A little long before firing up - family trademark or is my car a little sick?

I find that when starting my 1999 NB 1.8 it takes about a second before the engine fires up. Or to put in different words it takes just slightly long enough for me to notice and think "Huh!".

This seems to be regardless of ambient temperatures and only if the car has been out running within the hour or so it fires up straight away.

Voltage on the battery is fine and I can hear the starter turning at what I think is normal speed so my guess is that fuel supply is the issue. When I had the car at is' first major service (60K miles) in the summer the mechanic reported the issue was a family trademark but still it bugs me a little.

I run the 95 RON gas around on the car and fuel quality is generally of high standards so that should be fine.

Any thoughts?

Kind regards Bruno

Reply to
Bruno
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Does it matter how long the car has been sitting or is it the same every time you start it?

Reply to
XS11E

Bruno, I've noticed a very similar tendency with my 99 and have even asked the question here w/o much response IIRC. I've been concerned that this could be the early stages of a fuel pump problem. Mine hasn't gotten much worse in the (relatively) colder weather so, I'm not sure. Maybe someone will chime in with something useful this time.

Chris

99BBB
Reply to
Chris D'Agnolo

On my 99 which does the same thing, I believe that it's related to the cam and or crankshaft sensors. It seems to take a bit for the ECU to sort out the sensor signals.

Reply to
Chuck

Probably not a bad thing. Gives the oil pump time to prime before any significant load is placed on bearing surfaces.

Reply to
Mal Osborne

It does seem like the firing up takes longer if the car has been parked a few days rather than say just one day but the difference is not a huge one. Maybe I should try and time it somehow or perhaps even record it. I shall try and report in more detail.

Kind regards Bruno

Reply to
Bruno

Makes sense I guess. Still it does not sound good and sort of bugs me.

I wonder if the car did it when it was new? (I only bought mine a year ago so I can't say except that it has been like that since day one).

Actually come to think of it I bought mine a year ago on the day!

It has been a good year. Something like 6000 miles and just $10.000 running costs so I'm a happy motorist :-)

Kind regards Bruno

Reply to
Bruno

These may both be correct but as Bruno mentioned; it's a bit worrisome when the thing sounds like it might not start occasionally. Sometimes I end up letting off the key and giving it a second go. It's never failed on the second try to fire right up but I still get that sinking feeling that this might be the first time.

Chris

99BBB
Reply to
Chris D'Agnolo

I don't know if it's important. I was thinking if it started right up after running awhile but took a long time after sitting overnight a leaky valve in the fuel pump might be allowing fuel to drain back into the tank so there wouldn't be enough pressure in the fuel rail for an instant start but that seems unlikely if it's not a big difference.

Looking at real obvious stuff.... how old are the spark plugs and plug wires?

Reply to
XS11E

Hmm, it sounds like a possible theory. If one imagines there is only so far the fuel can drain back it could very well be that certain level of delay is reached after like a day or so and that the level won't change much more regardless of time. This is total speculation on my part as I really know to little about these things.

Plugs was changed at the big service this summer but that did not change anything. The plug wires could be the original 1999 ones or they could be little more than a year old - I must admit to buying a car without a service history so many things are pure guess work.

Kind regards Bruno

Reply to
Bruno

The pressure in the fuel rail is around 35 - 40psi for most cars, if the pressure drops too far the car can't start until the pressure comes back up which is why I was asking about the time involved. *IF* one of the check valves in the pump isn't seating properly the bleedback could be very slow...

Stick on new wires, you MAY see an inprovement if they're old or at the very least you'll have a starting date for future changes.

You can test the wiring if you can find a very dark night or very dark place to park, just start the car, raise the hood and watch around the plug wires for pretty blue sparkles, if you see any the wires are bad.

Reply to
XS11E

It may help to turn the key to on for a few moments before you turn it to the start position. Turning to the start position without pressing on the clutch (assuming the clutch start lockout switch is still functional) may also make a difference.

Reply to
Chuck

Worth trying for sure. I shall report back if it makes a difference.

