S8 with an extended warrranty, and got a much faster, much better handling, more comfortable, better appointed car (2002 model). Quite happy with the changeover.

We then got a Lexus RX330 for my wife, and she couldn't be happier. Intellichoice, Consumer Reports, and so on, give Lexus very high marks for reliability. Much better than modern Mercedes.

I don't think I'll be back to a Mercedes. We'll see how the Audi holds up. Since it is an S8, which was the top of their line in 2002 it might do better than other Audis, which have about the same reputation as modern Mercedes, except that Audi seems to be on its way "up" and Mercedes seems to be on its way "down" the reliability scales.

Lexus remains very solid.

um, you'll see that your evaluation isn't quite on the mark.

Audi HAS BEEN worse than MB, for a long time. And remains so.