Name these engines (and problems).

Hi all,

Sonny Jim and I have been looking at a few runabouts for him today.

Car 1:

03 Fusion 2, 1.6, 89K miles and whilst it looked pretty clean it had quite a pronounced engine tapping noise?

Looking through the service history we found mention of 'hydraulic lifter treatment'?

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Is this 'treatment' just a kludge and if so what should / could be done to do a proper job of it?

It looks and sounds like this when running ... (64MB file if it works)

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Car 2:

04 Meriva 1.7 CDTi, 150K miles. It was showing an 'Engine inspection light' (is it called) and running my Torque app suggested it was something along the lines of 'Glow plug Cct A, P0380'. Is this an issue? Expensive / difficult to fix please?

This is the engine if it helps anyone pin it down (is this the Vauxhall rather than the Izuzu lump)?

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Cheers, T i m

Reply to
T i m
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In message , T i m writes

I'm a bit rusty on the more recent Ford engines but I thought the 1.6 Duratec in the Fusion was Zetec based and had shim adjustment on the lifters.

Reply to
Paul Giverin

autodata agrees, no hydraulic lifters.

Reply to
Mrcheerful

Ooerr (thanks both) so it's a strip and re shim then, no magic 'hydraulic lifter treatment' is going to fix that.

So, at 89k miles, is a fairly loud 'tapperty noise' typical and does it just suggest a re-shim is required or is it indicative of something more severe?

Cheers, T i m

p.s. I've just asked him to check and it's a 53 (not 03) in case that makes any difference?

Reply to
T i m

Thanks for sharing.

I know you would.

Cheers, T i m

Reply to
T i m

I really can't think of many more hateful and depressing heaps to be saddled with.

Unless you're buying for an 80 year old, I'd have to ask 'why?'

Reply to
SteveH

it indicates a severe lack of oil changes and worn out cams

Reply to
Mrcheerful

It's indicative of it either being badly serviced or lying about it's mileage. But mainly suggests you find another one.

Reply to
Duncan Wood

Noted (Thanks MrC / Duncan).

Cheers, T i m

Reply to
T i m

Car 1) shims on the zetec se engine. "lifter treatment" snake oil will do diddly squat for it. Can't listen to the sound byte. If the tapping is at half engine speed then suspect a collapsed bucket or worn lobe, something like that. Unusual on this engine though. If at engine speed suspect a broken piston ring- much more common, but so is a fairly unhealthy oil consumption too!

Car 2) Firstly obviously check each glowplug for continuity. Then check you have a sensible coolant temp reading in live data. 3rd- have a good look at the wiring under the battery tray. The wiring for the glow plugs runs under here and well known for the factory clips not to, and the loom chafs on a bracket. 3rd- suspect glow plug relay f*cked.

Reply to
Tim..

Ok.

Quite. I wasn't impressed when I saw it mention in the SH.

In case it was too big / whatever I've just Handbraked it down a bit smaller if it helps (it's a video clip off my phone).

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I think it's at that rate. 'Cammy' (like a Caviler) . ;-)

Ah, well, I think it needs a better ear than mine then, to be sure.

Sub 1 ohm?

It was climbing but it was a cold day etc.

There seemed to be a fountain of wires around there? ;-)

Understood.

Ok. ;-)

Good tips, thanks very much Tim.

We are holding off both vehicles since asking (and getting the replies) here and thinking back. The Focus was also missing the drivers door mirror control and whilst the panel itself could well be not too expensive, faulty electric mirrors might be?

The diesel Meriva ... we aren't sure in general. It started and ran ok (he took us round the block), no smoke, ran / stopped well, no clonks from underneath etc). However, we had the engine light thing, the OBD port fell though it's bracket with no effort and the cap of the socket itself was loose / broken. This suggested to me that it had seen some use? The sockets on all our existing cars (and all those I've ever looked at) all looked new. The towing eye was in the drivers door pocket. When laddo asked the seller said 'it was clonking about in the boot'. Or was it was used to tow or be towed (on that or the petrol Meriva he also had for sale) and it hadn't been put back? Rear wiper wasn't self parking.

Now, being realistic this was a 10 year old car with 150K on the clock so I'm guessing you would expect such things (although you won't find them on any of our equally old / high mileage cars as have always dealt with them)?

