I am considering getting a 3 yer old 156 with up to 60K om the clock, but many people recommend avoiding alfas all together. Are they really as unreliable as some say and if this is true are there common faults to look out for ?
They're only unreliable if the previous owner can't be arsed to check the oil level. The TSpark engines generally drink a fair bit - 1/2 litre per 1k miles isn't uncommon.
Buying around 60k miles is probably the worst time to buy one. Get something that's done 80k miles and you can be sure the cambelt etc. has been changed..... or get enough knocked off a 60k mile example to have the job done (Budget 300 quid from an independent specialist).
Depending on where you are,
No they aren't - I've had a number of Alfas and the only one that was dodgy was one I bought with the intention of doing up. The rust problems of yesteryear have stayed there.
Myself, I'd prefer the 2.0 or 2.5 and would avoid a selespeed gearchange. Cambelt changes must be done prior to them being needed as per the recommended servicing schedule. (Worth the cash for peace of mind)
Please feel free to drive the car - once your test drive has finished you will be about to become an Alfa owner - they have something about them that will make you want to buy, fill the tank and go drive....... Your head may say 'Volvo estate' but your heart really wants the Alfa......
Yes, it happened to me too! (Several times)
Artie
IME, the cars are fine. It's the dealers that are crap. If you're going to be doing your own maintenance, 156s are as reliable as anything else.
Cheers,
Colin.
Alfa's are just cars that more sensitive to poor maintenance. That's all.
Not really answering your question in any recognisable way, but I drove past an immaculate 1990 164 this afternoon. One of those cars that you double-take at - it looked in fairly excellent nick for an H reg anything. Who said Alfas were all rusty piles of s**te? :o)
The 164 was the first galvanised Alfa, they've lasted very well.
Well, as somebody that worked with them for 6 years, and nearly left the trade altogether because of them, I can say with some authority - yes!
However, the biggest problem we had was customer's expectations. If you know what you're buying, they aren't too bad. They are crap as a family care to be relied on though. You definitely buy with your heart and not with your head.
Common faults are:
Cambelt failures - or more correctly, the failure of the tensioner pulleys. Sometimes also the water pump. The belt hardly ever failed on their own, but as a result of a component failure. The general recommendation is to change them at 48k, most failures are in the mid
50's.Camshaft variator. These control the variable inlet timing, and can often be heard at startup as a strange rattle. They will affect performance if left.
The inlet manifold on the later one's can explode. They are made of plastic.
As others have said, they do drink oil. Normally a sump full between services. Personally I'd recommend a good mineral or semi-synthetic oil and change it every 6000 miles.
I have seen catastrophic engine failures due to running low on oil, even some time after the event. I've also seen some let go for no apparent reason, inspection of the con rods revealed that one stud was totally intact, but no nut on it.
Make sure that all recalls have been done, some can result of more expensive failures. There is one on a few out there where they drilled the head bolt holes too shallow, and had to fit shorter bolts post-production.
Rear brake calipers are very common for seizing up. Normally noticed with a high pitch squeal after about 30 minutes of driving. Can usually be sorted by stripping the rear calipers, cleaning off all the rust, and resetting correctly (they were never set right at factory).
Brake wear is high on these. Expect pads and discs all round by 36k.
Rear suspension bushes wear as well, again every 36k (does involve replacing some arms too).
Don't even start on electrics, it's Italian, nuff said. However, various wiring faults, control unit failures, and alarm failures (they put the siren under the N/S/F wheel arch!) are quite common, as are faults with the immobiliser systems. Air bag faults are common too, usually side bags in the seats - normally requires air bag, loom and ECU to fix.
Avoid a V6, these jump teeth on the timing belts, and also suck up water from large puddles (and knackers the engine). You also need to remove the R/H track arm to remove the oil filter.
Oh yes, if you get the one's with the Sport Pack (skirts and lowered suspension), expect high tyre wear too - like 7000 miles for front tyres.
That's just a list I made doing warranty claims (£160k per year) and dealing at front counter.
Lovely alternative to a boring Bee-Emm or Merc if your company is responsible for looking after it, risky private buy. Look at the breakdown surveys.
Agreed, a 164 Ts would be a very good choice.
I'm desperately torn between a V6 24v and a TSpark at the moment.
The TSpark is very cheap, in exceptional condition and just down the road. But it's a base model.
The 24v is absolutely loaded with everything other than leather, is a bit more expensive, in equally good condition, but it's an auto andin Birmingham.
Hmmmm.
Yes.
And it's a 24v.
I like the 24v ones.
Then again, I have a tame Alfa mechanic who's cheap and quick.
Things are definitely favouring the 24v. My local mechanic is pretty good with everything and is also cheap.
It's only just had replacement belts and has a full history, so I reckon that might well be my next car.
It's a nice engine, until you go through standing water, or the rear bank inlet cam decides to jump a couple of teeth.
That helps. Not many tame ones left ;-)
OK, I'll chance the standing water thing, but, in reality, how likely is it that the rear belt will jump if you're changing them every 36k miles?
(I know the book says 60k for them, but I'm not stupid).
Yes, you'll probably minimise the chances there. Not a cheap job though.
You could probably modify the intake to avoid the water problem too (a K&N kit maybe?).
I can live with that. It's only every 2-3 years afterall. That's if I manage to keep it that long.
The autobox worries me more, though.
Good plan.
Looks like that's what I'll be going for, then. Shame it's a PITA place to get to from here (Tamworth), but it's an Alfa specialist selling it, which is better than buying from any old dealer.
Why? Didn't they give you a good living?
Many of these things retail well over £20,000 so I'd expect customer expectations to be high.
Mine's been utterly reliable - I guess your experience is mainly with ones that have problems.
True. There is a strange satisfaction to be had if you pull it off.
Petrols?
Petrols.
Wow! Never heard of that one.
Petrols. The top-up can (2l) I bought 4.5 years ago is about to rust away. It's over half full and the stuff I did use was before the first service - nothing since.
I can only find 3 recalls 2 for brake pipes and one for suspension. How would an ordinary punter find out if there are others?
True. Once sorted, mine have gone for 4 years without attention.
Depends on use. I expect to get about 50k in mixed driving from mine. Didn't stop my Garage making assumptions on the wear at the 36,000 service only to correct them on a second examination.
..ALL the suspension bushes wear on these..don't they?
Mine's been perfect. 4.5 year old 2.4 JTD Veloce.
Never heard of these ones, mind you, I deliberately avoided all the petrol Alfas!!
A new alignment spec was introduced in 2002 that cured this. My tyres were heading for replacement at 12,000 miles then due to this but the re-alignment was done at 9,000 miles and the tyres went on to reach
30,000 miles.What about the Selespeeds? I'm amazed you forgot those!
Rubbish.
On the whole, any problems are caused by numpty owners.
MotorsForum website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.