Kind regards Bruno

Reply to
Bruno

Some of the 99's had a problem with the pressure relief valve/regulator in the tank leaking down. Unfortunately, the factory leakdown test only detected gross leak down problems, not ones that might occur over more than

24hours. In any event, a revised replacement valve was made, and should be what you will get if you order a new one. I still think the no return line system used on the 99 and later NB's is a mistake. Replacing the valve requires normal hand tools, an open well vented area away from any source of ignition, and reasonably high humidity. The top must be up, and the rear deck rug and access plate removed. The whole fuel pump/tank sensor/regulator assembly comes out from the top of the tank as a unit. Some of the roll bars may be in the way.

The easiest way to measure fuel pressure > >

Reply to
Chuck

Great info + thank you for the effort.

Seems like something I might give a go once we get more humane tempratures (like above freezing).

Kind regards Bruno

Reply to
Bruno

No difference I can notice. To bad.

Kind regards Bruno

Reply to
Bruno

Have a read to this:

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Reply to
Joaquín Topiso

Joaquin, Thanks for the info. I hadn't seen that. What do you think Bruno? Do you have the ability to check this yourself or are you willing to pay somebody to check it out?

Keep us posted, Chris

99BBB
Reply to
Chris D'Agnolo

all; it is said that they have in themselves a source of movement to shun the void. Have they arms, legs, muscles, nerves?

  1. To write against those who made too profound a study of science: Descartes.

  1. I cannot forgive Descartes. In all his philosophy he would have been quite willing to dispense with God. But he had to make Him give a fillip to set the world in motion; beyond this, he has no further need of God.

  2. Descartes useless and uncertain.

  1. Descartes.--We must say summarily: "This is made by figure and motion," for it is true. But to say what these are, and to compose the machine, is ridiculous. For it is useless, uncertain, and painful. And were it true, we do not think all Philosophy is worth one hour of pain.

  2. How comes it that a cripple does not offend us, but that a fool does? Because a cripple recognises that we walk straight, whereas a fool declares that it is we who are silly; if it were not so, we should feel pity and not anger.

Epictetus asks still more strongly: "Why are we not angry if we are told that we have a headache, and why are we angry if we are told that we reason badly, or choose wrongly"? The reason is that we are quite certain that we have not a headache, or are not lame, but we are not so sure that we make a true choice. So, having assurance only because we see with our whole sight, it puts us into suspense and surprise when another with his whole sight sees the opposite, and still more so when a thousand others deride our choice. For we must prefer our own lights to those of so many others, and that is bold and difficult. There is never this contradiction in the feelings towards a cripple.

  1. It
Reply to
Joaquín Topiso

accompanies man till death and will not return at the resurrection.

And on Psalm 103 the same thing.

And on Psalm 16.

Principles of Rabbinism: two Messiahs.

447. Will it be said that, as men have declared that righteousness has departed the earth, they therefore knew of original sin?--Nemo ante obitum beatus est[72]--that is to say, they knew death to be the beginning of eternal and essential happiness?

448. Milton sees well that nature is corrupt and that men are averse to virtue; he does not know why they cannot fly higher.

449. Order.--After Corruption to say: "It is right that all those who are in that state should know it, both those who are content with it, and those who are not content with it; but it is not right that all should see Redemption."

450. If we do not know ourselves to be full of pride, ambition, lust, weakness, misery, and injustice, we are indeed blind. And if, knowing this, we do not desire deliverance, what can we say of a man...?

What then, can we have but esteem for a religion which knows so well the defects of man, and desire for the truth of a religion which promises remedies so desirable?

451. All men naturally hate one another. They employ lust as far as possible in the service of the public weal. But this is only a pretnece and a false image of love; for at bottom it is only hate.

452. To pity the unfortunate is not contrary to lust. On the contrary, we can quite well give such evidence of friendship, and acquire the reputation of kindly feeling, without giving anything.

453. From lust men have found and extracted excellent rules of policy, morality, and justice; but in reality this vile root of man, this figmentum malum, is only covered, it is not taken away.

454. Injustice.--They have not found any other means of satisfying lust without doing injury to others.

455. Self is hateful. You, Milton, conceal it; you do not for that re
Reply to
Chris D'Agnolo

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