I think he's found another (newer) Astra Estate (1.7 CDTi) for a bit more money and he is off next week so we can do some easier running about.

Thanks very much again.

Cheers, T i m

Reply to
T i m

Where the hell are you looking at these motors at? Local Arthur Daley back alley establishment of dubious reputation!? ;-p

Reply to
Tim..

Autotrader mainly, but when you don't have a lot of cash you can't generally afford the main dealers. ;-(

What I'm hoping for is that someone we know comes along with something half suitable that he can use for at least now.

Most of our cars have come that way and so far we have been very lucky.

The Rover 218SD was bought at 150K miles for £100 (with 6 months TAX) and I did another 7 years and 50K on it with hardly any expense (and

50 mpg) along the way.

Whilst the Rover wasn't perfect when we got it (it was much better a couple weeks later ) we knew *exactly* what was known about it.

Cheers, T i m

Reply to
T i m

Perhaps you might consider sticking with a petrol powered car? No worry of common rail / injector / DMF etc etc issues. You cant really get any better than a mk2 focus 1.6 or 1.8. Especially the 1.8 will do a huge mileage (if looked after) and pence to fix.

Or astra 1.6 (avoid the twinport flavour though)

Tim..

Reply to
Tim..

Whilst there are some now that do diesel mpgs they aren't generally roomy, without (often expensive) vices and are generally 'not cheap' etc?

Ok.

Funnily enough ... our next_door_neighbour has an 04 1.6 Focus that has not so long ago had a road spring, alternator, fuel pump, battery (luckily I had a newish one that fitted ) and a couple of tyres. I think it's only done 60K and whilst being a bit unloved hasn't been worn out. I don't think he has ever used the back seat or the passenger seat that often. He was talking of getting a new Fiesta so ...

I think sonny Jim still likes the 1.7 CDTi Astra estates, partly because of the room, partly it's still a car (rather than a van) and very much if it does ~50 mpg.

Someone suggested that because diesel is more expensive than petrol the 'difference' in fuel cost / mile these days wasn't so clear. However (and assuming my maths is ok) a petrol car doing say 35 mpg and petrol at £1.35/l would do ~40 miles less on 20 quids worth than a diesel doing 50 mpg costing £1.45/l?

40 miles is quite a way when we are only talking 20 quids worth and that 'cost will be with him every day going to work (40 mile round trip)?

However, I guess these savings could easily be consumed if something expensive goes wrong but then wouldn't that also be the case with many modern cars?

Cheers, T i m

Reply to
T i m
[...]

Forget the tyres and battery; they are consumables on any make/model. The spring is down to the state of our roads; worse now than many mainland European countries.

So that makes it an alternator, and a fuel pump. On a car approaching its

10th birthday.

Sounds pretty good to me.

The latest Fiesta is nearer in size to a Mk1 Focus than the latest Focus, and it's what I would go for if looking to buy a new car, so your neighbour clearly has a lot of sense. ;-)

FWIW, unless I was buying new *and* covering at least 20K miles a year, I wouldn't entertain a diesel; they just don't make financial sense otherwise.

The suggestion of a petrol Focus is a good one. There are plenty to choose from! They need a cam belt at 100K/10years, so the cost of that needs to be factored in.

Chris

Reply to
Chris Whelan

Sure, but still possibly of note to sweeten a deal?

Understood.

I think a bit of wiring was needed around the alternator and I can't remember if there was anything else. They were just the recent(ish) things.

Yup, me too. ;-)

He he. Yeah, I though it sounded like a downsize but seeing them on the road made me realise they aren't (as you suggest).

Butbutbut ... The Focus would do what, 40 mpg and many diesels will do

50? isn't that a 20% improvement in mpg (ignoring the slight difference in fuel cost etc)?

All I know is I went from a 2G GL Sierra estate to a Rover 218SD and was suddenly doing TWICE the distance for the same cost? I know that going from the Rover to the 1.6 Meriva means I'm now going (quite a bit) less distance for my 20 quid than I was? I'm not saying all petrol cars are less economical than all diesel cars, just that in general, diesel seem to do better £/mile? Is it just that diesels 'can' be more expensive to fix?

Understood.

Bottom line, if something half useable comes along, especially if it's 'known' and it does ~40 mpg on average then he'll take it.

I'll have a chat with the guy next door and see what he's doing.

Cheers, T i m

Reply to
T i m
[...]

Yep, but fuel is not the most significant factor in most owner's budget.

Your situation might be different as it seems you tend to buy older vehicles, and keep them for as long as possible. (Nothing wrong with that, but it's not what most folk do.)

I need to declare an interest (or a lack of one!). I've never driven a diesel that I truly enjoyed. They just don't suit the way I drive. (Of course, there will be an equal number of drivers who prefer them.) That notwithstanding, I know of so many people that have had issues with modern diesels that have cost significant amounts of money to put right, that the total cost of running their cars has been significantly higher than if they'd bought a petrol.

There's lots to go wrong with modern cars, but it seems diesels suffer more. Maybe that's because the technology is a bit newer, or because they are a bit more complex? Perhaps the electronics are more readily damaged by vibration?

There is information available from various organisations who have costed these issues out; my 20K/yr came from research done by the AA, for example. There seems to be a fairly general consensus that the TCO of a diesel may well be higher than a petrol.

Chris

Reply to
Chris Whelan

If you have a reasonable knowledge of the basics of cars, it's well worth going to one of the better auctions. At least you know what you're getting there and can decide on the basis of the individual car - not a dealer warranty or whatever. And set aside the money saved for any necessary repairs or replacements. This is how most cars are sourced by secondhand car dealers - so why not just cut out the middle man?

However, all the usual tricks of making a car appear good on the surface - like a good valet and polish, slicking up the tyres, changing the oil, and fitting new pedal rubbers, and so on, are also known by those trying to pull a fast one. Far better to go for an honest car with a genuine service history - perhaps in the 'wrong' colour and with some battle scars - than one with the highest 'forecourt' appeal.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

Oh, ok.

Ok.

(I also bought a brand new vehicle, the Sierra, (or the company did) and I kept that for 23 years). ;-)

Nor had I till I got the Rover and I certainly didn't like the way it handled. A new set of tyres at least stopped it being lethal. ;-)

I wouldn't say I preferred them Chris, but I do enjoy the high mpg they seem to offer. But then I've always been a utilitarian driver, if it gets me from A to B, cheaply and reliably then that is fine by me. Don't get me wrong, I do 'like' a car that drives and handles well but round here (Norf Lundin) there is little chance of enjoying such, plus the cost of fuel these days I tend to combine trips wherever possible etc. The only time I drive for 'fun' (ie, without any real purpose) is when I take the kitcar out for a spin but even that happens rarely these days.

Ah, that was what I thought you might say. I only have personal experience of the 1.9 Pug lump that was in the Rover and apart from a small leak from the throttle arm on the fuel injector pump it never put a foot wrong in the 50,000 miles I did in it. Further, twice I drove it home ~20 miles with no water in it (two split hoses) and it didn't seem to suffer for it. But then that lump seem to be known as indestructible?

Could be.

Thanks for that Chris, all noted.

I guess with any thing though it's that 'may be' bit. Like my Rover, sold to me for £100 because the previous owner was fed up spending money on it. I had it for 7 years / 50k and hardly spent a penny on ithe thing. The Sierra cost me £25 (my Company car, bought off them when I left when it was about 10 years old) and kept for a further 13 years. Similar with the £350 Belmont 1.4 (was Dads, then went to a niece, then us), the 45k Meriva (given to us by Mum when Dad died) and daughters Corsa 1.2, bought off her b/f dad for £200 and nearly earned itself back in the first few trips from Scotland to London (his Hi-Lux cost £90 in petrol v £40 in the Corsa).

I guess if you are 'into cars' (or a car snob, and I'm not suggesting you are such of course ) you might be more bothered about what you drive, but for us it really is a box to get you from A to B and whilst we don't mind the home comforts (aircon, PAS etc), we somehow managed without them for all those years. The electric windows, PAS, aircon never went wrong on the Sierra because it didn't have them. ;-)

Maybe we (all 4 of us) are actually 'bikers' as the only time any of us really 'enjoy' getting from A to B is when on two wheels (in the right weather and for the right reasons of course, we aren't mad). ;-)

Cheers, T i m

p.s. Both the Mrs and I built the kitcar some 30 years ago and I think I'm still happier doing work on that (real stuff, like changing the gearbox, not poncing about with trim etc) than driving it. ;-)

Reply to
T i m

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